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You're the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

Discussion in 'You're the captain...' started by Derg, Nov 11, 2003.

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  1. Derg Major Domo

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    You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    You're the first officer on a jet departing Santa Ana/Orange County/John Wayne (who's idea was it to keep tacking on names?!) with a freakish noise abatement procedure.

    You're cleared for takeoff and the captain completely disregards the noise abatement procedure.

    What do you do/say, if anything?
    Derg, Nov 11, 2003
    #1

  2. A300Capt Well-Known Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    [ QUOTE ]
    What do you do/say, if anything?

    [/ QUOTE ]

    "Hey, nice takeoff, Capt!" "I wanna be just like you!". [IMG]

    Did I miss something? [IMG] [IMG]
    A300Capt, Nov 11, 2003
    #2

  3. Derg Major Domo

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    Psst! I know! Shh!
    Derg, Nov 11, 2003
    #3

  4. av8rmsu Well-Known Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    It matters who the captain is...

    grumpy old man - use the sense God gave me and shut up

    nice guy, left his ego at the door - discuss it in a nonoffensive tone...maybe he just overlooked the procedure or was just not clear with the instructions
    av8rmsu, Nov 11, 2003
    #4

  5. JDMcFly New Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    "Ooh ahah, just gave an early wake up call to the Smiths"
    JDMcFly, Nov 11, 2003
    #5

  6. EatSleepFly Well-Known Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    Probably just remind him of its existence, if that. If he's already disregarded it, no sense in making an issue of it- get on with the flight.
    EatSleepFly, Nov 11, 2003
    #6

  7. JDMcFly New Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    [ QUOTE ]
    Probably just remind him of its existence. If he's already disregarded it, no sense in making an issue of it- get on with the flight.

    [/ QUOTE ]


    [IMG]

    I haven't the slightest idea an airline's procedure's in this event, so that's what I'd do.
    JDMcFly, Nov 11, 2003
    #7

  8. av8rmsu Well-Known Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    On the other hand....

    Holler bloody murder!!!!!!....

    Just movin' on up the seniority list [IMG]


    Is that kind of like not sending a captain a get well soon card? [IMG]
    av8rmsu, Nov 11, 2003
    #8

  9. JDMcFly New Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    'Just movin' on up the seniority list'

    As doug has always said (I think..) repremands come in two! [IMG]

    Edit: Not sure if that applies, just sounded good [IMG]
    JDMcFly, Nov 11, 2003
    #9

  10. IrishSheepdog Neighborhood Watch

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    I'd say, "Umm, I believe the noise abatement procedures are in effect. Are we supposed to be using the procedure?"

    Either he/she will say "oh oops, good catch" or "nope." If it's the latter, I would continue assisting with the NPF duties so as not to get into an argument in such a critical phase of flight (we might be loud but are we going to crash? No.). Then at a later time I would bring up the fact I was concerned about the repricussions from disregarding the procedure.

    Remember CUS words: "I'm concerned with what is happening at the moment." No response? "I'm uncomfortable with what is happening at the moment." No response still? "I believe this is a safety issue and needs to be corrected immediately."

    However in this situation, it is a noise abatement requirement, not a DP avoiding mountains. If it were the latter, there would be more interest in ensuring proper following of the procedure. Like I said, if the flight is still being operating safely (although not following the procedure), it might cause more harm than good to start a major discussion about why the captain did not fly the procedure properly.

    BTW if this response makes no grammatical sense, sorry I'm exhausted! [IMG]
    IrishSheepdog, Nov 11, 2003
    #10

  11. Kristie The cats meow.....

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    I'd say "good for you man, the airport was here first - let the city council deal with the folks who bought there"..

    well, no might not be right answer - but i sure like it! hahaha [IMG]
    Kristie, Nov 11, 2003
    #11

  12. kostcoguy New Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    I would just mention it too him "Do you know about the noise abatement procedure here?" that would probably fix that pretty quick.
    kostcoguy, Nov 11, 2003
    #12

  13. flyguy New Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    I'm with Kristie, they chose to live near the airport. But I guess their sh** don't stink either. Don't say anything to the captain and tell the snobs to move if they don't like it. [IMG]

    Seriously though, the captain probably just overlooked the procedures, so I would politely remind him/her.
    flyguy, Nov 11, 2003
    #13

  14. Derg Major Domo

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    Derg, Nov 11, 2003
    #14

  15. Snow New Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    Um unless the aircraft was in any danger I wouldn't say anything, it's 'his' aircraft and if he messes up he's going to get the ass kicking for it.
    Snow, Nov 12, 2003
    #15

  16. JEP SIRI, Tell me a joke....

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    [ QUOTE ]
    Um unless the aircraft was in any danger I wouldn't say anything, it's 'his' aircraft and if he messes up he's going to get the ass kicking for it.

    [/ QUOTE ]
    I'll play devils advocate here....Suppose the Captain decides to have a drink while flying? The aircraft would probably not be in danger, but would you let that slide as well?

    Also, what if you are unlucky and fly with a few captains that decide to break the Noise Abatement procs. I would think that the powers that be would see who was the first officer and then wonder why didn't he/she speak up?

    I don't think I would question the captain right away, but I would question him for my own knowledge once in level cruise flight.
    JEP, Nov 12, 2003
    #16

  17. naunga New Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    First off, correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that in the eyes of the FAA noise abatment procedures are purely voluntary.

    If this is true then it comes down to what the company's policy is on them.

    If the company sides with the FAA, then I keep my mouth shut. I'm with Kristie, the airport was here first.

    If the company says (and it appears that they do) noise abatment procs are to be followed to the letter, then I'll probably just mention that hey you know you missed that procedure there? But that would be it, and I wouldn't press the issue with him. Maybe he just forgot. Maybe he didn't care. If he forgot, well then next time I may mention that there is a noise abatment procedure in effect before takeoff, just to be helpful. Hell, I'd probably do that even if he didn't care to fly it. At least I can say I reminded him of the procedure.

    Reprimands may come in two's, but the procedure was already busted. It's not like you can wrestle the controls away from him and do it right. You're screwed already.

    You're already off the ground and the procedure has already been missed. At least I'm on record reminding him of the procedure.

    That's what I'd do...from the safety of my computer screen.

    Naunga
    naunga, Nov 12, 2003
    #17

  18. C650CPT Well-Known Member

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    It all goes back to the pre take off briefing, was the Noise Abatement procedure briefed and briefed back? If it was and that is what you were expecting the Cpt. to do and he didn't there is a larger issue of crew resource management or pilot performance issues that needs to be adressed, that is more of a safety issue than the noise abatement is. If it wasn't briefed then I would post flight critique that WE missed it and will include such procedures in future pre take off briefings.
    My situation stated on another thread was the latter, never briefed, we were in the go home mode.
    C650CPT, Nov 12, 2003
    #18

  19. Derg Major Domo

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    [ QUOTE ]
    Um unless the aircraft was in any danger I wouldn't say anything, it's 'his' aircraft and if he messes up he's going to get the ass kicking for it.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Violations and all-expenses-paid trips to the chief pilot's office are issued in pairs.
    Derg, Nov 12, 2003
    #19

  20. Derg Major Domo

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    Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

    [ QUOTE ]
    First off, correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that in the eyes of the FAA noise abatment procedures are purely voluntary.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Somewhat, however, airlines get charged hefty fees for setting-off the noise monitors. If your flight exceeded the maximum decibel level and you don't have a valid excuse for not following the procedure things could get very interesting.
    Derg, Nov 12, 2003
    #20
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