Screens go black!

mrivc211 · June 1st, 2006, 15:35

So you're on a descent into XYZ airport. Due to the temperature, your performance numbers say that an APU assisted go around is needed. In other words, in the event that you would need to go around, you would be limited in torque/thrust setting due to the temps. Using the APU would give you slightly better performance capabilities since air needed to pressurize the cabin would be coming from the APU and not taken from the engine bleeds, thus giving you more power.
So descending through 10,000ft you've slowed the plane to the appropriate limitation for an APU start in flight. As your FO reaches for the start contactor and engages it, your EFIS screens(attitude indicators/HSI) goes black. Nothing. Zip. Your now running off of your peanut gyro and compass. Your 35 miles from the airport. What would you do?

DE727UPS · June 1st, 2006, 15:42

"Due to the temperature, your performance numbers say that an APU assisted go around is needed"

What kinda wussy airplane would have to do that? Never even heard of that before.

Anyway, if you're on standby power you have 30 minutes. I'd run the checklist and hope to get the APU generator on line. If you got nothing, you do a standby power approach if the wx is bad. I just did a pretty good one in the sim less than a month ago. Let the F/O work the thrust levers (human autothrottle) It's kinda like flying a old 172 panel with a non-standard instrument setup. You gotta look all over but the info is there. Shouldn't be a big deal for a guy with some solid, little airplane, IFR time.

Screaming_Emu · June 1st, 2006, 15:44

as a start:

Tell ATC what happened, ask them to vector you around above the MSA while you troubleshoot.

meritflyer · June 1st, 2006, 16:20

Get the blow-up auto pilot to manage the load. Worked in Airplane right?

mrivc211 · June 1st, 2006, 16:27

Let's say that the APU gen came online, yet the screens still remained black. All the Main and aux gens are running fine.

Chris_Ford · June 1st, 2006, 16:27

VMC or IMC? No altitude indicators?

mrivc211 · June 1st, 2006, 16:29

Chris_Ford · June 1st, 2006, 16:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrivc211

VMC

Any particular reason not to see if they'll block altitude you until you can get in close enough for the visual?

pa31350pilot · June 1st, 2006, 16:41

No need for a block altitude...they still have the altimeters. Then time to brush off the dust on the partial panel skills.

Chris_Ford · June 1st, 2006, 16:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by pa31350pilot

No need for a block altitude...they still have the altimeters. Then time to brush off the dust on the partial panel skills.

Oops, sorry, thought we had a full glass panel.

Stone Cold · June 1st, 2006, 16:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrivc211

VMC

You're VMC, 35 miles out, and are having problems landing the airplane?? Just curious, don't they go over that stuff in the Sim??

mrivc211 · June 1st, 2006, 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by txpilot

You're VMC, 35 miles out, and are having problems landing the airplane?? Just curious, don't they go over that stuff in the Sim??

Just out of curiousity, where does it say that the problem is with landing the airplane?

This forum is a arena of hypotheical scenarios. You seemed to of made up a problem onto the one stated. Am I missing something here?

Stone Cold · June 1st, 2006, 17:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrivc211

Just out of curiousity, where does it say that the problem is with landing the airplane?

This forum is a arena of hypotheical scenarios. You seemed to of made up a problem onto the one stated. Am I missing something here?

Sorry, misread it. Carry on. But, as for your first question...WWYD: run the abnormal checklist and land the plane.

DE727UPS · June 1st, 2006, 17:25

We have a switch that will select the alternate symbol generator if you have blank screens. Not much else you can do other than check for a popped CB. If it's VMC, I'd ask ATC for vectors to a visual. It's no big deal.

averyrm · June 1st, 2006, 17:26

Well, 35 miles from the airport in vmc with no glass?

I'd land at the airport and switch out planes.

I think what txpilot is getting at is, what's the big deal? It's still flying and you can see in front of you, and I'm assuming the radios are still working plus 35 miles takes what, like 10 mins?

desertdog71 · June 1st, 2006, 17:29

Just land it.

mrivc211 · June 1st, 2006, 17:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by averyrm

Well, 35 miles from the airport in vmc with no glass?

I'd land at the airport and switch out planes.

I think what txpilot is getting at is, what's the big deal? It's still flying and you can see in front of you, and I'm assuming the radios are still working plus 35 miles takes what, like 10 mins?

Ok, now lets switch it up a bit. It's IMC, you've been given direct to a VOR prior to the problem happening.

Remember, you can't use the VOR's since they are displayed on the HSDI.

averyrm · June 1st, 2006, 18:05

Tell approach and ask for vectors?

Stone Cold · June 1st, 2006, 18:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrivc211

Ok, now lets switch it up a bit. It's IMC, you've been given direct to a VOR prior to the problem happening.

Remember, you can't use the VOR's since they are displayed on the HSDI.

What are the bases at? Where is VFR located if you did the proper preflight planning (more talking to freight dawgs, since you airline people have it done for you, have people on the ground that can find out for you)? Tell ATC you need vectors for the VOR, troubleshooting in progress, fuel and souls on board, will advise if you need any further help...if you can't get to VFR, DECLARE EMERGENCY. If VFR is possible, see above.

jtrain609 · June 1st, 2006, 18:29

If VMC, land.

If IMC, ask for a no gyro ASR approach or get yourself to some VFR weather. The radio's still working? Did the screens just die or did ALL the electrical go out too? If you don't have any radio's, you are IMC and you don't have ANY instrumentation then you'd better climb above any terrain in the area, get VFR fast and figure out a place to go.

Chances of it all going tango uniform? Slim to not frigging happening.

E_Dawg · June 1st, 2006, 18:32

Maybe no more inflight APU starting just before the approach, especially if IMC!

Dugie8 · June 1st, 2006, 20:14

Trim full forward, add full power, let go. Or if you are part of the greatest pilots on the planet, pull the return to taxpayer handle.

Bandit_Driver · June 2nd, 2006, 13:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrivc211

Ok, now lets switch it up a bit. It's IMC, you've been given direct to a VOR prior to the problem happening.

Remember, you can't use the VOR's since they are displayed on the HSDI.

This isn't a legit question.

All glass planes I have seen and/or flew had a backup airspeed, vor w/GS, altitude, and whiskey compass. All of which ran off standby power. I don't think feds would certify a plane without backups.

mrivc211 · June 3rd, 2006, 18:55

The only glass in the brasilia are the EFIS equipped airplanes, which only the HSDI and ADI are glass. As stated. Everything else are gauges.

Seggy · June 3rd, 2006, 20:52

VFR-Land the POS

IFR-

Shoot a VOR Approach or NDB Approach with the back up RMI, ground the airplane, go to the bar have a beer!

June 1st, 2006, 15:35	#1
mrivc211 Old Skool Join Date: Sep 2000 Posts: 1,994	Screens go black! So you're on a descent into XYZ airport. Due to the temperature, your performance numbers say that an APU assisted go around is needed. In other words, in the event that you would need to go around, you would be limited in torque/thrust setting due to the temps. Using the APU would give you slightly better performance capabilities since air needed to pressurize the cabin would be coming from the APU and not taken from the engine bleeds, thus giving you more power. So descending through 10,000ft you've slowed the plane to the appropriate limitation for an APU start in flight. As your FO reaches for the start contactor and engages it, your EFIS screens(attitude indicators/HSI) goes black. Nothing. Zip. Your now running off of your peanut gyro and compass. Your 35 miles from the airport. What would you do?

June 1st, 2006, 15:42	#2
DE727UPS Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 6,481	Re: Screens go black! "Due to the temperature, your performance numbers say that an APU assisted go around is needed" What kinda wussy airplane would have to do that? Never even heard of that before. Anyway, if you're on standby power you have 30 minutes. I'd run the checklist and hope to get the APU generator on line. If you got nothing, you do a standby power approach if the wx is bad. I just did a pretty good one in the sim less than a month ago. Let the F/O work the thrust levers (human autothrottle) It's kinda like flying a old 172 panel with a non-standard instrument setup. You gotta look all over but the info is there. Shouldn't be a big deal for a guy with some solid, little airplane, IFR time.

June 1st, 2006, 15:44	#3
Screaming_Emu Old Skool Join Date: May 2002 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 3,091	Re: Screens go black! as a start: Tell ATC what happened, ask them to vector you around above the MSA while you troubleshoot. __________________ Commercial Pilot - ASEL, AMEL, Instrument CFI/II 850TT CRJ-700 FO at Southernjets Connection Former flight instructor out of KBWI and W29 Loves Dutch chicks "jtrain609: I wish I had a pair"

June 1st, 2006, 16:20	#4
meritflyer Old Skool Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Winchestertonfieldville Posts: 6,240	Re: Screens go black! Get the blow-up auto pilot to manage the load. Worked in Airplane right? __________________ The simplest answer tends to be correct.

June 1st, 2006, 16:27	#5
mrivc211 Old Skool Join Date: Sep 2000 Posts: 1,994	Re: Screens go black! Let's say that the APU gen came online, yet the screens still remained black. All the Main and aux gens are running fine.

June 1st, 2006, 16:27	#6
Chris_Ford Banned Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 7,329	Re: Screens go black! VMC or IMC? No altitude indicators?

June 1st, 2006, 16:29	#7
mrivc211 Old Skool Join Date: Sep 2000 Posts: 1,994	Re: Screens go black! VMC

June 1st, 2006, 16:41	#9
pa31350pilot Newbie Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Nazareth, PA Posts: 15	Re: Screens go black! No need for a block altitude...they still have the altimeters. Then time to brush off the dust on the partial panel skills.

June 1st, 2006, 17:25	#14
DE727UPS Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 6,481	Re: Screens go black! We have a switch that will select the alternate symbol generator if you have blank screens. Not much else you can do other than check for a popped CB. If it's VMC, I'd ask ATC for vectors to a visual. It's no big deal.

June 1st, 2006, 17:26	#15
averyrm Old Skool Join Date: May 2002 Location: LCK Posts: 1,643	Re: Screens go black! Well, 35 miles from the airport in vmc with no glass? I'd land at the airport and switch out planes. I think what txpilot is getting at is, what's the big deal? It's still flying and you can see in front of you, and I'm assuming the radios are still working plus 35 miles takes what, like 10 mins? __________________ <-- That guy with Belushi as his avitar

June 1st, 2006, 17:29	#16
desertdog71 Old Skool Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: KIDP/KCNU Posts: 3,005	Re: Screens go black! Just land it. __________________ www.flywhiteair.com http://www.myspace.com/desertdog71 Following message is for SkyCougar. Took my chances on a big jet plane, Never let them tell you that they're all the same.

June 1st, 2006, 18:05	#18
averyrm Old Skool Join Date: May 2002 Location: LCK Posts: 1,643	Re: Screens go black! Tell approach and ask for vectors? __________________ <-- That guy with Belushi as his avitar

June 1st, 2006, 18:29	#20
jtrain609 Old Skool Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Park City, UT Posts: 12,093	Re: Screens go black! If VMC, land. If IMC, ask for a no gyro ASR approach or get yourself to some VFR weather. The radio's still working? Did the screens just die or did ALL the electrical go out too? If you don't have any radio's, you are IMC and you don't have ANY instrumentation then you'd better climb above any terrain in the area, get VFR fast and figure out a place to go. Chances of it all going tango uniform? Slim to not frigging happening. __________________ "I could stand at the end of the line of the general mills cereal plant to make sure that all the lucky charms are up to par for 38k a year." -snickersnwa

June 1st, 2006, 18:32	#21
E_Dawg Moderator Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: chicago Posts: 4,145	Re: Screens go black! Maybe no more inflight APU starting just before the approach, especially if IMC! __________________ Yeah, I just stare at my desk; but it looks like I'm working. I do that for probably another hour after lunch, too. I'd say in a given week I probably only do about fifteen minutes of real, actual, work.

June 1st, 2006, 20:14	#22
Dugie8 Old Skool Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: KRST Posts: 1,819	Re: Screens go black! Trim full forward, add full power, let go. Or if you are part of the greatest pilots on the planet, pull the return to taxpayer handle. __________________ Aircraft without engine(s) prohibited... -KMIA 10-9

June 3rd, 2006, 18:55	#24
mrivc211 Old Skool Join Date: Sep 2000 Posts: 1,994	Re: Screens go black! The only glass in the brasilia are the EFIS equipped airplanes, which only the HSDI and ADI are glass. As stated. Everything else are gauges.

June 3rd, 2006, 20:52	#25
Seggy Old Skool Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Somewhere in the Northeast Posts: 4,940	Re: Screens go black! VFR-Land the POS IFR- Shoot a VOR Approach or NDB Approach with the back up RMI, ground the airplane, go to the bar have a beer! Last edited by Seggy; June 3rd, 2006 at 21:44.

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