737 Max Airliners Ordered Immediately Grounded in the US

NovemberEcho

Dergs favorite member
Of course. I saw it on Facebook too.

Even after some test engineers said "Nah, y'aint gettin' outta DAT!"

Thank goodness the crew wasn't all female or all Navy, there would be a heated discussion on that in some circles.
Do we know for sure they weren’t ex Ethiopian Navy?
 

trafficinsight

Well-Known Member
Of course. I saw it on Facebook too.

Even after some test engineers said "Nah, y'aint gettin' outta DAT!"

Thank goodness the crew wasn't all female or all Navy, there would be a heated discussion on that in some circles.
Dang I missed my chance to say "The captain was male, not saying it mattered, just pointing it out."

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
 

Autothrust Blue

"I’d make a suggestion but you won’t listen”
Good grief Boeing. At this point I think they should call it a day and retire the 737 program.
I do wonder, what with MCAS as implemented violating one part of Part 25, how compliance with the remainder of Part 25 re: handling and stability will be achieved with MCAS losing its mojo.
 

chrisreedrules

Master Blaster
It’s always easy to armchair quarterback these things...

I had an emergency in January that was quasi serious. One thing these reports never do a good job of is relaying the circumstances. Having an emergency on a 5AM first flight of the day not even an hour after you woke up is different (to me) than one on leg 2 or 3 at 4:00PM. We handled it just fine but it definitely gives you a new perspective about these things. The answers aren’t always so black and white.
 

Autothrust Blue

"I’d make a suggestion but you won’t listen”
It’s always easy to armchair quarterback these things...
Did you have a real point?

The answers aren’t always so black and white.
*sigh* This one is. The design is defective and its handling characteristics have been band-aided over.

After the first accident, the damn things should have been grounded until such time as pilots were retrained and the system modified (like, the things they're doing now, though again, one wonders how neutering a system that doesn't comply with Part 25 because the rest of the airplane sans the system doesn't comply with Part 25 is going to make the totality of the system comply with Part 25 [five times fast]).

The "emergency AD" reminding people of the existing procedure (itself only partially applicable) was simply regulatory ass-covering on the part of an FAA thoroughly captured by the industry and the delay in the FAA taking decisive action to ground a defective product post-Ethiopian severely damaged its credibility.
 

trafficinsight

Well-Known Member
Did you have a real point?


*sigh* This one is. The design is defective and its handling characteristics have been band-aided over.

After the first accident, the damn things should have been grounded until such time as pilots were retrained and the system modified (like, the things they're doing now, though again, one wonders how neutering a system that doesn't comply with Part 25 because the rest of the airplane sans the system doesn't comply with Part 25 is going to make the totality of the system comply with Part 25 [five times fast]).

The "emergency AD" reminding people of the existing procedure (itself only partially applicable) was simply regulatory ass-covering on the part of an FAA thoroughly captured by the industry and the delay in the FAA taking decisive action to ground a defective product post-Ethiopian severely damaged its credibility.
You keep saying that but you still don't seem to understand how certification works...

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Cherokee_Cruiser

Well-Known Member
Of course. I saw it on Facebook too.

Even after some test engineers said "Nah, y'aint gettin' outta DAT!"

Thank goodness the crew wasn't all female or all Navy, there would be a heated discussion on that in some circles.

It’s sad that even in 2019 there are pilots here (US) who don’t believe that it was Boeing or training faults, it’s 4 brown pilots who crashed. And when they say it wouldn’t have happened here, from the tone you can tell what they mean is white pilots. It’s implied racism.

Same guy who told me he wouldn’t put his family on ANY airline in Africa except South African Airways......
 

Kingairer

'Tiger Team' Member
It’s sad that even in 2019 there are pilots here (US) who don’t believe that it was Boeing or training faults, it’s 4 brown pilots who crashed. And when they say it wouldn’t have happened here, from the tone you can tell what they mean is white pilots. It’s implied racism.

Same guy who told me he wouldn’t put his family on ANY airline in Africa except South African Airways......
I dont think its racism at all. Its pilots. Pilots from the Navy think theyre better than Air Force. Pilots from regional airline A think they are better then regional airline pilot B. Pilots for a western major airline are going to think they are better than pilots from a third world country or any of those russian airlines. "Through these doors walk....."
 

FlyingAccountant

Well-Known Member
Lion Air definitely wasn't about brown people. There are easily justifiable reasons to be weary of that airline, not the least of which was being banned from flying in the EU for safety reasons until relatively recently. They were averaging a WFU accident every year not too long ago.

But this is all sort of irrelevant. Boeing shouldn't have designed an airplane capable of crashing itself and the FAA should have never allowed Boeing to police and certify itself.
 

MikeD

Administrator
Staff member
I was trying to figure this out yesterday. Do they get an override on th MAX?
Am not certain how this plays out. Isn’t their contract between them (the union) and SWA, not between the union and Boeing? Would the union have a case against a third party?
 
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