Question for anyone in carrier aviation.

Lawman

Well-Known Member
#21
I'm not sure if there's any evidence this one is working.
All I know is every time I go to a FARP run by Marines all I can think is going back to whatever FOB I came from, loading all the 3/5 guys into a Chinook, and bringing them there to see how it should be done.

I’ve gotten out of my helicopter and screamed at SPC Carl before while running back and forth to stuff rockets into the pod, and they look at me like Eeyore. If I’m outside helping you load ammo and fuel (which is buy isn’t technically illegal) you need to move that ass, because something big is going on.


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Pilot Fighter

Well-Known Member
#22
All I know is every time I go to a FARP run by Marines all I can think is going back to whatever FOB I came from, loading all the 3/5 guys into a Chinook, and bringing them there to see how it should be done.

I’ve gotten out of my helicopter and screamed at SPC Carl before while running back and forth to stuff rockets into the pod, and they look at me like Eeyore. If I’m outside helping you load ammo and fuel (which is buy isn’t technically illegal) you need to move that ass, because something big is going on.


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Marines do a lot of things right. And, even when they don't, they still look fabulous.
 

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
#24
As for the GR-whatever photos, what am I looking at? Was the harrier actually built out of wood?
Disassembled Harriers shiiped to the boneyard after being purchased by the USMC, but stored still in their wood shipping/support cradles.
 

woodreau

Well-Known Member
#25
I'd really never thought about the fact that the AF gas we always got was probably not the "shipboard" type, until I had to do some random govt gas card training or something. Apparently, per the letter of the law, the jet has to be defueled if you get JP8 or Jet A. I don't know if that is actually true, and it certainly isn't in practice. Possibly the Navy/USMC only KC-135's carried JP5, but I know for a fact that the dual capable KC-10 was carrying whatever they brought with them from that place they fly from over there......considering they would reconfigure and give USAF gas with us on the wing, presumably from the same tanks. Not a tanker (ha actually I am now) guy, so maybe there is something I'm missing.
I don't recall the details but I think the procedure is written in a way that rarely does anything have to be done unless you come aboard with an unusually high volume of JP8 or JetA and the aircraft is being brought downstairs.

I think it's do nothing if it's under a certain percentage full, dilute if it's above a certain percentage full, defuel or defuel and dilute if it's above a certain percentage full.

Waiting for a grape to correct me.
Not a tanker or grape.
On an amphibious assault ship, there are no fuel tanks that would be able to accept non-JP-5 fuel from a defueling. We have tank capacity to carry 400,000 gallons of JP-5. I imagine the carrier would be of similar capacity or greater actually as jets are probably thirstier than helos, Ospreys, harriers, tracked vehicles, hovercraft, and landing craft. So the amount of fuel that is not JP-5 carried aboard from aircraft coming from shore, even if it is an F-18 tanker fueled with nothing but JP-8, is insignificant. When the aircraft is fueled with JP-5 now you have a mix but over multiple fuelings, the percentage of JP-8 in the mix decreases

The CV NATOPS might have something that covers non-JP5 fuel handling but I don’t recall ever seeing the topic. I’m sure the topic has come up before. But if there isn’t any formal guidance, it’ll be handled the way everything else in the Navy is handled, figure it out on the fly, and then come up with the shipboard instruction signed by the captain to cover your ass.
 

Pilot Fighter

Well-Known Member
#26
Not a tanker or grape.
On an amphibious assault ship, there are no fuel tanks that would be able to accept non-JP-5 fuel from a defueling. We have tank capacity to carry 400,000 gallons of JP-5. I imagine the carrier would be of similar capacity or greater actually as jets are probably thirstier than helos, Ospreys, harriers, tracked vehicles, hovercraft, and landing craft. So the amount of fuel that is not JP-5 carried aboard from aircraft coming from shore, even if it is an F-18 tanker fueled with nothing but JP-8, is insignificant. When the aircraft is fueled with JP-5 now you have a mix but over multiple fuelings, the percentage of JP-8 in the mix decreases

The CV NATOPS might have something that covers non-JP5 fuel handling but I don’t recall ever seeing the topic. I’m sure the topic has come up before. But if there isn’t any formal guidance, it’ll be handled the way everything else in the Navy is handled, figure it out on the fly, and then come up with the shipboard instruction signed by the captain to cover your ass.
With everybody coming aboard damn near empty, it may rarely if ever be an issue.
 

Pilot Fighter

Well-Known Member
#27
Not a tanker or grape.
On an amphibious assault ship, there are no fuel tanks that would be able to accept non-JP-5 fuel from a defueling. We have tank capacity to carry 400,000 gallons of JP-5. I imagine the carrier would be of similar capacity or greater actually as jets are probably thirstier than helos, Ospreys, harriers, tracked vehicles, hovercraft, and landing craft. So the amount of fuel that is not JP-5 carried aboard from aircraft coming from shore, even if it is an F-18 tanker fueled with nothing but JP-8, is insignificant. When the aircraft is fueled with JP-5 now you have a mix but over multiple fuelings, the percentage of JP-8 in the mix decreases

The CV NATOPS might have something that covers non-JP5 fuel handling but I don’t recall ever seeing the topic. I’m sure the topic has come up before. But if there isn’t any formal guidance, it’ll be handled the way everything else in the Navy is handled, figure it out on the fly, and then come up with the shipboard instruction signed by the captain to cover your ass.

I found a CV NATOPS, it mentioned this in 6.7:

"Prior to aircraft recovering aboard the CV with fuel other than JP-5, the air officer shall be notified to ensure compliance with the Aircraft Refueling NATOPS (NAVAIR 00-80T-109) and individual aircraft NATOPS manuals."

I don't have a copy of the refueling handbook but exact details probably don't matter. If you come aboard near empty and are refueled promptly, the hazard is quickly addressed.
 
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