Profitable?

Summer

New Member
Any financial types out there that can recomend an easy way to find out if a company is profitable? Before you accept a job / give money up front for instruction/ etc. it would be nice to know if the company is on it's last leg.
 

fly22

Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Any financial types out there that can recomend an easy way to find out if a company is profitable? Before you accept a job / give money up front for instruction/ etc. it would be nice to know if the company is on it's last leg.

[/ QUOTE ] Its really easy if the company is publically traded. If it is not then it would be almost impossible. I can give you easy ratios to use if it is publically traded. Let me know, as far as asking them good luck on getting an honest answer if there not.
 

Kingairer

'Tiger Team' Member
I wouldnt ask that in an interview, and even if you did your are likely to get a CEO spin type answer. If its a large or semi large company you can look at press releases, stock prices, load factors etc.
 

fly22

Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I wouldnt ask that in an interview, and even if you did your are likely to get a CEO spin type answer. If its a large or semi large company you can look at press releases, stock prices, load factors etc.

[/ QUOTE ] Stock prices aren't enough, you'll have to look at quick ratios, leverage and many other factors to get a good picture of what is really happening.
 

pilot602

If specified, this will replace the title that
You could always hire Arthur Andersen to look into it for you.


oh wait ....



 

Eagle

New Member
If it is not publicly held you won't be able to find out much. I intervied with a different company that had done pretty poorly in the past filed chapter 11, (13?) and is re-emerging. I may jump ship to this new company in the next few weeks, I am undecided.

BUT!!! they were upfront, and said.. here is our past here is our goal, and we would like you to be part of it.

If they had shaded their past, I wouldn't give them a thought. I knew of their past as other charter pilots had passed thru their doors and kept me up todate.
 

I_Money

Moderator
There is nothing wrong with being point blank and asking the question in the interview - you might get some spin but it should be a good gauge.
 

tonyw

Well-Known Member
If they are publicly traded, check out their latest annual report and pull the 10Qs off the SEC website. Go right to the statement of cash flows and you can very quickly find out whether the company is cash flow positive or negative. I'd use that number more than net earnings because those can be manipulated.

If they are not publicly traded, then you certainly should ask to see the books. If they don't give you a chance to look at their books, run away.
 

Kingairer

'Tiger Team' Member
[ QUOTE ]
If they are not publicly traded, then you certainly should ask to see the books. If they don't give you a chance to look at their books, run away.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you ask "to see the books" Expect to be shown the door. Remember that you want to work for them, and they have hundreds of other applications with people who want to work there. You have to sell them, not the other way around.
 

fly22

Well-Known Member
Cash Flows has nothing to do with profitability. You can be running in the red and still have positive cash flows. Cash flow statements only inform you of on hand cash and its movements it has nothing to do with overall profitability.
Try these ratios for a well rounded picture
Current Ratio = Current Assests/ Current liabilities

Diluted earnings per share = Net income-preferred dividends+adjustment for conversion securities/ Common shares outstanding+ additional shares from potential conversion

Earnings per share: net income-preferred dividends/common shares outstanding

Gross margin %: net sales- cost of goods sold/net sales

long term debt to total assets: long-term debt/ total assets

net income margin: net income/ net sales revenue

Asset turnover: net sales revenue/ total asets

These are only a few to start with becareful in your judgement of what you think is profit. Look up UAL on hoovers or annualreportservice.com and you'll be suprised by their "cash flow" statement. If you read it they're in the positive but we all know what is really going.
 

cime_sp

Well-Known Member
I think what you are both trying to say is that there a some very "interesting" things that accountants can do with depreciation on multi-million aircraft.....especially when sale/leasebacks and enhanced equipment trusts are being set up. Ownership and accounting for these things then becomes very "fuzzy"
 
Top