Airplanes and noise complaints come together....literally.

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
Here's the deal. You've all probably heard my Copaman-style rants and postings about the airplane noise complaints at Scottsdale Airport, AZ.

Well, the situation is hitting home....smack dab in my backyard, literally.

For those of you familiar with the greater PHX metro area, I recently purchased a home in the far southeast valley, located about 15 miles south of Williams Gateway Airport (former Williams AFB) just inside Pinal County. The home is in a community called Johnson Ranch, and can be classified as fairly upscale. Most of JR is complete with the exception of the southern side, which is one of the final phases to be completed. My home was recently completed, and closed on in January. The dilemma is this: For any of you that have a PHX sectional you can follow along. About 8 miles south of the subdivision, a Military Training Route known as VR-269 runs east to west. I've personally flown VR-269 many times (almost as many as VR-239 north of the PHX area). The dimensions of the route at the point it crosses south of the subdivision is 4 miles north/ 3 miles south of centerline, down to 500 AGL. A couple of the my new neighbors in subdivision were recently overheard to have made comments/complaints about "the noisy military jets that fly low to the south, what do they think they're doing there?" etc.

Now, since I live in that subdivision, I want to nip this crap in the bud forthwith. Since I'm also one of the culprits they'd be referring to, I want to figure out how best to do this? None of them really know who I am or what I do (they've obviously never met me), so how to do this? Should I run for the homeowners association? Sort of "have the criminal on the committee?" Or when I return, should I schedule that VR-route as often as I can in my remaining A-10 flights just to piss them off, then come back home and enjoy the complaints? Maybe a "yeah, I saw the plane earlier today....that was me. How did it look? BTW.. you're sleeping safely tonight, so piss off" How to educate these nitwits?
 

pilot602

If specified, this will replace the title that
I'd print up flyers with a few pics of you in "action" in Iraq, in the hog, with something along the lines "Your friendly NEIGHBORHOOD fighter pilot fighting to keep you SAFE and, oh, by the way, I fly those 'noisey military jets' to south" printed on the top in big, bold typeface. And at the bottom "Please address any concerns to (your address here)"

That should shut 'em up.
 

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
[ QUOTE ]
OPTION B!!!


[/ QUOTE ]

Problem with Option B is that it's not very "becoming of a military officer.."

Then again.....that's assuming I care about that.
 

P38

Well-Known Member
Just out of curiousity, Mike, would that be considered Chandler, or is your new pad farther south than that like maybe Queen Creek (I'm ignorant of the PHX area for the most part)?

Just curious as the future wife and I look at homes in the Eastern part of le valley all the time. It's pretty shocking what you can get for your money down there compared to up here in Seattle.....
 

pilot602

If specified, this will replace the title that
Queen Creek ... Chandler is basically due south from Phoenix proper.
 

Falcon

New Member
[ QUOTE ]

Problem with Option B is that it's not very "becoming of a military officer.."

[/ QUOTE ]


.....OPTION B!!!


-Falcon
 

JEP

Malko In Charge
Staff member
maybe a low level bombing run, dropping flyers instead:

"my ability to practice, allows you the freedom to b$%^ about it"

"the airway was here long before your house"

I can just see it now when you have the neighborhood summer block party..

neighbor: "Hi, my name is Steve, I work for company xyz as V.P. of Finance.
Neighbor: " Those G$% D$%%, military jets are making so much noise. I cannot wait to get them out of here.
Neighbor: " I'm sorry, your name was? And what is it that you do?"
MikeD: "I'm MikeD and I get respect... I fly those G$% D$%# planes. Enjoy your freedom!"


<MikeD exits party, as Mr. V.P. stands there and looks dumbfounded>
 

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
[ QUOTE ]
Just out of curiousity, Mike, would that be considered Chandler, or is your new pad farther south than that like maybe Queen Creek (I'm ignorant of the PHX area for the most part)?

Just curious as the future wife and I look at homes in the Eastern part of le valley all the time. It's pretty shocking what you can get for your money down there compared to up here in Seattle.....

[/ QUOTE ]

Would be considered about 15 miles southeast of Chandler, and 5 miles south of Queen Creek/Maricopa County. It's located in unincorporated county land 5 miles inside Pinal County.

Funny thing about VR-269 is that it's not used very often, maybe 4-6 flights per day. It's owned by Davis-Monthan AFB (the scheduling authority for it), so I have ready-access to it's activity rates, unlike VR-239 which is owned by Luke AFB, and I have to call them to schedule it. Any squadron can schedule it's use. The way MTRs work, there's numerous points (A, B, C etc) along the route that break it into route segments (basically the turn points for those looking at sectionals). There are certain points where you can enter the route, exit the route, or both; you're not always required to start at the beginning. When you schedule a route, you give the entry/exit times and locations on the route to the scheduling authority. But the best thing about me knowing when it's active is, in order to make Option B most effective, I can fly the portion of the route that goes south of the subdivision (points Delta to Echo) and since both these points are alternate entry/exit points, I can legally fly the route, and when I get to point E, exit the route, climb, go back to point D, reenter the route at 500 AGL, proceed to point E, exit the route, and repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat, to my hearts content and allowable fuel. Since D and E are only about 12 miles apart, I could find a day the route isn't being used and have some real fun....errr.....training.
 

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
[ QUOTE ]
maybe a low level bombing run, dropping flyers instead:

"my ability to practice, allows you the freedom to b$%^ about it"

"the airway was here long before your house"

I can just see it now when you have the neighborhood summer block party..

neighbor: "Hi, my name is Steve, I work for company xyz as V.P. of Finance.
Neighbor: " Those G$% D$%%, military jets are making so much noise. I cannot wait to get them out of here.
Neighbor: " I'm sorry, your name was? And what is it that you do?"
MikeD: "I'm MikeD and I get respect... I fly those G$% D$%# planes. Enjoy your freedom!"


<MikeD exits party, as Mr. V.P. stands there and looks dumbfounded>

[/ QUOTE ]

That's almost why Option A would be hilarious.....because [as one of the board members of the homeowners association, or God-forbid the President, I'd be the one the complaints come to during the meetings!

Now THAT would be riot the way I'd envision handling the fielding of those complaints. That way, no one could truly bitch, since I'm only one homeowner arguing with another.

Would be the fox guarding the henhouse!


Them: "Is there anyone we can complain to about those damn noisy military jets? I hate them"

Me (option 1): "Sure...I'll get right on it......but in the meantime, I'd take the minute to enjoy the sound of freedom. BTW, did I disturb your beauty sleep yesterday morning? So sorry jerkoff!

Me (option 2): "Don't know if I'd piss those guys off...I've heard that they have intel on people that complain like that.....and you know.....I've heard of people disappearing..........somehow, they know where people live......"
 

Grumpy01

New Member
I would suggest that you run for the homeowners position. Once there, have a flyer made up showing the VR and the date it was put in place.

Then use the position you are in to explain that the young men & women who fly the route have to get the practice in order to survive in actual combat. Use your own experiences to amplify this fact.

Stress that you will try to work with the controling agency and limit flights to between say 0900 and 1800. Or whatever is nessary to accomplish your mission.

The argument that "we the military were here first" has been proven not to work so many times in the past it is useless to even waste time trying it anymore.

Failing that, let me know when a house can be bought for a lot less than it is worth just because of the VR.
 

Sprint100

Well-Known Member
Personally, I'd stay calm and quiet. Only one person needs to know your name and occupation because by the end of the week everyone and their distant relatives will know. Watch the hate, etc. turn into curiosity about why the military jocks fly those routes.
 

Mike Lewis

Shadow Administrator
Staff member
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
OPTION B!!!


[/ QUOTE ]

Problem with Option B is that it's not very "becoming of a military officer.."

Then again.....that's assuming I care about that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey, Yossarian, when HAVE you been the poster-perfect military officer?
 

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
OPTION B!!!


[/ QUOTE ]

Problem with Option B is that it's not very "becoming of a military officer.."

Then again.....that's assuming I care about that.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey, Yossarian, when HAVE you been the poster-perfect military officer?


[/ QUOTE ]

Great book that Catch-22. I'm pretty close to that Yossarian........over here, they're trying to kill me too....not just because it's combat, but because they have something personal against ME!


Yeah, you ain't kidding. Always love screwing with the academy grads I run into. One told me he was #145 from his class....guess that's respectable or something. I told him I was #72. Surprised, he asked which class? I said class of '98. He says no-kidding, I don't remember seeing you around. Conversation goes like this:

him: 98, huh...do remember so and so?
me: nope
him: do you remember this person?
me: never heard of them
him: do you remember so and so?
me: nope

(this exchange goes on for about 8 names of 1998 grads, to where he finally asks "what squadron were you in?" Squadron 3, I answer. "And you were #73, I'm sure I' would've remembered you?" "yeah....I was Officer Training School....#73 out of 75, class 98-02.

Pisses them off......
 

tonyw

Well-Known Member
If someone complains about the noise to you, Mike, I'd say something like, "you know, the training that the folks get when they fly there helps save a lot of lives. Including mine."

You'll very quickly see them change their tune. How can you complain about a little airplane noise when someone standing right in front of you says that the training from flying that route may have saved their life?
 
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