Suck it, you 121 hacks

Kingairer

'Tiger Team' Member
Yes it is.

Had an AA JSer hired in 1998 who is willingly a senior widebody FO instead of a 320/737 CA. Dreamliner, flies 3 trips a month that were 3 days LAX-PVG (or was it HKG). 9 days of work, 21-22 days off.

Oh the horror, quick let me retire from making $250k having 21-22 days off to 30-31 days off making $0! :rolleyes:
250s probably a little light. I still wouldn’t want that stuff though.
 

Inverted

The journey is the meat in the goal sandwich
Of course he'll stay on til 65. Pilots are liars kidding themselves for the most part when it comes to retirement. They all say they'll punch out before 65, but the reasons you just wrote is exactly why they stay on: already barely working, lose out on pay, super senior, work when they want and how little they want, etc.
We say we are going to retire before 65 because we assume we are going to work as hard then as we work now. Once you get around that age, you are hopefully barely working hard enough to justify leaving another couple mil on the table.
 

GypsyPilot

Well-Known Member
Denial is a powerful thing...


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Meh. I’ve seen the red eyes, early shows, and long duty days at Alaska... I work way less than you guys do. I struggle to stay proficient, and am WAY more rested than my pax airline days.
 

BEEF SUPREME

Well-Known Member
Meh. I’ve seen the red eyes, early shows, and long duty days at Alaska... I work way less than you guys do. I struggle to stay proficient, and am WAY more rested than my pax airline days.
All good man. I’m happy for you. I’ve only been here a short time and I’m avoiding most of that stuff too. I’m usually just flying one XC leg a day leaving around mid day. I’m happy.


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Crop Duster

E pluribus unum
I’m really lucky I got a taste of 91 jet flying shortly before going 121. I probably would have always wondered if I never flew 91. Now I know...and knowledge is power. Even at my rinky dink regional, most of the drama is self induced, so the more laid back you are, the fewer the required give a damns are. 15 months in, I’ve gotten Thanksgiving, Christmas, and New Years off 2 straight years.
With no intent to comment in any way on the 121 v 135 v 91 debate, I'll just say that an active attempt to not give a damn about anything is precisely the reason most situations, systems, endeavors, etc. devolve to effen' chaos. Entropy is the natural state of affairs; That's precisely why informed and engaged human beings are so critical to... well... everything valuable.

After several generations of self-satisfied dismissal of concern, the great news for crotchety old white guys is... they still get to complain to each other about how effed up everything has become, while directly suffering none of the harmful effects of irony. :bounce:
 
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Inverted

The journey is the meat in the goal sandwich
I have flown 91, 91k and 135. I have flown for the "pinnacle" fractional ownership jet company and I can tell everyone without a doubt, if you like that garbage more than walking in, turning left, sipping coffee and making way more money than any other facet within the industry, you are freaking insane.
 

Cherokee_Cruiser

Well-Known Member
Meh. I’ve seen the red eyes, early shows, and long duty days at Alaska... I work way less than you guys do. I struggle to stay proficient, and am WAY more rested than my pax airline days.
AS schedules are like any other major airline. Your pax airline days? Didn't you go regional to Fedex? If so, regional schedules are absolute crap compared to majors so it's not a fair comparison. Circadian flips and night hub sorts will shorten your lifespan. It's one thing to only do a redeye here or there, but constant night flying (and worse, sitting a 3 hr night hub sort) just jacks up the body long term. I'd be curious to see a post-retirement lifespan comparison of UPS/Fedex compared to the big 5 pax majors?
 

MikeOH58

Well-Known Member
I have flown 91, 91k and 135. I have flown for the "pinnacle" fractional ownership jet company and I can tell everyone without a doubt, if you like that garbage more than walking in, turning left, sipping coffee and making way more money than any other facet within the industry, you are freaking insane.
Just curious, did you fly large cabin business jets? I ask because although not the rule, I think the potential for an amazing career in Part 91 business aviation is significantly increased in a *NEW* Global/Gulfstream/Falcon versus a Citation, Lear, Phenom etc...Yes there are crap jobs flying new large cabin business jets but as I often preach, if you are going to stay in business aviation that is what I would shoot for. New/In-production is key - GIV's, Falcon 900B's etc are a poor rich mans ride these days and employment will likely reflect that.
 

GypsyPilot

Well-Known Member
AS schedules are like any other major airline. Your pax airline days? Didn't you go regional to Fedex? If so, regional schedules are absolute crap compared to majors so it's not a fair comparison. Circadian flips and night hub sorts will shorten your lifespan. It's one thing to only do a redeye here or there, but constant night flying (and worse, sitting a 3 hr night hub sort) just jacks up the body long term. I'd be curious to see a post-retirement lifespan comparison of UPS/Fedex compared to the big 5 pax majors?
I did go from a regional to FedEx. But I also don’t do much of the flying you mentioned above. I haven’t done a night hub turn since new hire IOE.

The thing about this place is that there truly is something for everyone. You can do day flying, long haul international, sweet RFO trips, trips with overnights in your hometown, etc.

The local hometown stuff likely involves some hub turning, but if the trip starts and ends with a DH in you base, you’re basically doing a 3 day that pays like a 5 day. Do three of those a month, and you’re done. There’s a reason we have a lot of ex-Major and Legacy guys here.
 
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Inverted

The journey is the meat in the goal sandwich
Just curious, did you fly large cabin business jets? I ask because although not the rule, I think the potential for an amazing career in Part 91 business aviation is significantly increased in a *NEW* Global/Gulfstream/Falcon versus a Citation, Lear, Phenom etc...Yes there are crap jobs flying new large cabin business jets but as I often preach, if you are going to stay in business aviation that is what I would shoot for. New/In-production is key - GIV's, Falcon 900B's etc are a poor rich mans ride these days and employment will likely reflect that.
I didn't fly anything large cabin, but watching friends in the industry, it seemed like the larger the airplane, the large the suitcase. I can count on one hand the amount of people I know who have better QOL than I do, and I might have fingers left over. There are always exceptions to the rule though, that's for sure.
 

Jordan93

Well-Known Member
Or, you could retire as early as possible, and enjoy life.

65, sorry, you're either paying for a third wife or another boat. Go ASAP and enjoy the fruits of your labor.

You'll never regret it.

(Just my 2 drunken, free bottle of Tito's Vodka, cents)
He’s doing all those things (besides paying for a third wife!) already. If you can’t enjoy life only working 1/3 of the month then that’s a problem. I suppose working 0/3 of the month is better though.
 

BEEF SUPREME

Well-Known Member
I didn't fly anything large cabin, but watching friends in the industry, it seemed like the larger the airplane, the large the suitcase. I can count on one hand the amount of people I know who have better QOL than I do, and I might have fingers left over. There are always exceptions to the rule though, that's for sure.
I flew large cabin and it was the same old. SkyWest didn’t pay as much but at least they treated me like a professional.


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Bob Ridpath

Pit Bull love
I stepped out of a different career at 65 just about six months ago. Did my world traveling in younger days. Have minimal monthly expenses and not a care in the world today.

My monthly expenses run about $2,100. My modest retirement income is just north of $2,650.

My situation in life is just that: mine. Yours are different, for sure.
All I’m sayin’ is that retirement is a damned fine thing. I’d encourage ANYone to do it if it’s a legitimate option as soon as humanly possible:bounce:

YMMV.
 

GypsyPilot

Well-Known Member
I stepped out of a different career at 65 just about six months ago. Did my world traveling in younger days. Have minimal monthly expenses and not a care in the world today.

My monthly expenses run about $2,100. My modest retirement income is just north of $2,650.

My situation in life is just that: mine. Yours are different, for sure.
All I’m sayin’ is that retirement is a damned fine thing. I’d encourage ANYone to do it if it’s a legitimate option as soon as humanly possible:bounce:

YMMV.
Out of curiosity, what do you do for health care and how much does it cost? That’s my biggest concern for retirement.
 

Max Power

Well-Known Member
Did three years of 91/135 in Citation 550/560 around 2010-2013. Worked for a complete nutcase who micromanaged everything (we were a decent sized outfit Citations to G-V at AGC)

I liked the flying, the destinations could be fun and I was 15 minutes from the plane. But the on-demand part, never knowing whether you’d be gone 1 day or 5? Nah. Living in fear of hearing the company provided BlackBerry ring? Nah. Live in fear of the big boss or worse yet, not fear the big boss and therefore never get into “the inner circle”? Nah.

I just want to fly, sir. I show up, do pilot stuff, set brake and go home, as long as I can get there. Commuting for those three years, I did not miss.
 

NovemberEcho

Dergs favorite member
All I’m sayin’ is that retirement is a damned fine thing. I’d encourage ANYone to do it if it’s a legitimate option as soon as humanly possible:bounce:
my parents retired a few years ago and moved to Virginia. My dad spends most of his time on the Appalachian Trail now. He volunteers with a local trail group that does trail maintenance and search and rescue. I’d say he’s enjoying it, he’s gone full Forest Wizard

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