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JetBlue and ALPA has an AIP!

#43
Hope this puts the needed pressure for Frontier to get their ass in gear.
(Only US ALPA carrier left without a new contract. I think)
Hope this puts the needed pressure for Frontier to get their ass in gear.
(Only US ALPA carrier left without a new contract. I think)
I don't want to derail the thread, but Frontier isn't going to get a new contract until management wants the group to have one. Unlike spirit and JB, it isn't a publicly-traded company and doesn't have to react to investor unrest or public pressure. Given the way meditation has gone, I wouldn't expect the NMB to accept the recent request to proffer arbitration. I expect the parties to get sent back to the table. Sorry for the hijack.
 

ATN_Pilot

Socialist Pig Member
#44
I don't want to derail the thread, but Frontier isn't going to get a new contract until management wants the group to have one. Unlike spirit and JB, it isn't a publicly-traded company and doesn't have to react to investor unrest or public pressure. Given the way meditation has gone, I wouldn't expect the NMB to accept the recent request to proffer arbitration. I expect the parties to get sent back to the table. Sorry for the hijack.
There won’t be any proffers during Trump’s time in office unless it’s management who wants one. Everyone can pretty much count on that. Those of us who lived through the Bush 43 years should know that well.
 

CFIT99

I'm probably commenting ironically...
#45
I don't want to derail the thread, but Frontier isn't going to get a new contract until management wants the group to have one. Unlike spirit and JB, it isn't a publicly-traded company and doesn't have to react to investor unrest or public pressure. Given the way meditation has gone, I wouldn't expect the NMB to accept the recent request to proffer arbitration. I expect the parties to get sent back to the table. Sorry for the hijack.
I agree with you, especially since yesterday was suppose to be the “deadline” to hear the companies response about a proffer request. Also besides the standard attrition, classes have been filled the last few months. Although they want to be a public company so there’s that. Thread hijacked again.
 

Kingairer

Well-Known Member
#48
It might be worth rereading bobs post I may have misunderstood his post or misunderstand your question
Perhaps you misunderstood. I havent seen anywhere on the thread that showed what the negotiating committee was asking for or got. Only speculation that they likely didnt get or ask for Delta rates. (a fair guess), but maybe they were asking for and got Delta rates.
 

jtrain609

I'm a carnal, organic anagram.
#49
Guys.

The MEC and the NC have stated over, and over, and over, and over, AND OVER AGAIN, sometimes multiple times a day, that they refuse to accept anything less than a market rate contract. Market rate has been explained in detail by Jimmy.

I feel like you guys are basically saying, "Listen, I know the union said that Mary Poppins will be the entertainment at the LEC meeting tonight, but they didn't say supercalifragilisticexpialidocious, so they're going to need to prove that Mary Poppins will be there or I'm not coming."
 

Kingairer

Well-Known Member
#50
Guys.

The MEC and the NC have stated over, and over, and over, and over, AND OVER AGAIN, sometimes multiple times a day, that they refuse to accept anything less than a market rate contract. Market rate has been explained in detail by Jimmy.

I feel like you guys are basically saying, "Listen, I know the union said that Mary Poppins will be the entertainment at the LEC meeting tonight, but they didn't say supercalifragilisticexpialidocious, so they're going to need to prove that Mary Poppins will be there or I'm not coming."
By Market rate you mean DL, UA, AA correct?
 

Baronman

Well-Known Member
#55
I’m not trying to be suggestive. I’m trying to figure out what, in a JetBlue pilots mind, is market rate.
I don't know what the definition of market rate is. Seems to be a phase they liked to use, "we pay market rate for planes, we should get market rate for pilots..." I understand the idea, still the company isn't going to overpay and is going to try to get the best deal possible.

In terms of which airline's contracts we were looking at.... I can say the big 3, SW, Alaska, Hawaiian, and Spirit were analyzed in our 91 page contract comparison guide.
 

jynxyjoe

The Kickin' Chicken!
#56
I don't know what the definition of market rate is. Seems to be a phase they liked to use, "we pay market rate for planes, we should get market rate for pilots..." I understand the idea, still the company isn't going to overpay and is going to try to get the best deal possible.

In terms of which airline's contracts we were looking at.... I can say the big 3, SW, Alaska, Hawaiian, and Spirit were analyzed in our 91 page contract comparison guide.
That's four.

SWA pay and rules are locked pretty tight together.
 

WestIndian425

Well-Known Member
#58
I don't know what the definition of market rate is. Seems to be a phase they liked to use, "we pay market rate for planes, we should get market rate for pilots..." I understand the idea, still the company isn't going to overpay and is going to try to get the best deal possible.

In terms of which airline's contracts we were looking at.... I can say the big 3, SW, Alaska, Hawaiian, and Spirit were analyzed in our 91 page contract comparison guide.
That's four.
Actually, that’s 7.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

jtrain609

I'm a carnal, organic anagram.
#59
That's four.

SWA pay and rules are locked pretty tight together.
I know you know this, but I'm going to say it for those following along at home who might not.

Everyone's pay rates and work rules are locked together. Spirit is probably the most extreme example of this, but it's true everywhere.

The truth is rates don't mean too much when you're determining how much you'll make at the end of the year. But if pilots are bad at math (and a lot of them seem to be), then rates are the easiest measuring stick, even if they're the wrong measuring stick.
 

jynxyjoe

The Kickin' Chicken!
#60
I know you know this, but I'm going to say it for those following along at home who might not.

Everyone's pay rates and work rules are locked together. Spirit is probably the most extreme example of this, but it's true everywhere.

The truth is rates don't mean too much when you're determining how much you'll make at the end of the year. But if pilots are bad at math (and a lot of them seem to be), then rates are the easiest measuring stick, even if they're the wrong measuring stick.
Yup and for all reading the exchange i would even go further and assume when someone quotes me their hourly I immediately judge them. Personally i think we should be giving out median of W2/days off per position per category.

Anyway, I remember you reference SW rates in the past and every time you do I feel like I should harumph and say "ya know most of their money is their soft pay not their rates" and then push up my glasses and spray nose decongestant i obtain from my pocket protector