ASA management endorses GoJet - Page 6

ATN_Pilot · January 13th, 2009, 01:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trip7

Exactly right Todd. Btw Steve from your airline was on the jumpseat on my flight this morning from portland, me. He said you're the one that set up ALPA coming to Airtran. Good job bro!

Who, me?

Steve is the man! He definitely helped. Former ACA MEC Chairman, and a hell of a nice guy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ross9238

Surreal and Velo,

Like I said in my first statement, I don't mean to ruffle any of your feathers with my comment. I'm a union member in good standing, paying my dues just like you and do have my membership card easily accessible if need be. Like I said before, this is my opinion and as such, I'm not here to convince anyone here otherwise. To me, if a captain wanted to see that, it would be petty and I've had my share of profiling. I would from my past experiences, would take that as the captain really not wanting to give me a ride. Hence, I would just walk of the aircraft. Again, I'm not saying that they should not be allowed to exercise their authority granted to them by the ALPA manual. It would seem petty that's all, if you know the airline that he/she works for is unionized.

Feel free to catch another ride, then.

Quote:

Originally Posted by joliet

I doubt he has ever denied anyone.

I wouldn't bet any money on that, if I were you.

aloft · January 13th, 2009, 04:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by kellwolf

Really? Got info to back that up, 'cause I know a lot of furloughed major guys that were flying at regionals before they got recalled.....

Fine, several then. Or even some. I know for a fact that Mesaba requires their newhires to resign seniority elsewhere on day one of indoc.

cencal83406 · January 13th, 2009, 05:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by PCL_128

Who, me?

Steve is the man! He definitely helped. Former ACA MEC Chairman, and a hell of a nice guy.

Feel free to catch another ride, then.

I wouldn't bet any money on that, if I were you.

We had a Pinnacle guy on our aircraft (a Pinnacle aircraft) who asked for the Jumpseat. We let him on but the CA said "pretty ballsy of the guy to ask for a jumpseat in jeans". (seat in the back) hahha WTF is wrong with people?!? I'm definitely not faulting the CA - I just can't believe we have people JS'ing in jeans.

Bigey · January 13th, 2009, 05:42

To all those actively fighting against the demise of unions and the degradation of pilot pay, know that those not directly involved with flying still keep their ears open to topics like this.

Assuming all this ATC goes well, i plan on being as active as possible in the union. And will have no problem coming to any pickets, marches, or to any rallies to support your stand!

Know that you have friends in the radios too!!

Velo, PCL, keep up the good fight! We all need to work together to protect our jobs!

ATN_Pilot · January 13th, 2009, 09:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by cencal83406

We had a Pinnacle guy on our aircraft (a Pinnacle aircraft) who asked for the Jumpseat. We let him on but the CA said "pretty ballsy of the guy to ask for a jumpseat in jeans". (seat in the back) hahha WTF is wrong with people?!? I'm definitely not faulting the CA - I just can't believe we have people JS'ing in jeans.

Unbelievable. Where is the sense of professionalism out there in our profession nowadays? On my very last trip at Peanuckle, one of our FOs was jumpseating up to DTW from SDF. He was in his uniform, sans tie, and he was supposed to be riding in the back. He came up and asked for the free ride, and I just stared at his shirt for a few seconds where his tie should have been. Me: "I sure hope you have a tie or a backup flight that'll get you in to De-toilet before your show time, because you sure as hell ain't riding on my airplane where the pax can see you in uniform without a tie." Needless to say, he quickly found his tie and put it on. Seriously folks, wear the uniform properly, or don't bother wearing it at all!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigey

To all those actively fighting against the demise of unions and the degradation of pilot pay, know that those not directly involved with flying still keep their ears open to topics like this.

Assuming all this ATC goes well, i plan on being as active as possible in the union. And will have no problem coming to any pickets, marches, or to any rallies to support your stand!

Know that you have friends in the radios too!!

Velo, PCL, keep up the good fight! We all need to work together to protect our jobs!

I've walked several picket lines with friendly NATCA controllers stopping by to join in the festivities. We were always very appreciative of their support.

Screaming_Emu · January 13th, 2009, 16:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by PCL_128

"I sure hope you have a tie or a backup flight that'll get you in to De-toilet before your show time, because you sure as hell ain't riding on my airplane where the pax can see you in uniform without a tie." Needless to say, he quickly found his tie and put it on.

You showed him! I bet he wears that tie to bed now too!

Velocipede · January 13th, 2009, 16:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by ross9238

I'm not saying that they should not be allowed to exercise their authority granted to them by the ALPA manual. It would seem petty that's all, if you know the airline that he/she works for is unionized.

Ross,

The problem is that virtually all Union airlines have scabs. They don't have Union cards. So to assume a person who works for a Union airline is a member in good standing might be erroneous.

Quote:

Originally Posted by joliet

I'm CURIOUS. Why did you leave out Skywest?

I guess you haven't read many of my other posts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by joliet

I doubt he has ever denied anyone.

I guess you don't know everything, then.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigey

Know that you have friends in the radios too!!

Velo, PCL, keep up the good fight! We all need to work together to protect our jobs!

Amen, brother.

jtrain609 · January 13th, 2009, 16:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by aloft

Fine, several then. Or even some. I know for a fact that Mesaba requires their newhires to resign seniority elsewhere on day one of indoc.

From what I hear, those letters some how get lost as they make their way to HQ for ExpressJet down in Houston. I mean, you know how the postal service loses things.

So you're not giving up your seniority until you don't accept recall.

MSUDAWG · January 13th, 2009, 16:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by cencal83406

We had a Pinnacle guy on our aircraft (a Pinnacle aircraft) who asked for the Jumpseat. We let him on but the CA said "pretty ballsy of the guy to ask for a jumpseat in jeans". (seat in the back) hahha WTF is wrong with people?!? I'm definitely not faulting the CA - I just can't believe we have people JS'ing in jeans.

The exact reason I LOVE riding on FDX...Jeans are A-Ok!

jynxyjoe · January 13th, 2009, 16:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by aloft

Fine, several then. Or even some. I know for a fact that Mesaba requires their newhires to resign seniority elsewhere on day one of indoc.

Yeah but we arn't hiring till late summer supposedly. Not really a part of the conversation is it?

surreal1221 · January 13th, 2009, 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Screaming_Emu

You showed him! I bet he wears that tie to bed now too!

Come on man. Seriously.

Has nothing to do with showing someone anything. It has to do with maintaining professional standards while in the public's view. Is that too much to ask when trying to catch a ride home or to work? If you can't wear the tie to commute home, then get out of the uniform and into some civilian duds.

Screaming_Emu · January 13th, 2009, 17:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by surreal1221

Come on man. Seriously.

Has nothing to do with showing someone anything. It has to do with maintaining professional standards while in the public's view. Is that too much to ask when trying to catch a ride home or to work? If you can't wear the tie to commute home, then get out of the uniform and into some civilian duds.

I agree that the guy should be wearing a tie...but again my point is that it doesn't need to be so drama filled. "Sure, put on a tie and you're all set" would have sufficed. I seriously doubt that this jumpseater now goes "Oh, I need to make sure I wear a tie because that guy at PCL wasn't going to let me ride". I bet its more along the lines of "man, that guy was a dick!" Not saying he is...but when you deliver a message like that, that's how you come across.

As usual, agree with the method, but if you actually want to make a difference instead of make drama, don't be a weenie.

surreal1221 · January 13th, 2009, 20:33

See, now there you go.

You contributing something to the discussion as opposed to simply a quick hit and run jab.

It is possible.

We can sit here and debate the methods all day long, but the message is still the same.

If you're going to wear the uniform, wear it properly IAW your company's prescribed procedures.

kellwolf · January 14th, 2009, 18:57

Jeans.....not on my flight. You can't even non-rev in jeans per the company standards, so why am I gonna let you JS. As for the tie....if you're wearing the epaulets and no tie, I'll ask you to put it on. If you're doing the "no epaulet, no tie, no blazer" incognito thing, I'll let it go. I don't strut around the Mall of America in MSP on a 4:59 sit in my uniform.

joliet · January 15th, 2009, 00:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by kellwolf

Jeans.....not on my flight. You can't even non-rev in jeans per the company standards, so why am I gonna let you JS. As for the tie....if you're wearing the epaulets and no tie, I'll ask you to put it on. If you're doing the "no epaulet, no tie, no blazer" incognito thing, I'll let it go. I don't strut around the Mall of America in MSP on a 4:59 sit in my uniform.

I love internet rhetoric. You would start a war over someone wearing jeans. If your best buddy was going on vacation, and he was jumpseating on your plane in a hawaii shirt, shorts, and gym shoes, you would DENY him?

Power tripping jumpseat cop wannabes. So obnoxious.

ATN_Pilot · January 15th, 2009, 01:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by joliet

I love internet rhetoric. You would start a war over someone wearing jeans.

War? Melodramatic much?

Rules are rules. You don't jumpseat in jeans.

Quote:

If your best buddy was going on vacation, and he was jumpseating on your plane in a hawaii shirt, shorts, and gym shoes, you would DENY him?

Damn straight.

Quote:

Power tripping jumpseat cop wannabes. So obnoxious.

Unprofessional air line pilot wannabes. So obnoxious.

cencal83406 · January 15th, 2009, 01:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by joliet

I love internet rhetoric. You would start a war over someone wearing jeans. If your best buddy was going on vacation, and he was jumpseating on your plane in a hawaii shirt, shorts, and gym shoes, you would DENY him?

Power tripping jumpseat cop wannabes. So obnoxious.

Every time I jumpseat, I wear slacks and a tucked in button-down shirt. Anytime I non-rev (IE I've got a seat in the back with a PNR), I go up front and request permission for the ride. It's not just about the ALPA jumpseat manual (which, btw, if you were an airline pilot fo reals you'd have), it's also about respecting the crew you're going with. If I have to be the only passenger who appreciates the ride, I darn well will be, and I'll be sure to show it.

= STFD; Let's get released, boys! =

Rocketman99 · January 15th, 2009, 01:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by joliet

I love internet rhetoric. You would start a war over someone wearing jeans. If your best buddy was going on vacation, and he was jumpseating on your plane in a hawaii shirt, shorts, and gym shoes, you would DENY him?

Power tripping jumpseat cop wannabes. So obnoxious.

You're damn right I would. Standards are standards and rules are rules. I'm sorry you'd rather be the cool guy. For me, I'd rather keep what's left there is of the prestige of the profession. Every little bit counts.

Doug Taylor · January 15th, 2009, 01:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by joliet

I love internet rhetoric. You would start a war over someone wearing jeans. If your best buddy was going on vacation, and he was jumpseating on your plane in a hawaii shirt, shorts, and gym shoes, you would DENY him?

Power tripping jumpseat cop wannabes. So obnoxious.

You can't ride the Southernjets jumpseat in jeans either. Non rev? All day. But jumpseat, absolutely not.

Here's the trick, and this is how things usually go down.

Say someone wants to jumpseat and is wearing jeans. The lead flight attendant, who probably once tried to ride their jumpseat but was denied because of improper attire sees the pilot jumpseater get a ride to XYZ.

She talks to her manager about how SHE got rejected from the jumpseat for wearing jeans, but a captain let a pilot ride the jumpseat (cabin or cockpit) in jeans and now she's upset.

Word gets back to your chief pilot about the situation and you get called in and he has you read the jumpseat acceptable dress policy and you were in violation of the FOM.

How about a couple days off without pay?

The union can't help you if you willfully violate the FOM without any rationale beyond, "Oh, come on man, lighten up a little".

Trust me, I've almost gotten some unpaid time off in the last few months for a decision my captain made. If the jeans-wearing jumpseat rider wants to slide me a check for a 2500 bucks that I'd be out of for missing a three day ATH trip if the skipper gets busted, MAAAAAAYBE.

I'm as koombayah as the next guy but I'm not potentially taking an unpaid holiday because I want an additional person on my Facebook friends list.

A jumpseat rider should understand the rules and expect to follow them. Always plan and dress accordingly if your chief pilot is sitting in the left seat when you walk up to introduce yourself.

cencal83406 · January 15th, 2009, 01:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug Taylor

You can't ride the Southernjets jumpseat in jeans either. Non rev? All day. But jumpseat, absolutely not.

Here's the trick, and this is how things usually go down.

Say someone wants to jumpseat and is wearing jeans. The lead flight attendant, who probably once tried to ride their jumpseat but was denied because of improper attire sees the pilot jumpseater get a ride to XYZ.

She talks to her manager about how SHE got rejected from the jumpseat for wearing jeans, but a captain let a pilot ride the jumpseat (cabin or cockpit) in jeans and now she's upset.

Word gets back to your chief pilot about the situation and you get called in and he has you read the jumpseat acceptable dress policy and you were in violation of the FOM.

How about a couple days off without pay?

The union can't help you if you willfully violate the FOM without any rationale beyond, "Oh, come on man, lighten up a little".

Trust me, I've almost gotten some unpaid time off in the last few months for a decision my captain made. If the jeans-wearing jumpseat rider wants to slide me a check for a 2500 bucks that I'd be out of for missing a three day ATH trip if the skipper gets busted, MAAAAAAYBE.

I'm as koombayah as the next guy but I'm not potentially taking an unpaid holiday because I want an additional person on my Facebook friends list.

A jumpseat rider should understand the rules and expect to follow them. Always plan and dress accordingly if your chief pilot is sitting in the left seat when you walk up to introduce yourself.

Why are we even bothering justifying normal procedures with a person who probably doesn't fly in the 121 world?

Doug Taylor · January 15th, 2009, 01:38

I presumed incorrectly that he was at a 121 carrier with a jumpseat policy. My bad!

joliet · January 15th, 2009, 02:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by PCL_128

War? Melodramatic much?

Rules are rules. You don't jumpseat in jeans.

Damn straight.

Unprofessional air line pilot wannabes. So obnoxious.

I'm furloughed right now PCL. Good discussion here, and everyone has valid points. I've never ever ridden on any Delta, or Delta FFD carriers. I've ridden on NWA in jeans, in the cockpit, in first class, in coach with a nice collared polo shirt. Obviously people are wearing nicer jeans when they do. Anyhow.

One thing I will not put up with is after only being a commercial pilot for a short time in both 135 and 121 operations, that PCL-128 calls me a wannabe, when he paid for his first 121 job. PCL-128, you disgust me.

That's all I have to say about that.........

Doug Taylor · January 15th, 2009, 02:38

Please, don't show up and universally expect to ride the jumpseat in jeans.

aloft · January 15th, 2009, 03:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by jynxyjoe

Yeah but we arn't hiring till late summer supposedly. Not really a part of the conversation is it?

The fact that you're not hiring til late summer is irrelevant. What IS relevant is that your company's policy on the subject is the same as GoJet's, which Gulfstream PFJ Boy says is proof of their evilness.

Quote:

Originally Posted by joliet

..that PCL-128 calls me a wannabe, when he paid for his first 121 job. PCL-128, you disgust me.

Welcome to the club, man. Welcome to the club.

Doug Taylor · January 15th, 2009, 04:25

Mr. Patton, you're supposed to cross the bridge and then destroy it.

January 13th, 2009, 05:42	#129
Bigey Old Skool Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Socal Posts: 3,764	Re: ASA management endorses GoJet To all those actively fighting against the demise of unions and the degradation of pilot pay, know that those not directly involved with flying still keep their ears open to topics like this. Assuming all this ATC goes well, i plan on being as active as possible in the union. And will have no problem coming to any pickets, marches, or to any rallies to support your stand! Know that you have friends in the radios too!! Velo, PCL, keep up the good fight! We all need to work together to protect our jobs! __________________ PUBNAT'er 4 LIFE!

January 13th, 2009, 20:33	#138
surreal1221 Old Skool Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Away from an Airport Posts: 14,073	Re: ASA management endorses GoJet See, now there you go. You contributing something to the discussion as opposed to simply a quick hit and run jab. It is possible. We can sit here and debate the methods all day long, but the message is still the same. If you're going to wear the uniform, wear it properly IAW your company's prescribed procedures. __________________ DoD WxFcstr.AGI.MEI.CFI.CFII.FO.CRJ2.Furloughed \| The TRoP \| ALPA \| APSA \| ACLU \| IVAW \| Acey 80\|

January 14th, 2009, 18:57	#139
kellwolf Old Skool Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 16,979	Re: ASA management endorses GoJet Jeans.....not on my flight. You can't even non-rev in jeans per the company standards, so why am I gonna let you JS. As for the tie....if you're wearing the epaulets and no tie, I'll ask you to put it on. If you're doing the "no epaulet, no tie, no blazer" incognito thing, I'll let it go. I don't strut around the Mall of America in MSP on a 4:59 sit in my uniform. __________________ "I'm The Doctor, by the way. Run for your life!"

January 15th, 2009, 01:38	#146
Doug Taylor Agent Smith Join Date: Dec 1969 Location: KSDL Posts: 50,368 Blog Entries: 1	Re: ASA management endorses GoJet I presumed incorrectly that he was at a 121 carrier with a jumpseat policy. My bad! __________________ Doug Taylor PPL-SEL PA-38 Typed

January 15th, 2009, 02:38	#148
Doug Taylor Agent Smith Join Date: Dec 1969 Location: KSDL Posts: 50,368 Blog Entries: 1	Re: ASA management endorses GoJet Please, don't show up and universally expect to ride the jumpseat in jeans. __________________ Doug Taylor PPL-SEL PA-38 Typed

January 15th, 2009, 04:25	#150
Doug Taylor Agent Smith Join Date: Dec 1969 Location: KSDL Posts: 50,368 Blog Entries: 1	Re: ASA management endorses GoJet Mr. Patton, you're supposed to cross the bridge and then destroy it. __________________ Doug Taylor PPL-SEL PA-38 Typed

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