Part 121 Captain = automatic CFI renewal?

E_Dawg

Moderator
Heard of a FSDO that renews your CFI automatically because you are in a position to evaluate other pilots. Is this universal among FSDOs or should I go to the one I, uhh, heard about!
 

Number1atNumber2

Tries to keep it fun.
I've heard that as well. My understanding of it is they figure at that stage in your flying career, you probably know more than joe-blow cfi off the street. So renewing it is pretty much a matter of going to the FSDO and asking for it.

Of course, you can ask 3 different FAA guys a question and get 3 different answers soemtimes, so I'd be interested in know if anyone's actually gotten renewed that way, or if this is an urban legend.
 

KLB

Well-Known Member
I brought this topic up a while back. DE727 and CaptainBob had some good information on it. You might want to do a search and check it out.
 

BobDDuck

Island Bus Driver
It is NOT automatic. From what I have seen/heard, if you are a checkairman or an instructor, pretty much any inspector at a FSDO will do it. However, if you are just a normal line captain, you may have to get your POI to do it.

Speaking of which...
 

kellwolf

Piece of Trash
Bah, some standardization among FSDOs would be nice...
Hey, it's a government office. Whatdya expect? :)

Just to echo Ethan, it's not automatic. I think there are SOME FSDO guys out there that will do it, but I know that the ones here in MEM won't. They're all pretty chummy with the APDs and check airmen, so I'm guessing they probably sign the 8710s for them, but I'm not even sure about that.
 

USMC-SSGT

Well-Known Member
they figure at that stage in your flying career, you probably know more than joe-blow cfi off the street.
I would disagree with that. I think that you would know alot about IFR operations and part 121 ops and the crew environment but would certainly not be up to standards on teaching PVT and COMM maneuvers. Even only having been out of instructing for 500 hours now I would feel incredibly rusty trying to teach a private student all of the appropriate maneuvers. Could I fly all of them to PTS, yes, but could I teach them as well as before?

The other argument to that though is that renewing your CFI through the american flyers computer program is as useless as anything. Passing a rote memory test every two years doesnt really help either. Ah heck I suppose I dont know what I am talking about here since we are just talking about currency and not proficiency.
 

Seggy

Well-Known Member
What I did/would do is during your FAA line check have an 8710 form with the renewal ready. Once you are done with the ride ask the FAA inspector if they would mind renewing it.
 

minitour

New Member
From what I have seen/heard, if you are a checkairman or an instructor, pretty much any inspector at a FSDO will do it.
They absolutely should. If they aren't, then they aren't following the rules.

61.197 said:
(a) A person who holds a flight instructor certificate that has not expired may renew that certificate by—

(2) Presenting to an authorized FAA Flight Standards Inspector—

(ii) A record showing that, within the preceding 24 calendar months, the flight instructor has served as a company check pilot, chief flight instructor, company check airman, or flight instructor in a part 121 or part 135 operation, or in a position involving the regular evaluation of pilots; or
-mini
 

pilot4500

IT Manager/ Former Cirrus Charter Pilot
It sounds to me like if you are a part 121 line captain, and you are in a position to instruct or evaluate other pilots, then you would qualify for a CFI renewal. However, just being a part 121 line pilot on its own does not qualify you for a renewal.
 

Polar742

All the responsibility none of the authority
From my experience, the local cats would always renew a linecheck or proficiency checkairman.

Line captains are more hit-than-miss.

I bought the lifetime American Flyers deal years ago. I just do that every couple years. Even when I was a linecheck pilot, I'd do the course. There's a lot of changes and stuff I just plain forgot.
 

minitour

New Member
It sounds to me like if you are a part 121 line captain, and you are in a position to instruct or evaluate other pilots, then you would qualify for a CFI renewal. However, just being a part 121 line pilot on its own does not qualify you for a renewal.
Unless you could convince someone that as a PIC you're constantly "in a position involving the regular evaluation of pilots" (SICs). Might be worth a call to your local FSDO.

Quick conversation with an inspector = $0.00
Gleim's FIRC = $99.95

I'd probably make the call and ask. What's the worst they're going to say? No?

-mini
 

B767Driver

New Member
When I was a commuter captain it was an auto renewal...the FAA did away with that provision some time ago. Just did my Gleim renewal this month. It was painless.
 

DE727UPS

Well-Known Member
"I just renewed mine in Denver a few weeks ago. Took about 15 mins out of my day"

Details? You have the inspectors name and would he do it again?

It's all food for thought as Gleim is painless and low threat. Still, this is one of those cool FAA grey areas that are interesting to explore.
 

PeanuckleCRJ

Poodle Wrangler
My understanding was that if it is in your company's FOM that a 121 captain is expected to be an instructor (plus if you are regularly doing probey evals), it is an automatic renewal depending on the FSDO.

I took advantage of this the time before last... I recently did the american flyers program which is a piece of cake. I'm now back in an instructing position.... too bad I didn't get to do this a few months earlier and I could have gotten it free again, haha.
 

falconvalley

Well-Known Member
Skyway's old director of Ops had a letter signed by him for plain vanilla line captains. Once he was gone, so was the letter unfortunately. The new DO(s) couldn't convince the FSDO it was still worth their time. I don't really know if there was any other way for us to use our creds. I suppose you didn't really need a letter signed by our DO, but I think it made things really easy and "Fed The Bear".

I just use AE like Kingairer. Isn't that difficult and the MKE guys have always been more than happy to give me the temp for it.
 

Foxcow

Well-Known Member
It took about 15 minutes when I did mine about 6 months ago. I am not a check airman either.
 

viper548

Well-Known Member
"I just renewed mine in Denver a few weeks ago. Took about 15 mins out of my day"

Details? You have the inspectors name and would he do it again?

It's all food for thought as Gleim is painless and low threat. Still, this is one of those cool FAA grey areas that are interesting to explore.
I called the DEN FSDO to make an appointment, but it wasn't necessary. I showed up with the 8710 filled out. All they wanted was the 8710, a photocopy of my company ID and some other written proof that I'm a captain. I gave him a copy of my trip schedule for that day that shows me as the captain. There were two pilots there before me and another waiting when I left. I dont have the guys name on me right now, but I think it was Greg Smith
 
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