Bye bye to Norwegian's USA bases

Cherokee_Cruiser

Well-Known Member


Well nice to see you gloat about airline pilots losing their jobs in this country. Today it’s them. Someday it could be you, and then we’ll see how your “nah” attitude is.

We eat our own too. I still remember last decade when PLENTY of pilots (even ALPA Officers) wished US Airways would just bite the dust and go away after their 2nd BKcy in hopes it would help stabilize the industry.


No US citizen who got hired for the 787 at FLL ever got fully checked out to fly those routes and “stab ALPA pilots in the back.” The PVD/SWF 737 operation was extremely small with a limited amount (handful) of US pilots flying that operation. In the overall context it was pretty much negligible. I love the hypocrisy of mainline pilots. The problem is Norwegian apparently. Not regional airlines flying up to 50% of your domestic routes in your mainline colors at 1/3 the wage.
 

Kingairer

'Tiger Team' Member
Well nice to see you gloat about airline pilots losing their jobs in this country. Today it’s them. Someday it could be you, and then we’ll see how your “nah” attitude is.

We eat our own too. I still remember last decade when PLENTY of pilots (even ALPA Officers) wished US Airways would just bite the dust and go away after their 2nd BKcy in hopes it would help stabilize the industry.


No US citizen who got hired for the 787 at FLL ever got fully checked out to fly those routes and “stab ALPA pilots in the back.” The PVD/SWF 737 operation was extremely small with a limited amount (handful) of US pilots flying that operation. In the overall context it was pretty much negligible. I love the hypocrisy of mainline pilots. The problem is Norwegian apparently. Not regional airlines flying up to 50% of your domestic routes in your mainline colors at 1/3 the wage.
They knew they were going to work for a scum ball operator being used as pawns in a flag of convenience operation. They took the risk in order to be "transatlantic jet pilots" and it looks like its not going to work out. Theyll be fine, everyone is hiring.
 

Screaming_Emu

Dogsheep
They knew they were going to work for a scum ball operator being used as pawns in a flag of convenience operation. They took the risk in order to be "transatlantic jet pilots" and it looks like its not going to work out. Theyll be fine, everyone is hiring.
ESPECIALLY in this hiring climate. It’s one thing to be like “Gojet is the only one hiring so that’s where I ended up.” But nowadays there are better options unless you really suck at life.
 

Cherokee_Cruiser

Well-Known Member
They knew they were going to work for a scum ball operator being used as pawns in a flag of convenience operation. They took the risk in order to be "transatlantic jet pilots" and it looks like its not going to work out. Theyll be fine, everyone is hiring.
US based employees here losing their jobs. You make it sound like these people turned down Delta, United, and American in order to hold out or go directly to Norwegian. Let’s get real. Its because the hiring at the big 5 is basically a joke now that people can’t even get calls so they go where the first bite is.


ESPECIALLY in this hiring climate. It’s one thing to be like “Gojet is the only one hiring so that’s where I ended up.” But nowadays there are better options unless you really suck at life.
Because getting a call at United/Delta/American/Fedex/UPS is so easy. Do you really believe these pilots skipped over a job at the big 5 in order to go to Norwegian? More like, well, the big 5 aren’t calling, but here’s one chance I have.....”


Not all of them are newbies. One pilot at Norwegian 737 at PVD is ex-Delta Air Lines. The PVD/SWF bases have pilots from all over the place in terms of experience and backgrounds.
 
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Screaming_Emu

Dogsheep
US based employees here losing their jobs. You make it sound like these people turned down Delta, United, and American in order to hold out or go directly to Norwegian. Let’s get real. Its because the hiring at the big 5 is basically a joke now that people can’t even get calls so they go where the first bite is.




Because getting a call at United/Delta/American/Fedex/UPS is so easy. Do you really believe these pilots skipped over a job at the big 5 in order to go to Norwegian? More like, well, the big 5 aren’t calling, but here’s one chance I have.....”


Not all of them are newbies. One pilot at Norwegian 737 at PVD is ex-Delta Air Lines. The PVD/SWF bases have pilots from all over the place in terms of experience and backgrounds.
Meh.
 

Cherokee_Cruiser

Well-Known Member
Maybe I’m jaded. I’m glad we voted in ALPA and the timing was just in time before a merger. But let’s not forget ALPA’s “OMG! Foreign ownership! Branson is going to destroy US airlines!”


To me, the bigger flag of convenience is the kind of flying we all did. The regionals. Example. Delta flies an A320 DTW-PIT with a mainline crew making X dollars. 2 hrs later the next flight is a flag of convenience called Delta Connection, a CRJ-200 flying the same route, the same passengers, under the same mainline colors for 1/3 of X dollars. So regional airlines can fly for 1/3 the wages of mainline pilots and do up to 50% of the domestic flying, but literally like 20 to 30 US pilot flying a 737 or 787 from a US base to Europe is the big boogeyman.

The business model doesn’t work. Norwegian low cost, WOW, Primera, Monarch all failed or are failing. The problem will solve itself.
 

Screaming_Emu

Dogsheep
These are jobs that if they did not exist would give way to more US aviation jobs that are actually worth a crap.

Like if Walmart went away people would have to shop at stores that don’t require their employees to use welfare.

THATS why we care.
 

Cherokee_Cruiser

Well-Known Member
These are jobs that if they did not exist would give way to more US aviation jobs that are actually worth a crap.

Like if Walmart went away people would have to shop at stores that don’t require their employees to use welfare.

THATS why we care.

But why not look at the symptom? Walmart exists because we Americans are cheap asses and demand Walmart prices while turning a blind eye and accepting Walmart wages. The ULCC across the world cater to that same demand. The consumers are to blame.
 

Screaming_Emu

Dogsheep
But why not look at the symptom? Walmart exists because we Americans are cheap asses and demand Walmart prices while turning a blind eye and accepting Walmart wages. The ULCC across the world cater to that same demand. The consumers are to blame.
I thought “the model doesn’t work and the problem will fix itself.”
 

Flagship_dxer

Legacy Airline Dispatcher
I thought “the model doesn’t work and the problem will fix itself.”
Regardless if the business model hasnt worked so far, there will be always someone that comes along to try to be the one to try to make it work because there is a market for cheapskates who want nearly free travel.

Likewise, if walmart went out of business people wouldnt all of a sudden start paying more for what they used to buy at walmart. Someone else would step in and fill the void.

Of course the government could step in and force businesses to charge certain prices and pay certain wages but we all know how that system ends up.
 

Inverted

#inspirationing
I don’t mean to get into the politics of it. I simply said I feel bad for any US citizen losing their pilot job in this country.
I honestly don't know the differences between the two sides that's why I asked. I know the 787 side is underpaying foreign workers, and flag of convenience issues but I didn't really know how the 737 side worked.
 

Inverted

#inspirationing
Maybe I’m jaded. I’m glad we voted in ALPA and the timing was just in time before a merger. But let’s not forget ALPA’s “OMG! Foreign ownership! Branson is going to destroy US airlines!”
Yea, it's hard to work for the company now, that was instrumental in preventing our DOT approval at VX in the beginning lol.
 

pianokeys

MEL NO MUFFS
people can’t even get calls so they go where the first bite is.

Because getting a call at United/Delta/American/Fedex/UPS is so easy. Do you really believe these pilots skipped over a job at the big 5 in order to go to Norwegian? More like, well, the big 5 aren’t calling, but here’s one chance I have.....”.
Mans gotta eat.

Cant blame a guy for wanting to feed his family, but this is where I have a problem making an opinion on this.

These are jobs that if they did not exist would give way to more US aviation jobs that are actually worth a crap.
They knew they were going to work for a scum ball operator being used as pawns in a flag of convenience operation. They took the risk in order to be "transatlantic jet pilots" and it looks like its not going to work out. Theyll be fine, everyone is hiring.
Canada is a micro example of a macro issue in aviation.

Too many people, especially thanks to Ice Pilots NWT, are willing to take poop jobs at poop operators who force them to work the ramp for a year. Thats total poop. All because the operator promises them time, at the cost of minimum wage. People also lined up to fly for Swoop because they were promised left seat off the street and a type on the 737 which is, in my opinion, a golden ticket. Especially now since Big Red is going to the 737.

The trade off? Your soul, well, and everyone elses soul. Poopy companies pray on those who want time and ratings by offering them something at a much reduced rate and people bite because they either need it now, want it now, dont know, or all of the above. Leads to total industry wage dilution. I think prospective employees NEED to research a company before they apply and understand all of the ramifications because, although a mans gotta eat, taking a job at less than industry wage just proves people are willing to sell their time and skill for that price. And soon other operators have to follow suit to maintain financial competitiveness. The antidote? Reject underpaying jobs, force the demand for your skill and time to be equal to the industry standard.

In other news, I highly doubt ULCC overseas will be a real thing for much longer. ULCCs are really only good for short flying, WestJet tried the ULCC long haul stuff from YYC-LGW and it made the news consistently up here on how poopy it was. Now WestJet has rebranded itself and has pods now... So much for ULCC/LCC international flying. Passengers did not know what they were getting in to.
 
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