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March 22nd, 2006, 12:20
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| Old Skool  Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Left Seat
Posts: 5,251
 |  Gulfstream and Old Captains Little things that make you laugh at 5:45 in the morning... We originated in Gainesville, FL yesterday morning. It was a 6:55 flight so we caught a 6am van. Also waiting for the van was a 9E crew and a Gulfstream crew. Both the 9E guys and us were groups of 3 and the GIA guys, being on the 1900 had only 2. The problem was the van only seated 5. Both flight attendents hadn't made it downstairs yet, so my captain and the 9E captain agreed that whatever FA made it first that crew would take the first van. Fair enough... Quick side note.... my captain is a furloughed mainline guy who is about 58. Been there... done that and probably seen it a few more times as well. So our FA showed about 30 seconds in front of the 9E FA so we got in the van with the Gulfstream guys. The GIA captain immediatly takes the front seat and smirks at us. Ok... maybe I am predisposed to not liking these guys, but I felt it was a little rude. Then the GIA FO askes be how long I've been flying for Express and then asked how many hours I had when I got hired. I told him and he says "wow... that's high". I tell him that I think it was actually pretty low. He then goes into this thing about how he got hired at 250 hours and how great it was that he was pretty much gurenteed a job all through training and how much of a better way it is to go. The kicker? He says "at least I didn't have to waste all that time instructing". Grrr. Well, my captain steps in and asks the FO what the companies listed mins are. The FO replies 250 if you do the program. The CA looks back at him and says... "huh... I thought it was 30,000.... dollars that is." It was pretty quiet for the rest of the ride. I thought it was funny for 6am in the morning. |
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March 22nd, 2006, 12:36
| #2 |
| Senior Member  Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Oregon
Posts: 376
| Buuuurn ... Good one, though.  You would think these guys would have a little humility. Not to say that they all have a big head, but I just don't understand how you can think you're hot stuff when you've got less than 300 hours under your belt, especially in a job you didn't earn. Is it supposed to suggest they've got some hot stick n' rudder skills or something? Boggles my mind. I almost feel bad for them, because the fact that they Gulfsreamed is gonnna follow them around wherever they go. They're gonna have that albatross hangin' around for the remainder of their career. Maybe they didn't do their research, and didn't realize how bad it was for the industry, and the kind of flak they'd get for it. Oh well, they brought it on themselves. This isn't a career you wanna go into without doing some research. |
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March 22nd, 2006, 12:45
| #3 | |
| Senior Member  Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: So. California
Posts: 1,304
| Quote:
 I'm really glad that wasn't me in that van. | |
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March 22nd, 2006, 12:55
| #4 | |
| Old Skool  Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Fort Lauderdale
Posts: 2,690
| I wish I was there to see the look on that FO's face! Awsome!
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March 22nd, 2006, 13:05
| #5 |
| Senior Member  Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: California
Posts: 1,242
| Classic! |
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March 22nd, 2006, 13:24
| #6 |
| Old Skool  Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 6,462
| I wonder what the Gulfstream Capt in the front was thinking.... |
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March 22nd, 2006, 13:28
| #7 |
| Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 6,462
| From the Gulfstream testimonial page: http://www.gulfstreamacademy.com/testimonials.php First Officer Ken Lindsay "Instead of using my time as a flight instructor, I can fly for an airline in a period of four months and build some real time, Turbine Time !" First Officer Ken Lindsay |
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March 22nd, 2006, 15:20
| #8 |
| Senior Member  Join Date: May 2003 Location: Colorado Springs
Posts: 812
| Even if you only make $20K on first year pay, that's $50K more than the GIA F/O. |
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March 22nd, 2006, 15:41
| #9 |
| Old Skool  Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Boca Raton
Posts: 6,011
| At least you guys are patient. I'd like to see some other people in this forum in that situation. Somebody would come out with a bloody nose. |
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March 22nd, 2006, 15:55
| #10 |
| Agent Smith  | Good composure! I'm a naturally sarcastic/sardonic speaker so chances are, he wouldn't have liked my interaction!
__________________ Doug Taylor http://76school.flyblog.com (old!) http://30west.flyblog.com (updated 11/28) |
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March 22nd, 2006, 16:56
| #11 | |
| Old Skool  Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: KPHX, KFFZ, KIWA
Posts: 18,505
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March 22nd, 2006, 17:21
| #12 |
| Junior Member  Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 145
| Passive aggressive is not the same thing as sarcastic or sardonic. I really cannot stand when people are passive aggressive. It's basically a defensive technique used when you're verbally backed into a corner by someone with a bit more wit.
__________________ Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return. - Leonardo da Vinci |
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March 22nd, 2006, 17:22
| #13 | |
| Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 145
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__________________ Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return. - Leonardo da Vinci | |
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March 22nd, 2006, 17:32
| #14 | |
| Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: KPHX, KFFZ, KIWA
Posts: 18,505
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March 22nd, 2006, 17:36
| #15 |
| Old Skool  | Epaulets (2 stripe)...$8 Hat...$70 Look on the FOs face...Priceless... ...To be a fly on the wall...
__________________ As a wise man said, sumb!tch flew in, sumb!tch'll fly out. Ski Hard. Party Harder. |
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March 22nd, 2006, 18:09
| #16 |
| Agent Smith | "Full boat back to Ft. Lauderdale, skipper?" "Yup" "Twenty paying passengers, eh? "
__________________ Doug Taylor http://76school.flyblog.com (old!) http://30west.flyblog.com (updated 11/28) |
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March 22nd, 2006, 18:20
| #17 | |
| Old Skool Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: _
Posts: 5,118
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March 22nd, 2006, 18:38
| #18 |
| Agent Smith | Is he complaining about pay yet?
__________________ Doug Taylor http://76school.flyblog.com (old!) http://30west.flyblog.com (updated 11/28) |
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March 22nd, 2006, 22:03
| #19 |
| Junior Member  Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 110
| So let me understand this, the GIA guys join the FO program with a Commercial and therefore lets say 260 hours TT. They add 250 hours of turbine and have 510 TT with probably 50 ME from their initial training at an FBO, and 250 Turbine SIC from Gulfstream Academy. Aside from the fact that they have PFT, doesn't the lack of PIC go against them anyway when they apply to the regionals? |
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March 22nd, 2006, 22:17
| #20 |
| Old Skool Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Left Seat
Posts: 5,251
| Yes and sort of. It should in theory make it difficult for them to get jobs elsewhere, but unfortunatly several regionals have made it a habit of taking them. |
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March 22nd, 2006, 22:22
| #21 |
| Senior Member  Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: South Florida
Posts: 703
| That one left a mark |
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March 22nd, 2006, 23:38
| #22 | |
| Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 1,419
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Here's NTSB report (one of them) regarding PNCL from http://www.ntsb.gov/events/2005/Pinn...its/317489.pdf N. Gulfstream International Airlines Gulfstream International Airlines began service as an on-demand charter airline in 1988. The company began Part 121 scheduled service as a regional airline in 1990 and had more than 170 scheduled flights each day servicing South Florida and the Bahamas using BE-1900 turboprop airplanes. The company had a code share alliance agreement with Continental Airlines, Inc., and they were doing business as a Continental Connection. Company headquarters was located in Fort Lauderdale, Florida, and was the parent company of Gulfstream Academy. Gulfstream Academy was established by Mr. Thomas Cooper, the founder, president, and chief operating officer (CEO) of Gulfstream International Airlines. The Academy offered a Part 121 first officer training course that was conducted by Gulfstream International Airlines. The course took 12 weeks to complete and included ground school, simulator training, and flight training in the BE-1900. Enrollment qualifications included a commercial pilot certificate, instrument rating, and a multi-engine rating. Upon graduation, a pilot was guaranteed 250 hours as a paid first officer for Gulfstream International Airlines. The first officer training course helped to fill vacancies left by Gulfstream International Airlines pilots who had accepted employment with other airlines. In 2002, Pinnacle Airlines began hiring a percentage of their new-hire first officers from Gulfstream International Airlines. They hired the first officers who had completed the first officer training program at Gulfstream Academy. Pinnacle considered it advantageous to hire those pilots because they had Part 121 experience and they had learned in a structured training environment. Pinnacle Airlines hired them with less total flight time than would have been acceptable for candidates who had a different background. The total flight time requirements for Gulfstream Academy graduates was dependent on the applicant but generally, 500 hours was considered the minimum. Other new-hire candidates were required to have 1500 total flight hours and 300 hours in multi-engine airplanes. Based on company records reviewed during the investigation and interviews with instructors and checkairman, it was determined that the Gulfstream Academy pilots did not experience any particular problems as they progressed through Pinnacle’s new-hire training syllabus. Even though they had less total flight hours than other new-hire first officers, there was not an increase in the overall failure rate in either ground or flight training. | |
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March 22nd, 2006, 23:52
| #23 | |
| Senior Member  Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 1,021
| Quote:
The other was a friend in training and while he's a good guy, he just didn't have enough background and exposure to aviation to really "get it." As far as PIC time, if you don't have 250 PIC when you get an ATP (or upgrade to CA) your license will have the phrase" Holder does not meet the pilot-in-command experience requirements of ICAO" . Not sure how this would impact their flying though. I have seen a few airline apps (like SWA) that require an unrestricted ATP, so it might present a difficulty later on. | |
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March 23rd, 2006, 00:04
| #24 | ||
| Senior Member  Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: IND
Posts: 562
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March 23rd, 2006, 00:11
| #25 |
| Agent Smith | "Weee! It ROXORS d00d! The guys that I play Unreal: Tournament with are going to totally be PWNT when they see the k00l job my dad bought me! LOLZ!"
__________________ Doug Taylor http://76school.flyblog.com (old!) http://30west.flyblog.com (updated 11/28) |
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