Air Traffic Controlling Questions and advice for college

I am currently looking at schools to possibly become an air traffic controller. I just toured ERAU in Daytona and was very impressed but from what I have read, it just is not worth the hefty price tag. The other day, I came across a school call Letourneau University. I was wondering if any of you knew of this being a good school or not. From the looks of it, it has top notch facilities. They offer an air traffic management program which is a 4 year degree or they offer a 2 year Air traffic degree. Apparently, the Air Traffic Management degree is better since they teach you the management side of Air Traffic Controlling. Does this hold true?

I have a strong interest in aviation. I am not 100% sure if ATC is right for me. I do know I want to be in the aviation field though. What other degrees could you recommend if I find out ATC is not for me? I have heard about Airport management but it seems that that field really limits you on what careers you can have. Is that correct? Do you think that maybe it would be better to get a general business degree and just try to get a job with an airline/airport?

I would love to hear your opinions and advice! Thank you!

First off, with all due respect to ERAU graduates, pretty much no employer in aviation cares where your degree came from. I'd go the cheapest route 100% of the time. It may be cool to have all the latest and greatest equipment to learn with, but it isn't 40,000 in extra loans to pay off cool. I don't know anything about Letourneau, but when the general conversation of BAD CTI schools come up, it isn't mentioned.

Second, many aviation departments in colleges/universities will lie to you. In aviation it is very hard to figure out which hurdles need to be jumped and how they can be jumped until you're deep into the process. On the surface, to a person looking at colleges, it seems plausible that a school would have a longer program to teach you the management side of ATC. The truth is, its hogwash. The only things a supervisor does that a controller can not do are counsel employees and do skill/proficiency checks and check rides. Can a school teach you how to know when a controller is safe when you've never talked to an airplane in your life? Is the school going to teach you how to act under the current contract in disciplining controllers? The answer is no. Even if they did waste your time on Minesweeper 101 nobody in the FAA would care. All they care about is did you check off that CTI degree box. To wit.

Do the two year option. It takes a few years to get hired after you graduate anyway. Why not put your name in the hat ASAP and complete a 4 year degree in something else in the meantime. 99% of your credits transfer, so you're out maybe 2 or 3 classes at most, but you've got a 2 year head start on hiring, which, is pretty huge considering the hiring bonanza won't be around forever. In addition to the non ATC job my CTI degree got me, I know others who's CTI degrees landed them great jobs at Flight Service, Air Inc and several other aviation companies so it isn't like an ATC degree is ATC or bust.

I was an airport manager before I was a controller so I have some insight on this as well. The situation in aviation related careers is that outside of jobs that require a specific credential (Pilot A&P Dispatch etc.) is there are far more positions than college programs training people specifically for those positions can train. I worked at a fairly large airport as an airport supervisor and of my 15 or so coworkers, five of us had any formal aviation education. My ATC degree got me the job, another was an ex Air Force F16 mechanic, one guy had a private pilots certificate and another had spent a couple of years fueling the aircraft at the airport. Any aviation related degree is good enough for an airport management job 99.9% of the time. Look at job listings at www.aaae.org and you'll find most jobs require a 4 year degree in something aviation related.

Were I you, I'd get the 2 year CTI degree at the cheapest, fastest place possible then dive right back in to a 4 year degree that interest you in aviation.

Wow..thank you for the.quick response. That was very helpful.

So just to make sure, you ate recommending that I get my 2 year associate degree in ATC and then get my 4 year degree in the meantime while waiting to get into the academy ?

Are tousled saying that the 4 year degree needs to be in an aviation related field or can it just be a general business degree such as business management or finance ?

Thanks again!

If you were interested in Riddle DO NOT DO ATC as a major.... just do the minor and you can do engineering or management as the major. genot's advice is extremely sound though.
As stated above all the FAA cares about is that you can check the cti box.... how you do that matters not. So spending 4 years paying for it as a major is honestly a huge mistake.

I also recommend getting your 2 year ATC-CTI degree first just to get your name in there. While waiting, go ahead and transfer to where ever you want and finish a 4 year degree. You can get your degree in whatever you want, just keep in mind an Aviation degree limits you to a certain degree unless you get lucky and find that great job right away.

For my story, I got a 4 year Aviation Management degree first, then I decided to go back and get a CTI degree and go for ATC. I attended Minneapolis Community and Technical College (MCTC). If you can deal with the move for 2 years, it's a great program at a great price. One of, if not, the cheapest... and the ATC education is top notch. I'm not sure about the rest of the school because I had credits transferred in, but some people did almost their entire first year online. The second year you have to be in Minneapolis. After school, you can apply and then have no problem transferring your credits to a 4 year program elsewhere.

Like I said, I was looking at Letourneau University. They offer a 2 year ATC program and then I can also go ahead and get my business management/finance(or whatever) degree from there as well.

How long does it usually take to get into the FAA Academy after getting the degree? Also, what exactly are the differences in the 4 year and 2 year degrees? I was just thinking that there are a lot of 'fluff' classes?

Typically the difference in a 2 year vs 4 year ATC degree is just that. Fluff. You're going to relearn everything again at OCK with their techniques and then all over again at your facility in addition to their own special local rules. By the time you talk to your first live airplane, 99% of what you learned in CTI school is supplanted by something else.

As far as how long to get hired and get a class date at OKC. I got hired less than 6 months after I graduated, likewise I know someone who has been waiting three years. It really depends on your score on an aptitude test called the AT SAT and which states/regions/however they let you select where you want to go anymore you pick. IE tank the AT SAT, it'll be a while. Pick Florida because it'd be super cool to hang on the beach, well everyone else is in line for that so take a number, wait, hope and pray if you're so inclined.

My advise to get hired fast is to pick up a copy of "the green book" Air Traffic Control by Patrick Mattson. It has a CD ROM with a quasi AT SAT practice test. Its far harder than the real thing. Don't get stressed on how hard it is, just play with it. Get a good nights sleep the day prior and when you pick states, pick states with tons of facilities and a smaller population with less than perfect weather. Ohio and Michigan come to mind. You can always transfer once you certify.

When picking a region, does the region determine how much you get paid? I know the median salaries for ATCs is around 100k per year. How much more can that reach to? What other regions are good to choose other than Ohio and Michigan?

Regarding stress, does it hold true that air traffic controlling is one of the most stressful jobs?

Thanks again for the responses.

Your pay is based on what is called a facility level. There is quite a bit that goes into it, but its basically how busy and complex it is where you work it. A small tower controller newly certified makes around 55K a year, work the big leagues with CIP, Over Time, massive locality etc and you can easily go past 200K. 100K as a new controller isn't typical within your first few years just FYI, but with luck and skill, its easy to get. The pay rules and levels are a very complex subject so they aren't easy to quantify, so nobody can give you a true straight answer.

99% of the time it isn't stressful at all. The other 1% of the time, its a mad house I wouldn't wish on anyone. You'll have a plan one second, the next, well you forgot it, now who was number 13 for the field again? And that scenario isn't the worst. I've seen emergencies on the scope, gone home, flipped on the TV and seen the local news have that as their top story. Funny thing is, my most stressful 30 minutes (professionally, personally whatever, 30 minutes I'd never care to relive) never made the news. Two days later a similar incident with a different outcome made national news. Stress is subjective.

So how do you get into the bigger towers? Do you have to start in a smaller one then work your way up?

That question is more complex than the pay rate one. In theory, that is how it should work. In the last 6-7 years, that's not how it has worked, and there is no rhyme or reason as to what the agency is doing on any given day in that regard.

One thing I want to add about the CTI program: It does not guarantee a job, or even an announcement for a job. I've seen the wait (in this thread) vary from months to years. However, I've actually seen it vary from months to never. The agency discloses that a degree from a qualified CTI school does not mean a job on its information page about the CTI program. Not trying to be the piss ant here, just throwing it out there...

So I just toured Kent State and was very impressed. I would like to know what you have heard about their ATC program.

Thanks.

Heard nothing of them. Looks like they were accepted into the CTI "family" in 2007, so pretty much a new comer as far a CTI schools go. Honestly, I'd look about 2 hours east at Community College of Beaver County if you're in that part of the country. They have an actual control tower that (terminal) students get certified in. Millions of dollars in simulators are great and all, but the real thing is way more educational. That and CCBC is a 2 year school which follows my advice of get the application in ASAP.

I went there and would highly recommend it although the actual town is the most boring place I've ever seen. I agree with the notion (though not presented in this thread) that the military better prepares you, however. As CTI schools go, I had 6 classmates and myself all certify at terminal level 10's or higher as their first facility and zero washouts. You don't know what that means, but terminal level ten and above isn't exactly an easy first facility. For reference (although not a perfect one) LaGuardia Tower is a level 10. In fact we probably shouldn't have been sent to level 10's and above in a sane world. That's really just being thrown into the fire. Even more impressive when most of us learned enroute and got hired for terminal which are two different animals.

I'd call about the CCBC program ASAP if it were me. Cheap, good training and you can get the 4 year degree wherever you want while you wait. Beats a potentially substandard education than what you could have had (no offense intended to Kent State) and a two year hamstring at more cost.

A lot of good advice here. A major point to take away, however, is any plans you make now on time or money will probably not represent reality if and when you make it to a facility. The job is dependent on national and local politics, the economy, and a number of other factors that are impossible to predict. Take it one step at a time until you get there, don't limit yourself (choose terminal AND enroute on the app) and have a backup career option in motion at the same time would be my advice.

Hey, recent Kent state grad in flight tech, so I don't know everything about the ATC program, but I do know that we have some great facilities and training devices because a large chunk of my tuition just went into that brand new lab :/ Great professors, great atmosphere.

My local community college just opened a ATC/ Professional Pilot course and I signed up and I am wondering if it was any good the name of the college is Atlantic Cape Community College, located about 10-15 minutes from ACY