I no fly now

BuckTurgidson

New Member
Me want to fly. But money very much not here. My Xinhua airline no pay Pan Am. I fly one month now with money no in account. 25 countrymen and me run up very much debt with Pan Am. Pan Am very much stupid to let all of us fly before we pay. Do they do this with American student? I have now time one maybe month until I fly again. I will spend time learning American customs like drink beer and look at Baywatch on the majic box. My English good very. Just ask Ft. Pierce tower. I speaky good much.

Translation: Xinhua has not paid Pan Am for the previous one month of flying. So the 26 Chinese students owe somewhere north of $150,000 to Pan Am. All Chinese students are grounded until Xinhua pays not only what they owe. But, enough to continue with their training. It is believed that this will take approximately 1 month. (the school says less, the students themselves say it will be at least 1 month).

Pan Am in their infinite wisdom decided to start flying the students ahead of schedule and before they had even started English classes.
 

flyallday

Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Me want to fly. But money very much not here. My Xinhua airline no pay Pan Am. I fly one month now with money no in account. 25 countrymen and me run up very much debt with Pan Am. Pan Am very much stupid to let all of us fly before we pay. Do they do this with American student? I have now time one maybe month until I fly again. I will spend time learning American customs like drink beer and look at Baywatch on the majic box. My English good very. Just ask Ft. Pierce tower. I speaky good much.

Translation: Xinhua has not paid Pan Am for the previous one month of flying. So the 26 Chinese students owe somewhere north of $150,000 to Pan Am. All Chinese students are grounded until Xinhua pays not only what they owe. But, enough to continue with their training. It is believed that this will take approximately 1 month. (the school says less, the students themselves say it will be at least 1 month).

Pan Am in their infinite wisdom decided to start flying the students ahead of schedule and before they had even started English classes.


[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
I will spend time learning American customs like drink beer and look at Baywatch on the majic box

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Very Funny D!ck Head!!!
 

pure_IMC

New Member
I hope what you say is true, these people at school have done nothing but lied to their students and instructors. They really need a visit from the BBB. And with any luck they will be gone. I know turk is really looking foward to students within 30 days, but he really needs to take a reality check. This will never happen. Do you realize that people from march are still waiting for students? I praise you for fininshing the program in 10 months, but you better hurry up and wait. Pan am spreads lies, and always will. As long its for the mighty dollar.
 

BuckTurgidson

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
Very Funny D!ck Head!!!

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry it took me so long to respond, I was drinking beer and watching football last night.

I don't understand? Am I really funny, and a D!ck Head? Or, are you being sarcastic? I think that it must be the former because if you read the entire post and decided to parse that one sentence out then sarcasm is something that is lost on you.

I think that you must be upset about the majic box thing. I guess you prefer to call television the "idiot box". Because the computer is the "majic box".
 

BuckTurgidson

New Member
[ QUOTE ]


When people are reading from all over the world its un called for to try to make fun of Asians at panam

[/ QUOTE ]

Fair enough. I understand your point.

Honestly, the problem is not with the students. They are all wonderful people. They are excellent students who try hard, study hard, and want to succeed. If all students were as well motivated as them. Well, anyways. The problem is that their English (most of them) is not at a level where it needs to be. They needed to spend more time learning English before they started flying. But, leave it to Pan Am to start them flying even before they started English class. I guess that all they saw were dollar signs. But, the school hadn't even collected dollar one from China. And now the students are grounded and the instructors (who teach the Chinese exclusively) are effectively "furloughed" until funds are made available from China.

It makes me wonder what they management is thinking. If a regular FAA student at Pan Am gets low on funds then the school will not let them get near a plane. But, let's allow 26 students from halfway around the world fly for one month without any money in their accounts. Also, don't get me started on ground briefs.
 

tophinator42001

New Member
Ohhh man....It's been a long time since I've seen something that funny on this board...so long that I am actually compelled to post something.....those pan am folks...........I feel sorry for all of them....unless they play good politics within the company, It is worthless.


welcome to the world of expensive flight schools....seriously though, thanks for the laugh...hah

P.S.

Why do people want to live in Phoenix??? or Florida???

yee haw
 

Derg

Cap, Roci
Staff member
Believe me, if Pan Am stopped training the Chinese students in order to brush up on their English, they're actually doing the CFI's a major favor.

Oh yeah!

Here's a real world example.

I worked as a CFI at a school that ran a program, specializing in training former Korean Air Force pilots to recieve their US multi-engine private, then the US multi-engine ATP certificate. After earning this, they'd travel home to Korea and go to work for Asiana Airlines.

Some of their English was good, but most of it was pretty bad. They could talk on the radio, usually function in ATC fairly OK, but it was extreme challenge for both the controllers and the students alike.

Well, a couple of my schools former students, including some of my own, were involved in miscommunication incidents while flying into the United States. Some were minor, some were of the type that "Holy crap, I wonder why I didn't hear about that on the evening news!"

The FAA (and FBI) tracked down which particular pilots these were, noticed they all came from the same flight school and two years after my last student, while I was sleeping-in after a crazy night on the town in Milwaukee, I recieve a call from the FAA in Oklahoma City with the FBI on extension, told of the "situation" and had 72 hours to meet them in Oklahoma City to discuss their investigation but would consider delaying if I planned to seek legal counsel.

Here I was, with an expired CFI certificate and hadn't set foot in the flight school for two years, now I'm being asked questions, names, dates, numbers, demeanors, language skills, etc, of people I haven't been in the same room with for 28 months?

Eek! Talk about your career flashing before your eyes. I just upgraded to captain and my future was so bright, I had to wear shades.

The English that can get a student by as a private pilot doesn't necessarily mean that he's got ATP-quality, or even commercial-quality English.

"Sir, with all due respect, the FARs say..."

"Yes, but our interpretation of OUR FARs in respect to commercial and ATP IS..."

The FAA's interpretation of "read/speak/understand" in reference to ATP and commercial means that unless your student is able to, and I quote "...understand a non-standard communication from air traffic control the first time, and respond intelligibly, the first attempt, that is NOT ATP/commercial-standard English..." and if I had signed off students for checkrides without the above, I was in violation of FAR blabbity-blah and eligible for suspension.

The FAA was pissed. Very pissed. I literally thought I was going to get suspended on the spot and have to purchase a ticket from OKC to MKE because I wouldn't be eligible for the jumpseat home and how I just blew a bunch of dough on those United Airlines and Delta Air Lines applications.

Their investigation had a larger scope of which I completely cooperated and they let me, and my career, go with only a strong verbal warning.

After that, they offered me lunch and showed me around the Mike Moroney (sp?) FAA center.

So if Pan Am decided to suspend the program temporarily to put the students through a remedial English course, take it from me, it's a good thing.
 

tophinator42001

New Member
Doug, I do agree with you, nevertheless......they should have evaluated the quality of english and anticipated the pitfalls of english being a second language to such a large group of students coming from so far away. Anybody could have anticipated the fact that there would be delays in training due to language barriers. I myself would only assume that pan am would capitalize on this. I could only imagine the difficulty in sending a group of people overseas to a bunch of different FBO's as opossed to sending them to a large flight school with a multi-million dollar look, and air conditioned pipers with the seven or so overhead switches that are supposed to simulate flying a CRJ. I honestly hope that they do well.
 

TheFlyingTurkey

Fetus Worshiper
[ QUOTE ]
I hope what you say is true, these people at school have done nothing but lied to their students and instructors. They really need a visit from the BBB. And with any luck they will be gone. I know turk is really looking foward to students within 30 days, but he really needs to take a reality check. This will never happen. Do you realize that people from march are still waiting for students? I praise you for fininshing the program in 10 months, but you better hurry up and wait. Pan am spreads lies, and always will. As long its for the mighty dollar.

[/ QUOTE ]

How the heck did I get involved in this ?
 

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
[ QUOTE ]
[
How the heck did I get involved in this ?

[/ QUOTE ]

Guilt through association.....
 

Queboat

Well-Known Member
HAAHAHAHAHHAHAHAh

This post is awesome!!!


"236papa alfa hols short won four go home!!" thats my favorite chinese student quote. Those guys aren't that bad, wish they'd fly smaller patterns though
 

cime_sp

Well-Known Member
I've had a couple of close ones with them over at Okechobee though.....not because of bad communication, but a great lack of it. Very few radio calls at an uncontrolled field where things can get quite hectic with all the flight training in the area.
 

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
Curious as to what's going on with the Chinese students, as this thread seemed incomplete as to the outcome of the situation.

Are they flying now? Not flying now?

How's the program coming along?
 

TheFlyingTurkey

Fetus Worshiper
The Chinese where back up flying a week after they were grounded. From what I hear, (and have heard myself on the radio) the chinese english is pretty good, and the few I have heard spoke very well. There are still some who struggle, but they are coming along fast. Their progress is a bit slower than your average student. This is mainly because instructors are reluctant to sign them off for solo flights until the english improved. Some of them are nearing their 3rd stage checks, and we should see some go up for checkrides soon.

The Turk.
 

cime_sp

Well-Known Member
In my opinion, Turk is being very "optomistic" about their english....but they have gotten a little better
 

aloft

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
When people are reading from all over the world its un called for to try to make fun of Asians at panam

[/ QUOTE ]Mayhaps. Nevertheless, it's pretty funny.
 
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