pro/cons of doing training in a multi

celi95

New Member
Hi, im a private pilot and i am going to be starting on my instrument very soon and then on to my commercial. However the flight school that i will be attending offers these courses in a multi engine plane for just about $2000 more. What are some pros and cons of flight training in the multi. It will be more expensive now, but it the long run i think it will be cheaper because you need to build multi time some time to get anywhere in your career, so why not start now, right? i figure by the time i get my AMEL, instrument multi, and commercial multi, i should have close to a 100hrs multi time. where will that put me in the job outlook field? i know i will still have to cfi for a while but would i get to priority cfi'ing in a multi if i have my mei or anything? thanks for any input!
 

Kingairer

'Tiger Team' Member
Wait on the multi. Focus on learning your instrument stuff with an airplane ya know. If you wanted to do multi-commercial thats another topic, but your instrument needs to be single first.
 

Derg

Cap, Roci
Staff member
Great Avatar, KingAirer! BTW, did you get the memo on the TPS reports?

I'd suggest the add-on.

But if it's just $2000 extra and you have the strong ability to get things right the first time without extra training, it might work ok.

However, consider this. Each extra training flight you make is going to cost megabuck$ if it comes down to it.

A little extra dual in a Cessna? Perhaps a few hundred dollars. A little extra dual in a Seminole? Yow.
 

jdflight

Well-Known Member
I say take it. Learning in the multi isn't really any harder than in the single. As for not knowing the airplane, that's ridiculous. You have to have the private multi add-on before you can start the instrument training in the multi. If you know it well enough to pass the checkride, you'll be fine doing the instrument training. You'll be a better instrument pilot for it. If you can handle the extra workload of the multi and the instrument, then flying instrument single is a cakewalk. That's how I did it, and I don't regret a second of it.
 

Jason

Well-Known Member
Something else to consider is when you will take the multi checkride in that program? If you take all of the checkrides at the same time at the end of the course then you may have 100 hours of multi time but it'll all be dual received. If that's the case save the $2K and get yourself some multi PIC after you get all of the ratings.

Jason
 

JDE

Well-Known Member
At our school, we take our commercial ride in a single and do the multi as an add on - commerical multi. I was told this was so we were not limited to flying only one or the other commercially, but so we can do both. I've managed to lose my FAR/AIM so I can't look it up right now, so does anyone know if that is correct? If this is correct, I personally wouldn't want to limit myself to only being able to fly commercially in a multi engine airplane. There are quite a few cargo companies for instance, out there flying singles, not to mention banner towing, air tours, etc.

One more thing, does anyone know if you get your commerical multi w/o getting commerical single, how does that effect getting your CFI?
 

pilot602

If specified, this will replace the title that
If you get your commercial in a multi then you are limited to excercising your commercial privileges in mult-engine aircraft. However, you can then go and do a single-engine commercial add-on. Just like you would do a multi-add on if you were to do the CSEL first. It's really no big deal.

As far as the CFI goes you'd have the option of getting your CFI-ME certificate and your CFI-IA certificates if you held a CMEL certificate. To add CFI-SE you'd need to do a CSEL add-on and then the CFI-SE add-on.

I've done all of my training in a multi with the exception of the first 37 or so hours (did my private in a 172). I'm coming up on my IA checkride (in am ulti) followed by my commercial (again, in the multi). After the commercial I'm going to pick up my CFI-IA and then my CFI-ME and eventually do the CSEL and CFI-SE add-ons.

A multi is really not that much more difficult than a single and they are great platforms for the IA stuff. However, if you don't have regular access to a multi then I would probably say go with what you have availability with, as in single engine aircraft. Because, unless you own a multi, or have a friend that does, renting one with only 200-300 hours is probably going to be either impossible, or extremely expensive due to insurance requirements. So while you may be able to do your training in a multi (with the CFI on board) after you complete your ratings you'll most likely no be able to, or afford to, rent a multi.
 

JDE

Well-Known Member
Yeah, who would ever have thought of doing a commerical single add on....man its been a long week. I'm ready for the weekend! Thanks for the info pilot602, I did at least learn something!
 

mrivc211

Well-Known Member
Pro's- You will get hired sooner than later!

Con's- You will pay more for it!

You decide the benefit/cost ratio!
 

EatSleepFly

Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Pro's- You will get hired sooner than later!

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe, maybe not. I did pvt. multi, then instrument in a multi., then commercial multi with a single-add. Ended up with 70 hrs. of multi time. Sure thats a good start. But its not enough to get in anywhere really. And it wasn't really worth it if you ask me. Im still (if FSI doesnt hire me this time around) going to have to start out flying single engine freight or something and eventually work my way into multi. that way. Well, thats stupid because its the same thing I would've had to do if I had just done everything in a single and then done a multi-add. Sure, I would have only gotten 10 or 15 hrs. of multi time that way, but I could've saved $15 or $20k. Just my $.02...
 

Kingairer

'Tiger Team' Member
[ QUOTE ]
Learning in the multi isn't really any harder than in the single. As for not knowing the airplane, that's ridiculous.

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I Dont know how many students you have taught, but the instrument is not easy for many. Many times the students are behind the airplane already with "all" the things they have to set up for the approach. Half the time their head is barried in their charts as the localizer goes shooting right through. This is at 100KTS. Can you imagine how fun it would be at 130kts? They will get their instrument in a complex environment training when they add on their multi to the commercial-instrument.

I would like to second a few comments from above.
Doug saying that reviewing another lesson gets to be very expensive and it could possibly drain ya dry. Some people get it quick, others dont.

And Jasons comment of you could take that 2000 and use it to gain Multi PIC time, which ull need for your MEI.


Take things one at a time and get a solid foundation.


KA

PS. I GOT THE MEMO!
 

jdflight

Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
And Jasons comment of you could take that 2000 and use it to gain Multi PIC time, which ull need for your MEI.


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Get your multi rating before the instrument and this point is moot. All your time flying the instrument training is now logged PIC.

Yes, I can imagine doing it at 130kts. I did it. Almost everyone at our school does it. Nearly everyone gets their rating in the prescribed hours. Very, very few go over. You shouldn't be doing an advanced rating if you're not proficient in the airplane, whether single or multi.

As for the commercial ratings, I did both flights the same day, as does nearly everyone at my school. It's not an issue. Do the single, and then the multi add-on an hour later.
 

Kingairer

'Tiger Team' Member
Be sure to post a response in a year or two after youve had a few bonehead instrument students. What good does it due to pay 160 an hour when you could be paying 84 for the same thing. Is it going to get them to a job an quicker???

PS. What gold mine are these students sitting on? The students i have for multi are very conscience about $ at 165 an hour, rightfully so.
 

ananoman

New Member
While it is true that it cost more in a multi, that is not the only issue. Flying the instrument rating in the multi forces the student to be more 'on the ball' and think ahead more. The work load is higher and this is better preparation for future jobs where you will be flying more complex equipment. It is true that during the first lessons you will be way behind the aircraft, but I think this would happen in a single as well. You just have to do everything a little faster in the twin. I have had 4 students do their instrument rating in the multi so far, and the problems they have had were not related to the type of aircraft used. Not properly briefing the approach and the lack of basic attitude instrument flying skills were the real killers. This stuff can be practiced at home on your computer. If you put in the time to study and microsoft before your lessons you should not have a big problem.
 

celi95

New Member
Thanks for all the info guys! haha however it seems my decision has become a little harder to make now. lol. well anyways i'll give you guys some more details. This past year i was a freshman at ERAU daytona campus and got my ppl. I say "was" because i am transferring to Penn State. This is for several reasons...i was and Aeronautical Science major this past year and i was planning on switching my major to busines (and getting my ratings off campus because flying is still my dream) mainly because i wanted something more to fall back on in case for some reason some day i cannot keep my medical or the industry is not hiring when i graduate etc. Then i thought why should i should i pay $30k a year at ERAU when i can go back home (PA) and go to Penn state for $10k minus more instate aid and get just of good of a degree if not better.
So here i am now, will be attending PSU in the fall and im looking for a good flight school to fly at. I finally found one, its called Certified Flyers II. Theyre located in morristown NJ about 40min from me. However they offer the rest of there ratings in a multi...which got me thinkin again and hence this topic. I know I have to get my AMEL first before i start, which shouldnt be that much of a problem since i just had my ASEL checkride last week. Here's some more details from there web page http://www.certifiedflyers.com/multi_instru_pkg.htm . it breaks down to about $160/hr for the duchess and $45 for instructor if i need more training they still only charge me only $160 for everything. Would i be logging all these hours PIC or as dual? because if it is dual than i could see saving the $ and buying multi PIC later. As for the money, it would all be coming from loans so it wouldnt be that big of a deal. I guess my main question is would doing all this training in the multi make me more marketable to future employers? and basically i have to start logging multi anyways, why not get some of it out of the way now instead of later? Sorry for making this so long but thanks again!
 

Kingairer

'Tiger Team' Member
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it would all be coming from loans so it wouldnt be that big of a deal

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You dont want alot of loans to have to pay back. This could prevent you from being able to be flexible in jobs that you take. You still have to pay loans!

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I guess my main question is would doing all this training in the multi make me more marketable to future employers?

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No


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Would i be logging all these hours PIC or as dual?

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If you are rated in the aircraft, then you can log it PIC and Dual.


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and basically i have to start logging multi anyways, why not get some of it out of the way now instead of later?

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Why not get paid for it later rather than paying for it now?

I paid to get my Multi engine (commercial&Instr) add on and 3 hours for my MEI training and thats it. All my other multi time i have been paid for. In the long run mutli dual given will look alot better than dual received.
 

celi95

New Member
Why not get paid for it later rather than paying for it now?

I paid to get my Multi engine (commercial&Instr) add on and 3 hours for my MEI training and thats it. All my other multi time i have been paid for. In the long run mutli dual given will look alot better than dual received.


[/ QUOTE ]


how did you end up getting payed for all your multi time? Being a mei? and also since everyone that has their MEI wants to do as much CFI ing in the multi, how hard is it to actually get that time....does senority play a role here?

also check out this thread from flightinfo.com

http://forums.flightinfo.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=15660

thanks!
 

ananoman

New Member
The guy on Flightinfo has a good way to look at it. If you have to pay $100 an hour for a single, why not pay an extra $60 and get multi-time. I think it is better if you have more multi before becoming an MEI. It is possible to do a multi commercial add on and get your MEI in something like 30 hours. But how much experience do you have and what are you giving your student. Things can happen alot faster in the twin, and it is possible for your student to make alot more mistakes. When your student pulls the mixtures instead of the props back on their climb check, or turns off the mags on the good engine during an engine shut down, it will get your attention.
 
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