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61.189... CFI records

Discussion in 'CFI Corner' started by Timbuff10, Mar 7, 2006.

  1. Timbuff10

    Timbuff10 Well-Known Member

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    I thought I lost mine but thankfully found them today...

    Does anyone keep records of endorsements they give other than for solos, writtens, and checkrides? In talking with other CFIs at my school, they all seem to be keeping records of TSA endorsements and all. Anyone else do this for some reason? I just have a small notebook and write in, by hand, the name, date, what the endorsement was for, and the results for a written or checkride. We use stickers for endorsements and I have seen some people fill out two stickers, giving one to the student and putting the other in the records. What method do you use for keeping the record?


    ยง 61.189 Flight instructor records.
    (a) A flight instructor must sign the logbook of each person to whom that instructor has given flight training or ground training.

    (b) A flight instructor must maintain a record in a logbook or a separate document that contains the following:

    (1) The name of each person whose logbook or student pilot certificate that instructor has endorsed for solo flight privileges, and the date of the endorsement; and

    (2) The name of each person that instructor has endorsed for a knowledge test or practical test, and the record shall also indicate the kind of test, the date, and the results.

    (c) Each flight instructor must retain the records required by this section for at least 3 years.
  2. MidlifeFlyer

    MidlifeFlyer Well-Known Member

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    I keep the records of each endorsement. I do it in multiple ways. Some overlap. They don't need to. I just have a "thing" for forms. Someday I might get it fixed.

    For the 61.189 requirements I have a set of pages I paste in my logbook.

    I also keep a separate record of each instructional flight on a 2-part form with checkboxes for maneuvers and an area for notes. If the session was a flight review or IPC, it's noted. The student and I both sign it and keep a copy. For transitions into high-performance or complex, I have a separate form (sort of a check-the-box syllabus) that includes the endorsement.

    I also have a computerized logbook where the 61.189 list is duplicated and where the other endorsements will generally appear in the remarks of my own entry for the flight.
  3. bike21

    bike21 Well-Known Member

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    Yo! From whom did you get your notebook idea? :)

    What you are doing should suffice, but as Mark says it doesn't hurt to double up. The things you listed straight from 61.189 are all you need per the FAA. You do need to keep the TSA endorements too. I created a second section in my notebook for TSA stickers. Just make two, stick the second in your records and your golden.

    How about this Denver wx? Boulder is under a Winter Storm Warning. Gonna be fun getting to DIA later and trying to get out!
  4. MidlifeFlyer

    MidlifeFlyer Well-Known Member

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    ...and it was 70 just yesterday. Gotta love it!

    Amazing. Three posts in a thread and all of them from the Denver area.
  5. Timbuff10

    Timbuff10 Well-Known Member

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    Haha, yeah there was this guy at my flight school that seemed to know what he was talking about at one point...

    Ok, I was just wondering if I had missed it somewhere in the regs that we are supposed to keep track of "all endorsements" including the TSA ones too. For example to solo someone you need to actually give them like 4 seperate endorsements/stickers and I have seen people copy each one of those endorsements into their book. I just write "solo privilages". The thing that I was really wondering about though, was the TSA endorsement as I have never saved a record of those since I haven't officially seen that requirement anywhere.

    Oh well, I think I will catch a movie today as the rain/snow/wintery mix comes down.
  6. moxiepilot

    moxiepilot Well-Known Member

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    i keep an excel spreadsheet of all endorsemnts for ease of reference. The list includes TSA endorsement as well as the typical other logbook endorsement
  7. bike21

    bike21 Well-Known Member

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    The TSA req comes from a document '1552' or something. I can't remember, but its in there somewhere. 'Solo Priveleges' is all I wrote down too. Name, date, type of endoresment is all you need. Nothign too fancy if you don't want.

    Yeah Mark, gotta love it...record cold two weeks ago, record high last week and now snow!!

    Good ol' Denver :)
  8. Van_Hoolio

    Van_Hoolio Well-Known Member

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    1552 is the part of 49 CFR that deals with the TSA's requirements of flight schools. Title 49 of the Code of Federal Regulations is for Transportation, just like how 14 CFR is for Aeronautics and Space, which includes the "F-A-Rs".

    Here is AOPA's guidance on record keeping in accordance with 49 CFR 1552:
    Mike
  9. Chris_Ford

    Chris_Ford Penalty Box

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    So you don't need to endorse if you have a photocopy of passport or birth certificate?
  10. MidlifeFlyer

    MidlifeFlyer Well-Known Member

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    Yup. Pretty much.
  11. Van_Hoolio

    Van_Hoolio Well-Known Member

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    That's the way AOPA phrases it anyway: http://www.aopa.org/tsa_rule/#citizens

    My flight school keeps good records, and we always get a passport or a birth certificate + id and put it in the folder we have for every student and renter. We just got audited by a couple ladies from the TSA the other week, and it was all good. I'm not sure if it was a voluntary audit or not, but just in case make sure you have all of your students' citizenships proven and have that stupid security awareness training completion certificate for all of your school's employees that need it.


    Mike
  12. bike21

    bike21 Well-Known Member

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    Ah yes, good ol' 49 CFR! Thanks Van. Doubling up is good on the TSA req, I now remember that we did copies and the endorsement just in case.
  13. Timbuff10

    Timbuff10 Well-Known Member

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    sometimes the FAA rules and the "flight school" rules get confusing... And then you have the people who are overcautious about thinigs and it is hard to remember what is/isn't required without looking things up.

    Well the wx is still here, it was supposed to be clear this morning but we have this
    KBJC 091510Z 091512 33006KT 1/4SM FZFG VV003
    FM1630 28005KT 1 1/2SM BR BKN004
    So no flying for me this morning, hopefully thw afternoon lesson can go if it gets better.

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