Dual Given for Sim/FTD

So I am getting ready to begin instructing and some of our lessons are done in Frasca FTDs. As a student, I would always log just SIM time in my logbook, nothing else. Now as an instructor, do you think I should log Sim time and "dual given"?

Just getting some opinions.

I wouldn't log any of it as an instructor. What's the point? It's not going to count toward anything for you anymore as a CFI.

Other than for the purpose of demonstrating compliance with 14 CFR 61.217, I can't think of much value for most people. However, I do know of a Part 142 operator that has been told to document simulator instruction time when they apply for initial or renewal TCE authority.

Well, I think the time has value as you are teaching. I'm assuming you are a CFII. If you went to look for another instructing job someday it would be good to be able to document the "sim" instruction time. I agree you don't want to convolute your logbook by in any way showing it under the "total time" column, as that's assumed to be actual flight time of some sort. Personally, I'd have no problem seeing it as "dual given" in a logbook if I was an interviewer, in fact, I'd highly respect the time as I've done some of that and value the experience. But if it makes you nervous putting it in your logbook as dual given, assuming that column should be "flight time dual given", then that's fine. You could easily keep a separate record of it outside your logbook in case you ever interview for another CFII job.

^^ This is correct. Log it under dual given only. I seem to recall there being some controversy over how to log it in the student's logbook. I always used to log it as Dual Received and Sim time, and used to get in some huge debates with guys about it. It kinda depends on how you interpret the definition of Dual Received in 61.1 and 1.1...

Dual Given for you, Dual received for the reciev-ee, and simulator for the receiv-ee. If there were any approaches and/or holds, log those, but no PIC, & no landings

I have done a lot of simulator and FTD time at my flight school and I have always kept a separate log for it and kept it out of my logbook. It doesn't count towards any time you need in regards to time the airlines want, but you still have a record of it for another instructing job

How can he log approaches his student does in the sim?

Rubbing my magic lamp I chant @MidlifFlyer appear and comment please.

You don't. As the instructor it's simple. Log Dual Given if you want to do that.

log them for the student, not for the instructor.

Start here: there is nothing in the regs that requires an instructor to log dual given. The value of doing that is (1) if you end up going further as an instructor instruction given and of what type will probably be relevant and (2) if you apply to be an examiner, last time I looked, that application asks you to provide information about instruction given.

So, as long as you don't put information in a column that counts for something that the FAA does require you to track, you should be ok (and no, no kind of instruction you given in a sim or FTD counts for anything in terms of your own flight currency).

The kind of instructing you did also comes up if you ever end up working as an assistant chief under Part 141. I'm going through the process of applying to be the assistant chief for my employer, and one of the things the FSDO asked for is a breakdown of total instructing time versus dual given as a CFII.

That said, I keep a separate record of "FTD given", and the only time it shows up in my logbook is an entry if I give someone an IPC.