Moxy and 60 A220s

nibake

Powder hound
Been in service 3 years and 70+ in operation. So not really a "new" plane anymore.
I did a little googling. I'm still not buying it. The majority of those airplanes were deliver in the last two years, and the only operator using them that isn't pretty much on the other side of the world is Delta. So that brings me back to the question, is there some plan to peel away a whole bunch of Delta pilots? That seems unlikely. Or build an airline with the entire PIC group not having time in type. That seems sketchy to me, but maybe that's the plan.

I guess as long as there were qualified check airmen they could legally take someone with 1000 hrs twin otter on floats 121 SIC time and make them PIC, right? Back to the legal vs. smart discussion...
 

Ecl!pse

Well-Known Member
I did a little googling. I'm still not buying it. The majority of those airplanes were deliver in the last two years, and the only operator using them that isn't pretty much on the other side of the world is Delta. So that brings me back to the question, is there some plan to peel away a whole bunch of Delta pilots? That seems unlikely. Or build an airline with the entire PIC group not having time in type. That seems sketchy to me, but maybe that's the plan.

I guess as long as there were qualified check airmen they could legally take someone with 1000 hrs twin otter on floats 121 SIC time and make them PIC, right? Back to the legal vs. smart discussion...
Not sure I’m following the concern. At time of hiring/bidding for any A220 operator, you are bringing in guys with 0 time in type. Moxy will hire a group of initial training/check airmen, send them through training, and then they will start training the hires that come after them. Virtually the same way it would have happened at Delta, Swiss, Air Baltic, etc.

As to how they attract pilots given the shortage? I imagine there are plenty of regional pilots who would jump at the opportunity to join a startup airline and have a high seniority number. I also imagine Neeleman would offer the pilots some small cut of equity to take the risk, which has the potential to create true wealth. I could also see folks who are looking at being number X-thousand on a list at Spirit or Frontier taking the chance to get that high seniority number for their entire career a Moxy.
 

Autothrust Blue

"I'll take your case."
I did a little googling. I'm still not buying it. The majority of those airplanes were deliver in the last two years, and the only operator using them that isn't pretty much on the other side of the world is Delta. So that brings me back to the question, is there some plan to peel away a whole bunch of Delta pilots? That seems unlikely. Or build an airline with the entire PIC group not having time in type. That seems sketchy to me, but maybe that's the plan.
That doesn't really scare me that much, not anymore than "well, it's a new airplane so we'll doubtless have our share of surprises and 'WTF does that mean'."

Got to start somewhere.
 

z987k

Well-Known Member
For a brand new airplane type that has never flown before, the FAA has a special process for selecting the launch certification Captains for a new airline operating this type. They are called the Tiger Team initial Cadre.
I had a guy tell me about being the "initial cadre" at *some airline* and on and on about it, 20 years ago or whatever it was and he's still there(regional).

I came away thinking he had failed entirely in his career, not succeed, lol.
 

word302

Well-Known Member
I had a guy tell me about being the "initial cadre" at *some airline* and on and on about it, 20 years ago or whatever it was and he's still there(regional).

I came away thinking he had failed entirely in his career, not succeed, lol.
What part of initial cadre do you not understand? How could you possibly achieve anything better in your career?
 

Richman

Well-Known Member
JetBlue had most of it's start up during the aftermath of 9/11 and the resulting recession when there was plenty of cheap labor and, oh yea, free slots at JFK.

Not sure those same conditions exist today.

The long thin route thing has been tried umty ump times. The reason is they're thin is, well, no people.
 

Autothrust Blue

"I'll take your case."
Not a new article but it's the only one I've seen where pilot recruiting was mentioned (and yes, I probably missed others). I have no idea what "innovative" means. I thought all approaches had been tried by now. Cue The Blind Men and the Elephant:
"Why should we hire you at (brand that claims it's any different)?"
"Because I will perform pilot services for currency."
"What attracts you about working at (brand that claims it's any different)?"
"The opportunity to perform pilot services for greater amounts of currency with additional time off for the same increments of currency."
"What do you dislike about your current employer?"
"The difference between the amount of pilot services I perform here and the currency and days off I would receive at this prospective employer."
"Do you have any questions?"
"When can I start performing pilot services for currency?"

etc.

tl;dr: cash rules err'thing around me
 
"Why should we hire you at (brand that claims it's any different)?"
"Because I will perform pilot services for currency."
"What attracts you about working at (brand that claims it's any different)?"
"The opportunity to perform pilot services for greater amounts of currency with additional time off for the same increments of currency."
"What do you dislike about your current employer?"
"The difference between the amount of pilot services I perform here and the currency and days off I would receive at this prospective employer."
"Do you have any questions?"
"When can I start performing pilot services for currency?"

etc.

tl;dr: cash rules err'thing around me
I’ve developed this habit of eating regularly, more currency=more tacos.
 

z987k

Well-Known Member
"Why should we hire you at (brand that claims it's any different)?"
"Because I will perform pilot services for currency."
"What attracts you about working at (brand that claims it's any different)?"
"The opportunity to perform pilot services for greater amounts of currency with additional time off for the same increments of currency."
"What do you dislike about your current employer?"
"The difference between the amount of pilot services I perform here and the currency and days off I would receive at this prospective employer."
"Do you have any questions?"
"When can I start performing pilot services for currency?"

etc.

tl;dr: cash rules err'thing around me
If only you could be that honest.
 

Cherokee_Cruiser

Well-Known Member
"Why should we hire you at (brand that claims it's any different)?"
"Because I will perform pilot services for currency."
"What attracts you about working at (brand that claims it's any different)?"
"The opportunity to perform pilot services for greater amounts of currency with additional time off for the same increments of currency."
"What do you dislike about your current employer?"
"The difference between the amount of pilot services I perform here and the currency and days off I would receive at this prospective employer."
"Do you have any questions?"
"When can I start performing pilot services for currency?"

etc.

tl;dr: cash rules err'thing around me

Dolla dolla bill ya’ll?
 

srn121

Well-Known Member
Not a new article but it's the only one I've seen where pilot recruiting was mentioned (and yes, I probably missed others). I have no idea what "innovative" means. I thought all approaches had been tried by now. Cue The Blind Men and the Elephant:


"Neeleman promised 'innovative approaches' to recruiting pilots'..."

Maybe it's innovative at how they find and poach pilots and maybe it's moving away from the typical job fairs and events like that. Who's to say they won't offer bonuses and stock options to get some really well qualified folks to gamble on them instead of the other LLCs or mainlines. I'm open to whatever their pitch is as it's a pretty competitive market so it's going to have to be good or they can just help themselves to the guys willing to jump ship from the regionals.
 
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