Oxygen, how many of you ?

[sate]

I know it depends on ALT

You have to leave the flight deck to take care of business. You call the FA up front. Do you, or you FO go on Oxygen ?

I can only remember 1 time that a CA had the mask on when I entered the FD, and he told me that it was a RULE in case something went wrong, he then asked me if I knew how to put the mask on ? He would only move the mask to talk to me then put it back on.


Sate

[falconvalley]

Here you go The red text is a "Cliff Notes" version for above 350 with quick dons

Title 14: Aeronautics and Space
PART 91—GENERAL OPERATING AND FLIGHT RULES
Subpart C—Equipment, Instrument, and Certificate Requirements


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§ 91.211 Supplemental oxygen.

(a) General.No person may operate a civil aircraft of U.S. registry—
(1) At cabin pressure altitudes above 12,500 feet (MSL) up to and including 14,000 feet (MSL) unless the required minimum flight crew is provided with and uses supplemental oxygen for that part of the flight at those altitudes that is of more than 30 minutes duration;
(2) At cabin pressure altitudes above 14,000 feet (MSL) unless the required minimum flight crew is provided with and uses supplemental oxygen during the entire flight time at those altitudes; and
(3) At cabin pressure altitudes above 15,000 feet (MSL) unless each occupant of the aircraft is provided with supplemental oxygen.
(b) Pressurized cabin aircraft. (1) No person may operate a civil aircraft of U.S. registry with a pressurized cabin—
(i) At flight altitudes above flight level 250 unless at least a 10-minute supply of supplemental oxygen, in addition to any oxygen required to satisfy paragraph (a) of this section, is available for each occupant of the aircraft for use in the event that a descent is necessitated by loss of cabin pressurization; and
(ii) At flight altitudes above flight level 350 unless one pilot at the controls of the airplane is wearing and using an oxygen mask that is secured and sealed and that either supplies oxygen at all times or automatically supplies oxygen whenever the cabin pressure altitude of the airplane exceeds 14,000 feet (MSL), except that the one pilot need not wear and use an oxygen mask while at or below flight level 410 if there are two pilots at the controls and each pilot has a quick-donning type of oxygen mask that can be placed on the face with one hand from the ready position within 5 seconds, supplying oxygen and properly secured and sealed.
(2) Notwithstanding paragraph (b)(1)(ii) of this section, if for any reason at any time it is necessary for one pilot to leave the controls of the aircraft when operating at flight altitudes above flight level 350, the remaining pilot at the controls shall put on and use an oxygen mask until the other pilot has returned to that crewmember's station.

[dispatchguy]

As a dispatcher, its about 75/25 of crews I have seen adhering to this reg when jumpseating. Most of the crews that dont don the mask when solo up front will still remove the mask from the holder, just in case; but I would say about 75% of the crews I have flown with do don the mask when solo up front above FL350.

The non-wearers will remove it, and hold it in their lap; squeezed and ready to don.

[NJA_Capt]

Originally Posted by falconvalley

§ 91.211 Supplemental oxygen.

It's a little different for 135 and 121.

[BobDDuck]

Originally Posted by dispatchguy

but I would say about 75% of the crews I have flown with do don the mask when solo up front above FL350.

The non-wearers will remove it, and hold it in their lap; squeezed and ready to don.

Have they approved 350 yet? I know it was in the works, but our manual still says 260. I had discussion with a captain that wouldn't get up and leave until I had the mask sealed on my face about altitude and what not. The guy was a pain to fly with and he really had to use the bathroom so I dragged the discussion out a bit more then I probably should have.

[Alchemy]

I make a point of putting the O2 mask on when required to do so. Our company requires that it be worn by the remaining pilot when either the Capt. or FO vacates the flight deck above FL250. I'll even put it on volutarily for a minute or two during the middle of redeye flights to help myself stay "focused".

[TonyC]

Originally Posted by BobDDuck

I had discussion with a captain that wouldn't get up and leave until I had the mask sealed on my face about altitude and what not. The guy was a pain to fly with ...

Any Captain that would insist on compliance with the Code of Federal Regulations is pretty much a jerk, I guess.

§ 121.333 Supplemental oxygen for emergency descent and for first aid; turbine engine powered airplanes with pressurized cabins.

(c) Use of oxygen masks by flight crewmembers.

(3) Notwithstanding paragraph (c)(2) of this section, if for any reason at any time it is necessary for one pilot to leave his station at the controls of the airplane when operating at flight altitudes above flight level 250, the remaining pilot at the controls shall put on and use his oxygen mask until the other pilot has returned to his duty station.

- or -

§ 135.89 Pilot requirements: Use of oxygen.

(b) Pressurized aircraft.

(4) If one pilot leaves a pilot duty station of an aircraft when operating at altitudes above 25,000 feet MSL, the remaining pilot at the controls shall put on and use an approved oxygen mask until the other pilot returns to the pilot duty station of the aircraft.

Furthermore,

§ 121.543 Flight crewmembers at controls.

(a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this section, each required flight crewmember on flight deck duty must remain at the assigned duty station with seat belt fastened while the aircraft is taking off or landing, and while it is en route.

Originally Posted by BobDDuck

... our manual still says 260.

Odd wording, considering that the CFR uses "above 25,000 feet."

Originally Posted by BobDDuck

Have they approved 350 yet?

The Notice of Proposed Rule Making (NPRM) received responses that caused the FAA to withdraw the proposed change.





.

[BobDDuck]

Actually the guy is a jerk because he makes up his own rules. That and he misinterprets stuff in the book as well. (the ref speed for a flap setting is the FASTEST you can be going and put out that setting, not a speed at which below you need to put out flaps to that setting... etc) That and he's not really a people person.

You're right. It says above FL250 in our manual. I miss read that. And thanks for clearing up with what happened with the NPRM.

[MikeOH58]

Originally Posted by Alchemy

I'll even put it on volutarily for a minute or two during the middle of redeye flights to help myself stay "focused".

Note Avatar hehe

[FlyChicaga]

I put it on at all times when I'm the only flight crewmember up front at or above FL250. Every time, no question.

I would argue that if you are not going to wear it, it would be much more wise to leave it in the box than removing it and putting it on your lap. There are many reasons for this that make it a more prudent decision; however, I always say it's better to wear it. Free oxygen bar!

[Ripper3785]

So what's the logic behind it? That in the event of rapid decompression when two crewmembers are on the flight deck and neither is wearing a mask, that at least one of them will be able to don the mask "in time"?

[CDVdriver]

Here we go 18000' with two students....yep instruction is actually still cool...

[ZapBrannigan]

So does anybody wear it at all times above FL410?

[OldTownPilot]

Above 410? Don't planes fall out of the sky above that?

There probably are not too many people on here that have been above 410 to answer you question.

Lears, Gulfstreams and the Citation X? what else can go that high?

[Nick]

Originally Posted by OldTownPilot

Lears, Gulfstreams and the Citation X? what else can go that high?

Some versions of the B-747!

[SteveC]

Originally Posted by OldTownPilot

Above 410? Don't planes fall out of the sky above that?

There probably are not too many people on here that have been above 410 to answer you question.

Lears, Gulfstreams and the Citation X? what else can go that high?

Lots of business jets can. Besides the ones you've mentioned:

Citation CJ2, CJ3, CJ4, Bravo, Ultra, Encore, XLS are all certified to FL450, the Citation Sovereign to FL470.

Hawker 400XP and 4000 are certified to FL450.

Bombardier Global 5000 and Global Express - FL510.

Challenger 300 - FL450.

Probably some others that I'm missing as well.

[EatSleepFly]

Whatever the reason for not wearing the mask, do not forget the "Payne Stewart crash."

Climbing through 23,000 they acknowledged an ATC transmission and gave no indication of anything out of the ordinary. When ATC called them for something else a little over six minutes later (I believe it was to tell them they had missed the turn to go around the Gulf of Mexico), they never replied.

Both pilots were pretty young and they were at a relatively low altitude, yet they were still both out in presumably under six minutes. It's a strange crash full of questions that no one will ever know the answers to, but it goes to show you how quickly you could both become incapacitated. Less than six minutes. That's a tune or two on your ipod, a page in the newspaper, or a trip to the lav.

I'm not sure, but I suspect oxygen requirements is one of those regs that was written in blood.

[falconvalley]

Originally Posted by NJA_Capt

It's a little different for 135 and 121.

What, are we swapping regs? GA can have a Capt, FO and FA too!

[CaptBdoubleU]

Look, I don't know how many of you remember the Payne Stewart accident...but how stupid would you feel if the other crew member went to the lav and YOU were the last lifeline for every passenger and crew member on that plane. 5 seconds of consciousness at the flight levels, and you're locked in the cockpit by yourself. Lazy people are stupid. Save your life and mine...I might be your passenger on that flight one day.

[30West]

we only wear em if the FO/Capt smells up the forward lav, the pax are smoking something that will make us fail a drug test, or in case of really bad gas, or in an emergency that requires supplemental O2.