Advice and Jetcareers dot com

Derg

Cap, Roci
Staff member
The following is a snippet from a closed thread:

[ QUOTE ]
It looks like other people had no problem catering their advice to the fact that we haven't given ALL information. I don't think advice should only be offered so long as the person is willing to disloce all information. Is that what you tell friends that ask for advice?

[/ QUOTE ]

I tend to think of a person asking advice on a forum is looking for experienced answers, rather than validation of their pre-concieved (and usually false) assertions.

There's a wealth of experience on the website and if you present us with partial information, rebuke 99.999% of the responses and then rebuke us all with the statement that we're either not privy to all of the information or haven't been given it, is wrong.

We're pilots. We're given a set of variables and have to come up with the best conclusion in order to operate safely.

One can't ask, "Hey, you've lost an engine, how do you react?" (advice seeker)

"Well, I'd follow the engine-out procedures, and return for a landing". (advice giver)

"Wrong. Umm, the airport's closed" (advice seeker)

"I'd continue to an alternate" (advice giver)

"No gas to reach the alternate!" (advice seeker)

"I'd land on the road" (advice giver)

"No roads, umm, you've just departed a desert island and the runway exploded" (advice seeker)

"Well, I'd fly as long as I could towards the nearest known airport, navigable fix or distinguishable landmark, broadcast on 121.5 of your position and situation and ditch in the water when the remaining fuel runs out" (advice giver)

"You can't swim and your radio is inop" (advice seeker).

Are you starting to get the gist of what I'm talking about?


But to answer the question, if my best friend in the world asked me advice about something, I'm going to tell him the honest to goodness truth considering the information he gave me. He knows better than to ask me if he doesn't truly want my opinion

The people here giving you advice have "Been there, done that, bought the book, the t-shirt, attended the convention" yadda yadda yadda.
 

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
That's the problem I ran into. I took the info given, and returned the best answer I could give with the information at hand. Only to get into the whole "not an option" debate. Of course, had I known that before, I wouldn't have wasted brain bytes on that subject. It does help to be presented with the scenario and a little background, rather than having to pry every detail of info out bit by bit.

Same would've helped if, when presenting oneself as a wife that supports anything her husband wants to do aviation-career wise, said wife would've listed what the read-the-fine-print limits were to that support, ala military option. Funny thing is, that is what he's said he wants to do...

10 bucks says the Sanford thread(s) would've only been 1-2 pages max had these simple ideas been the case.
 

Derg

Cap, Roci
Staff member
I dunno, the last few weeks have been a lesson in "help me justify my predispositions about the airline world" regardless of input from major and regional fo's, captains, cfi's, etc.

Confusing!
 

junkstream

Well-Known Member
Michelle:

I could not reply to your reply in the "Who's in Sanford Thread." I assume Doug put the thread out of its misery--not that I'm complaining.

I was way off base in my assumptions about the financing of your husband's training. I was going to apologize for that, but I changed my mind. Like I said, you cannot expect truly helpful advice unless you tell the WHOLE story.

Of course you can ask for advice without telling the whole story. And obviously plenty of us will give our opinion. You should be able to tell that you don't even need to ask for opinions around here, they're like . . . well you know the rest


And of course I would give a friend advice if they asked for it--even if they kept important information about the situation from me. AND I would tell them the same thing I'm telling you. You're going to get advice whether or not you disclose all information. However, the validity of that advice is compromised unless the advice giver has all the facts. We're a long way from that in your situation.

You'd never go to a lawyer, doctor, or CPA and ask for their professional services without telling them all the facts. You may not think it important to tell your MD that you had a strange reaction to an antibiotic thirty years ago, but it might be important to the situation and the MD should be the judge of the relevance, not you.

You've done the same thing here, you've come to a group of professionals and asked advice without telling the whole story. Of course it's your life and your business, just don't get upset if the advice is way off base (like mine) because we're left guessing about the situation.

Good luck.
 

Eagle

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
"No roads, umm, you've just departed a desert island and the runway exploded"

[/ QUOTE ]

As *IF* I would fly off a desert island... well maybe if the cocktail girls ran out of rum, so it Could happen...
 

tomek_vector

New Member
thank you everyone for all the advise though.
the responses were great i thought. it's just just a bummer it took a Monty Python smelling event to fertilize it :>
 

TheWife

New Member
The very first original stinking question was who's in Sanford and what can you tell me about the area. I DID NOT solicit the 6000 anti-DCA opinions that followed so no, I did not ask for advice without giving the whole situtation. When the converstation turned I gave what information I was comfortable giving in order to help some of you understand that we were ruling out those options for a reason, not just cause. Why does this keep turning into a discussion about me, my inablity to present all information, and my desire to not have a husband in the military? I don't see the people that suggested we go to DCA or FSI complaining that I am not willing to accept advice. The only people complaining are the ones we didn't take advice from. Well we can't take ALL the advice. We can't go to DCA, AND an FBO, and ATP so SOMEONE'S advice is NOT going to get taken. I can't believe the amount of discussion you are having about me and how and what I was willing to talk about. If my friend asked me for advice, I would give an answer or two based on what I know, and if that wouldn't work, I'd either offer another suggestion or leave it be. I wouldn't sit there and try to make her look like and ass for not being willing to go into full details. I am done with discussions of schools or FBO or whatever until we get back from our tours. There is nothing that is going to stop us from TOURING the schools so there is really not anything we make decisions about until we are back. Accept that not all advice applies to us and quit spending so much energy on the reasons why. Thanks to your input we ruled out the PFT so we ARE listening. Geez.
 

Eagle

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
Thanks to your input we ruled out the PFT so we ARE listening.

[/ QUOTE ]

Everyone pays for training one way or the other....

But the overriding criticism you have seen (some has been moderated out) is that when presented with a position, no matter the reasoning, you have taken the contrary upon the posting.

No big deal.

In all honestly no one on here is going to care if you succeed (your hubb) or not.

I have some curiosity, it is the train wreck mentality. "hey lets watch this"

Because negating PFT may be a great first step in your case, but none of it is going to make a bit of difference if your hubb doesn't finish college first. It is throwing good money after bad.

But alas money isn't the issue.

If he ignores this, fine. Happy landings.

Again it doesn't matter to any of us.. They are usually hiring at the Waffle House anyway.

(btw they have waffle houses in Florida, in case you wondered)
 

TheWife

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
But the overriding criticism you have seen (some has been moderated out) is that when presented with a position, no matter the reasoning, you have taken the contrary upon the posting.

[/ QUOTE ] Let's see, we were presented with a position that ATP and Gulfstream was not the way to go, and we listened. We were presented with the position that FSI may be more favorable then DCA, again, listened. Like I said, we can't please everyone and take all the advice, some of it isn't going to work. Oh well. Again, the people who suggested that DCA or FSI would be a great choice, AREN'T complaining.

This is how these conversations have been going:

"Should I wear the pink shirt or the blue shirt?"

"Why are you wearing a shirt?"

"Because that's what I want to wear, I just don't know which color"

"I think you should wear a turtle neck."

"Why should I wear a turtleneck, I want to wear a shirt."

"Fine, wear a shirt, but I know that it gets cold sometimes, I have been outside before, more then you have, so I know that you will probably get cold. But you won't listen to me so wear a shirt."

"It's not that I won't listen, I don't think I own a turtle neck, and it wouldn't match my pants."

"Well it's not my fault you didn't tell me upfront that you don't own one, you didn't give me all the details."

"So, should I wear the pink shirt or the blue shirt?"

"How about a sweater..."

See where I am going here?
 

Eagle

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
"How about a sweater..."

See where I am going here?

[/ QUOTE ]

But we are going swimming.

See where I am going?
 

TheWife

New Member
Well if we are going swimming maybe you have suggested a swim suit instead of a turtle neck.

How long you wanna keep playing this?
 

Eagle

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
Well if we are going swimming maybe you have suggested a swim suit instead of a turtle neck.


[/ QUOTE ]

That is the point.

BUT YOU JUST DON'T GET IT

to use your anology

EVERYONE IS TELLING YOU THAT YOU ARE GOING SWIMMING YOU JUST IGNORE IT.
 

TheWife

New Member
OK, Eagle. I am taking the advice of others and going to tour some schools. SO I am ignoring YOUR advice. I am a bad bad person and shouldn't have even tried to get advice since I wasn't going to listen to the all mighty eagle and his over ruling opinions. Why is YOUR suggestion more right then others? No EVERYONE is NOT telling me something that I am ignoring. You said yourself no one cares what happens to my husband and his career so give it a rest.

I prefer at the end of the day to try to help when and where I can, who ever I can. You prefer to disect people's comments to tell them why they are wrong and you are right and that there is no other option. I am glad I am not the only one you do that to, or I'd just think it was me you didn't like.
 

Eagle

New Member
[ QUOTE ]
OK, Eagle. I am taking the advice of others and going to tour some schools. SO I am ignoring YOUR advice.

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh I thought I posted...

[ QUOTE ]
If you have someone else picking up the tab, and you want to get out of Utah where you hate it, and away from your in-laws, and stay with your parents (his in-laws btw), so you don't need to work and help your husband and family achieve the goal, sounds like a win win.
Best part is it sounds like you may be the over all winner, you will be getting what you want, regardless if it is a better oppurtunity or not for your husband.

[/ QUOTE ]

stop being so defensive. you get back input from what you provide. Want more detailed suggestions offer more insight, want less, offer less kinda simple.

If he doesn't finish college he may be able to land a job, as I also said there are some success stories along that line as well.

Plus aviation is not all pilots, I know no college graduates who are fueling our airplanes cleaning the lavs or providing the catering.

We all make choices, or have them made for us in some instances... either way there are plenty of options.
 
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