Purdue fleet

[Kestrel452]

All I can say for sure is this: Purdue will regret their decision if they move ahead with the Cirruses. Have fun buying all new machinery, parts, tools, and equipment! And good luck repairing a composite airframe after a hard landing.

[Kestrel452]

Originally Posted by OneToGo

can someone explain the kool-aid joke to me please?

[Torch1930]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drinking_the_Kool-Aid

[Gonzo]

Originally Posted by Kestrel452

EDIT: I just read that the ailerons and rudder are linked in the Cirrus. How the HELL are people going to know how to use rudder pedals if everything is incorporated into a single stick?!?! Crosswind landings are going to be quite a sight by students flying these and especially once they get into a plane that actually has independent controls.

A lot of planes have the rudder linked to the ailerons in fact the plane I got my PVT in did. FYI: you still have to use the pedals in a crosswind landing in fact I think it made me better on the pedals.

Originally Posted by Kestrel452

A cirrus WORKS, but it's not by any means the RIGHT aircraft to use as a trainer. Anyone who wants to maximize their job opportunities should get time in a Piper or Cessna with analog systems. Those who want to minimize their job opps should train in glass systems, especially planes like a Cirrus.

At one time I might have agreed with you. But now I don't think it matters. A plane is a plane.

[GUNIT]

Things will happen too fast. A student pilot (or low time PP or really a pilot at any stage) could easily get disoriented if they get complacent. I worry that the students will depend too much on glass and won't learn to look outside.

Not to mention with 17 cirri all coming in and out at the same time at a non-radar tower it's going to be crazy. The push is going to happen faster and finals will be stretched out longer.

[etflies]

A plane is a plane to a higher time pilot who has flown several types. To a low time SP/PP or low time/no-time dual given CFI they can be very different. Going from Warriors to Cirrus when the instruction is already lackluster is a bonehead move. I feel bad for the kids who will never fly instruments on steam gauges, I have a feeling they're going to lack basic situational awareness skills.

[amd87]

Here's an idea: order another Piper fleet...use the money saved to pay the CFIs more than minimum wage so they actually care. Make the CFI process competitive so those who make it through actually build legitimate hours and are a quality product.

What's going to happen to the Frascas? Are they going to get more G1000 sims or keep the steam gauges?

[KSCessnaDriver]

Originally Posted by amd87

Here's an idea: order another Piper fleet...use the money saved to pay the CFIs more than minimum wage so they actually care. Make the CFI process competitive so those who make it through actually build legitimate hours and are a quality product.?

Uhh, you do know that Piper is only offering the PA-28 line with either the Avidyne or the G1000 systems. So, that makes the glass panel point kind of irrelevant. Perhaps a split fleet, like Diamond 20's/40's would have made more sense, but apparently not. Just be happy you didn't end up with Cessna GroundPounders (aka Skycatcher).

[Blip16]

Originally Posted by KSCessnaDriver

Uhh, you do know that Piper is only offering the PA-28 line with either the Avidyne or the G1000 systems. So, that makes the glass panel point kind of irrelevant. Perhaps a split fleet, like Diamond 20's/40's would have made more sense, but apparently not. Just be happy you didn't end up with Cessna GroundPounders (aka Skycatcher).

actually Piper quit making the PA-28's earlier this year or late last year

[amd87]

Originally Posted by KSCessnaDriver

Uhh, you do know that Piper is only offering the PA-28 line with either the Avidyne or the G1000 systems. So, that makes the glass panel point kind of irrelevant. Perhaps a split fleet, like Diamond 20's/40's would have made more sense, but apparently not. Just be happy you didn't end up with Cessna GroundPounders (aka Skycatcher).

Uhh, haven't looked at the numbers but I was assuming that a Cirrus was more pricey than a warrior. I realized that it was going to be glass no matter what, I was curious if they were going to replace their sims as well.

[Kestrel452]

Originally Posted by Blip16

actually Piper quit making the PA-28's earlier this year or late last year

false.

http://www.newpiper.com/home/pages/Warrior.cfm

[Kestrel452]

Just kind of a rant here... This morning during AT144 (Private pilot lectures), my instructor mentioned the push for ATP requirements for all 121 pilots. Then some tool yelled out "Will they give us waivers since we're in a college program?!?!". Wow, just wow.... No one here really has a clue about real life.

[etflies]

Good to know the Kool-Aid is still being poured early on.

[amd87]

Originally Posted by Kestrel452

Just kind of a rant here... This morning during AT144 (Private pilot lectures), my instructor mentioned the push for ATP requirements for all 121 pilots. Then some tool yelled out "Will they give us waivers since we're in a college program?!?!". Wow, just wow.... No one here really has a clue about real life.

What did the prof say?

Also, if this "everyone gets a type rating" thing goes through I doubt anyone will be getting even 40hrs. SIC.

[Blip16]

Originally Posted by Kestrel452

false.

http://www.newpiper.com/home/pages/Warrior.cfm

they are filling orders but are not taking new orders, which is why UND switched to Cessnas

[KSCessnaDriver]

Originally Posted by Blip16

they are filling orders but are not taking new orders, which is why UND switched to Cessnas

Nope, I saw recently that they plan on selling a PA-28 with a G1000 for roughly $300,000. Saw it in one of those monthly magazines, thinking it was AOPA.

[Blip16]

Originally Posted by KSCessnaDriver

Nope, I saw recently that they plan on selling a PA-28 with a G1000 for roughly $300,000. Saw it in one of those monthly magazines, thinking it was AOPA.

well then that changed from when UND was looking, because what we were told (instructors) that Piper decided to not make them anymore. i wish we still had pipers too, they are built a lot better than the 172's

[KSCessnaDriver]

Originally Posted by Blip16

well then that changed from when UND was looking, because what we were told (instructors) that Piper decided to not make them anymore. i wish we still had pipers too, they are built a lot better than the 172's

Its fairly recent. Believe it happened around the same time that Piper got bought out by the company from Singapore, or wherever they are from. I've been looking for the last hour, but haven't been able to find it again. I'll keep looking, and see if I can't find you a link

Edit: Found it. It's not a G1000 outfit, but rather a G600 fitting, with an Stec-55X. Which, IMO, is a better outfit that what they had going with the Avidyne. In any case, the press release says "around 300,000." Hopefully, they are able to sell them for less than the 172, and get some sales going again.

http://www.newpiper.com/pages/PiperA...t_07272009.cfm

[Polar742]

Originally Posted by KSCessnaDriver

Nope, I saw recently that they plan on selling a PA-28 with a G1000 for roughly $300,000. Saw it in one of those monthly magazines, thinking it was AOPA.

YHGTFSM

[MikeD]

Originally Posted by Polar742

YHGTFSM

300K for a flipping PA-28?

[KSCessnaDriver]

Originally Posted by MikeD

300K for a flipping PA-28?

That's very similar in price to any of the "4 place" trainers on the market.

A new Cessna 172 SP costs $297,000.
A new, bone-stock Diamond DA-40 costs $267,000
A new, bone-stock Cirrus SR-20 costs $270,000


By the time you get the latter two, to how the factory typically builds them, they end up around $300,000. Sure, they advertise them that cheap, but you'd have to order it that way. If you go to a dealer, I'd think they are going to be north of $300K for either a DA-40 or SR-20.

[ClearedToThe]

Originally Posted by etflies

A plane is a plane to a higher time pilot who has flown several types. To a low time SP/PP or low time/no-time dual given CFI they can be very different. Going from Warriors to Cirrus when the instruction is already lackluster is a bonehead move. I feel bad for the kids who will never fly instruments on steam gauges, I have a feeling they're going to lack basic situational awareness skills.

But...but...why would I need SA when I'm flying a shiny jet with a flight director?? Brah, I would fly a jet for free it is so much fun. I'm really hoping to get on with RAH and get my hands on that heavy RJ in midwest paint. I am so excited to fly for a mainline!! I have one question about the E190 tho...does anyone know if there is an iPod dock in the flight deck? Thanks in advance!





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