Why no touch n go's

[SGTCIV]

I noticed at my old flight school that when breaking in a new engine, they didn't allow touch n go's in the hours that it was running mineral oil. At my new school, ATP, they don't allow touch and goes at all. I was wondering if that might be a maintenance issue or safety related... Either way, I assumed that a touch n go was less harmfull than a stop and go because the engine doesn't get a chance to cool down.

Can someone explain to me what is going on?

[aloft]

It's a maintenance thing. When breaking in a new engine, the engine needs to be run at moderately high power settings for the first 50 hrs or so to seat the piston rings properly.

Then again, some CFIs and flight schools don't believe in touch & go's. Some CFI's believe that performing a touch & go requires too quick a transition from a landing mindset to a takeoff mindset, and this deprives primary students of time to think about and analyze the landing. Touch & go's also have a slightly greater degree of risk than a full-stop landing and taxi-back for takeoff, which, in combination with the foregoing, is probably why ATP doesn't allow them.

[SGTCIV]

I get the whole piston ring thing, but from a maintenance standpoint, how is a touch and go any different from a stop and go other than the obvious 15 second time delay involved in coming to a full stop?

I took my multi check ride today (passed) and asked the examiner the same thing. From a safety standpoint, he said, pilots tend to reach for the gear handle instead of the flap handle in those few seconds of transition from dirty to flaps up. With the plane just landing it's possiable for the squatswich to come unseated indicating a false WOW and causing the gear to collapse. This makes sense to me, allot of sense, but I still don't get the engine break in thing and how a touch and go is different from a stop and go or a full stop taxi back for that matter. If anything, touch and go's would keep the engine running at high power setting longer than the other two... ?

[aloft]

Originally Posted by SGTCIV

I get the whole piston ring thing, but from a maintenance standpoint, how is a touch and go any different from a stop and go other than the obvious 15 second time delay involved in coming to a full stop?

Most places don't want you doing those things either--any pattern work at all, really--during engine break-in . Most of the planes I've ever flown during engine break-in have been limited by their owners to cross-country flights. As I said, engines need to be run at moderately high power, with only minor variations, such as would be done on a typical XC. Pattern work involves too much vascillation between max power for takeoff/climbout and low power/idle for landing.

[USMCmech]

Originally Posted by aloft

Most places don't want you doing those things either--any pattern work at all, really--during engine break-in . Most of the planes I've ever flown during engine break-in have been limited by their owners to cross-country flights. As I said, engines need to be run at moderately high power, with only minor variations, such as would be done on a typical XC. Pattern work involves too much vascillation between max power for takeoff/climbout and low power/idle for landing.

Ditto


Properly breaking in an engine involves basicly running it at full power for several hours. I wouldn't allow ANY patern work on my new engine, besides taking off and a short aporach to land, refuel and repeat untill it has run for 10 hours.


As for the whole touch and go thing, I have never had a student have trouble with them. Ocasionally they will forget flaps, but they do that sometimes too after a full stop.

Doing repeated full stop taxi backs is just a waste of the student's money. I only require them on a students inital solo.

[naunga]

Aviation Atlanta doesn't allow T&G's at all either, and I once ask my instructor about it.

Her explanation was that T&G's can be unsafe and are unrealistic, because if you're truly landing you're either going to touch down and stop, or you're going to go-around before the wheels even kiss the pavement.

Made sense to me. It lowers the work load for a student pilot doing pattern work. Instead of touching down, and then rushing to reconfig for take off and possibly missing something, you pull off, get cleaned up, and then get in touch with control.

Anyhow, that's at least why one school doesn't allow T&G's.

Naunga

[surreal1221]

So for the solo requirement? It can be 3 full stops? I was always under the impression it was 2 touch and goes, then a full stop, to fulfill the 3 to/ldg requirement.

[Jason]

Originally Posted by surreal1221

So for the solo requirement? It can be 3 full stops? I was always under the impression it was 2 touch and goes, then a full stop, to fulfill the 3 to/ldg requirement.

Which solo requirement are you referring to? If you're referring to the initial solo flight, there is no legal requirement placed on you for any certain number of landings - you can do 3 or you can do 30. 3 has always been the 'tradition' for whatever reason and yes traditionally they are 2 touch and goes and 1 full stop but that isn't actually mandated either - they can of course be any type of landing. You are never madated to do any particular type of landing. (Expect for the night currency requirement)

[surreal1221]

Originally Posted by Jason

Which solo requirement are you referring to? If you're referring to the initial solo flight, there is no legal requirement placed on you for any certain number of landings - you can do 3 or you can do 30. 3 has always been the 'tradition' for whatever reason and yes traditionally they are 2 touch and goes and 1 full stop but that isn't actually mandated either - they can of course be any type of landing. You are never madated to do any particular type of landing. (Expect for the night currency requirement)

Yes the initial.

Alright thanks, that clears up some fog.

[Timbuff10]

If you are solo and building solo time for your private there is no reason at all to do a touch n go. You need 10 hrs (less for 141) so why not do a full stop, collect yourself and count that time too.

As I recall, ATP didn't like the touch n goes because at many of the airports they have locations at, the runways were cutting it pretty close for doing a touch n go in a seminole.