Allegiant 60 Minutes Investigation

Cptnchia

Dissatisfied Customer
#41
especially if acquiring “cats and dogs” from numerous airlines around the world from jurisdictions that may not have the strictest maintenance regulations. That’s not a good baseline to start off from and can be problematic.
Yet, other US airlines that do that same exact thing don’t have the same issues as Alliegant. The answer is simple. They take the time and spend the money to make sure the airplanes meet their standards. Apparently, Alliegant has lower standards. Way lower. Like maybe 3rd world standards.
 

Ecl!pse

Well-Known Member
#43
Yet, other US airlines that do that same exact thing don’t have the same issues as Alliegant. The answer is simple. They take the time and spend the money to make sure the airplanes meet their standards. Apparently, Alliegant has lower standards. Way lower. Like maybe 3rd world standards.
No argument that the numbers and data at ALGT are concerning - there’s just no way around it. Plenty of carriers maintain older aircraft without issue so there seems to be more to the story. The elevator story is particularly alarming, though it seems that was the mistake of a reputable and widely used maintenance provider in the US.

That said, they’ve been by far the most aggressive in sourcing/acquiring used airplanes. The US4 don’t really come that close - with the exception of a few of the DAL MD90’s, nobody is really buying one-off used aircraft from around the world for the purpose of flying except ALGT. The focus tends to be on large sister-ship fleets (10+) from reputable carriers. The exception for one-off used purchases would be a need for parts - i.e. the aircraft would be purchased and torn down for parts, like the DAL 777-200 a year or two ago.
 

tomokc

Well-Known Member
#44
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, but I'm beginning to think you work there and are trolling us. I didn't know there were leased vs new Airbuses there. :tinfoil:

As to your mx question, have you seen this?

"Former Allegiant Air Mechanic: This Airline is Dangerous"
http://www.tampabay.com/news/busine...says-he-quit-over-obscene-maintenance/2260591
Eh, maybe sketchy stuff does happen there. I wouldn't know. Maybe it happens at other carriers too. Although I'm sure the FAA is pretty strict on 121 carriers, so I don't feel like one is less safe the other. Maintenance issues and write ups can be attributed to a old leased fleet, in my opinion. If they're messing up new Airbus's in a few years maybe my opinion will change. I don't look at Allegiant at an airport and say "it's only a matter of time". That's just my opinion though.
@tcco94 In the interest of full disclosure and because trolling has been mentioned, would you mind clarifying if you have - or have had - any association with Allegiant, its affiliates or vendors?
 

SeanD

Well-Known Member
#45
@tcco94 In the interest of full disclosure and because trolling has been mentioned, would you mind clarifying if you have - or have had - any association with Allegiant, its affiliates or vendors?
I think he's probably more of an enthusiast than anything. It doesn't appear he even watched the episode either.
 

tcco94

Professional GTA V Pilot
#49
In every comment I've been open to being proven wrong. Yet, nobody has any dirt to fork out. Have you seen the operation inside Allegiant? Show me how they're getting away with things illegally. All I'm getting back is different opinions...
 

SFLAX

Well-Known Member
#50
Not so much illegal, it’s that they are unsafe, in the terms of safety management, they have 100 jets and 3.5 times the incident rate, think about what that would look like with a 1000 jets, almost an issue a day, considered major by the FAA. The FAA is there not only to enforce illegal or legal things, but overall safety. And based on what is know now, it is not safe compared to all the others. I believe based on what I have seen they are under reporting stuff now. It’s like the crime rates in major cities, back in the day they would look at let’s say a shooting and say, oh it was an argument, so it was domestic related, but the argument was related to a drug deal.
 

tcco94

Professional GTA V Pilot
#56
Can’t post dirt if there isn’t any dirt...

Faa’s Response to 60 Minutes.

https://www.faa.gov/news/updates/?newsId=90084
So far they've cut in half their incidents from 15 to 18 per 1000 departures. Which is what I was talking about when I said they've seemed to make things better, considering they were flying a lot of junk around in 15.

I'm all for the discussion to change my opinion on Allegiant. I use to have the same thought process that they were a dangerous operation waiting for a catastrophic event. It just appears to me they've fixed a lot of issues.
 

tcco94

Professional GTA V Pilot
#58
@tcco94 In the interest of full disclosure and because trolling has been mentioned, would you mind clarifying if you have - or have had - any association with Allegiant, its affiliates or vendors?
Who's calling me a troll? Is that a joke? I think I've been around here long enough to not be called a troll. Unless that's someone that's sensitive I don't agree with their opinion. I came into here to have a discussion about the episode. Yes @SeanD I did watch the episode. I've also read the articles on Allegiant for the past 3 years or so bashing the airline.


I have worked for Allegiant, but not in the flight ops or maintenance department. Pretty irrelevant to this conversation though, I didn't come in here acting like I know whats going on in that operation. I just said from what I can see, things have been improving. I also don't think they're breaking the law as a 121 operator. I have numerous colleagues at Allegiant and I've been absolutely embarrassed when getting in this argument that Allegiant is a terrible airline (saying exactly what you guys are saying). I've seen improvement there just from my outside perspective. Then again, this isn't about me or a personal conversation. I asked if anyone has insider knowledge about Allegiant that they care to share to show they are not improving their airline?

This is an open forum, yeah? How is my avistion professional opinion being marked as a troll because I'm not grabbing my pitch fork? I consider mostly everyone here to be my online friends. I came in with an open mind to be educated. That's why I'm here. Educate me and network.
 
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tcco94

Professional GTA V Pilot
#59
He is like an A.nutter hanging around on JC instead of airliners.nut
You don't even know me. Lol. So I disagree and I'm now an "enthusiast" and "airliner.net" nut. Go back to APC. Instead of discussing with me it's gotten personal now. Classic.
 

Inverted

#inspirationing
#60
Be careful...when you point a finger, three more are pointing back at you.

Not sayin' anything, just sayin'. The nerf bat comes for us all at some point....
Welcome to the court of public opinion. If the FAA wants to sit on their hands and do nothing, then pieces like this can show the public what is really going on, and they can choose whether or not to book them.

Do I think Allegiant has a target on its back and maybe had some instances of unfair treatment or criticism? Yea maybe..

Do I think they have had some serious issues with regard to MX and cover ups, and procedural issues like firing captains who call for an evac because of how it reflects on the company? Absolutely!

Allegiant isn’t going to just change their ingrained culture out of thin air.

Until the CEO publicly admits egregious issues and gross negligence by him and management, as well as a public apology to the captain he fired, and reinstating his job immediately, I will not for one second, entertain the idea that a tiger has changed its stripes.
 
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