Jump Pilots

[Hawks]

Any other jump pilots out there? I am creeping up on 500 hours, 2 to go! Getting a lot of up and down time. Wondering what other people's experiences are working for various dropzones. At this point in our flying careers building time is building time. How do future employers look at this?

Any experiences, stories and comments are greatly appreciated!

[Greg01]

It's fun to watch new jumpers on the loooong ride up. I, personally, like the ride down...that's where I get to have my fun

What are you flying?

Greg

[jrh]

I used to be / am a jump pilot. Fly a 1960 Cessna 182C. That's right, the C model.

My dropzone is kind of a small, sleepy place. We only jump on Saturdays, Sundays, and sometimes Friday nights during daylight savings time.

I started working there a couple years ago when I first moved to town because it was the only flying job I could find. I had about 1,100 or 1,200 hours at the time I think, so I wasn't interested in building time as much as staying current and getting a paycheck. They hire in to a pool of about 6 or 8 pilots, then send out an e-mail at the start of the week asking who wants to cover what times the following weekend. First guys to respond get to fly.

All the people there are great. Very safety oriented and a lot of old timers who have been jumping for the past 10 or 20 years. Super friendly, too...hangar has a bunk house to sleep eight, WiFi, BBQ pit, big screen TV, kitchen, etc. so even on the crappy weather days there are usually a few guys hanging out.

I had so much fun flying for them that even when a flight school hired me full time as an instructor, I only took the job on the condition that I'd have every weekend off to fly jumpers.

Honestly, I find the flying to be the simplest, most boring flying I've ever done. Day VFR in low wind and high ceilings. Up and down, up and down, at the same airport over and over. Very little to enhance a person's skills, so I can understand if an employer doesn't put much stock in jump pilot time. But I keep doing the job because of the people I work with, not the flight experience.

The pay is pretty low. I get $3.00/hour to sit on the ground and $12.50/tach hour for flying. It works out to be about $60-$70/day on a busy summer day or $25 on a slow winter day.

However, for every 25 tach hours a pilot flies, he gets a free jump. For the first jump, that's a $200 value, so it can equal a $8/hour bonus if you want to think of it that way.

And that's how they hooked me. Being the cheap pilot I am, I couldn't stand to pass up a free $200, even if I had little interest in jumping. I took their static line course and made a jump.

The moment I let go of the wing strut, I was hooked. Hands down one of the coolest things I've ever done.

Of course just like flight training, my three obstacles were time, money, and weather. I jumped off and on for about a year, but didn't make any significant progress. Finally, a month ago, after saving all summer, I got back in to it for good. I'm out there every chance I get.

Now I've told them to only call me if they're really desperate for a pilot. I'd rather be jumping than flying.

As for crazy dropzone stories...I don't have much. Maintenance on the plane is good, and like I said, there are a lot of old timers who have "been there, done that," and don't really care to scare themselves anymore.

On that note, I'm headed to the drop zone. Got cleared for my first full altitude jump yesterday and can't wait to go make jump #22!

[Hawks]

What are you flying?

Greg[/QUOTE]

I fly a Cessna 206. Only flew .6 today, we were winded out. I am using this job strictly as a time builder, as mentioned earlier, future employers probably aren't going to take stalk in a lot of jump pilot time, but hell I am flying.

I need to work on my CFI ticket. I am taking next weekend off to go to a Boogie in Mesquite, that way I can get some jumps in.

[JordanD]

Originally Posted by Greg01

I, personally, like the ride down...that's where I get to have my fun



Greg

God I want one of those.

[FiveO]

I've farted around here and there with dropping meat missiles with friends. I always had/have fun doing it. I agree with Greg about watching new jumpers for the first time. Reality hits hard when that door opens up. Personally, you couldn't pay me any amount of money to jump. I'm just fine staying strapped in. I've only dropped people from a 182, Twin Otter, and a Caravan.

[tjvpa28]

What kind of hours / experience do you normally need to be a jump pilot? Sounds like a fun job.

[jrh]

Originally Posted by tjvpa28

What kind of hours / experience do you normally need to be a jump pilot? Sounds like a fun job.

Depends a lot on insurance.

At my dropzone, flying a 182, our insurance requires 500 TT and 25 in make/model (C-182).

I've heard of DZs flying turbine equipment requiring 1000+ TT for planes like Caravans.

Beyond that, I don't know.

[jrh]

Originally Posted by FiveO

I agree with Greg about watching new jumpers for the first time. Reality hits hard when that door opens up.

The funny thing is, of the nearly 300 loads I've carried, not a single person has refused to jump. Some are obviously more nervous than others, but they've all gone out.

[Giggity]

Originally Posted by Hawks

Any other jump pilots out there? I am creeping up on 500 hours, 2 to go! Getting a lot of up and down time. Wondering what other people's experiences are working for various dropzones. At this point in our flying careers building time is building time. How do future employers look at this?

Any experiences, stories and comments are greatly appreciated!

My best friend used to fly jumpers. He built the majority of his 2k flight hours by doing that. He had a hell of a time getting a job at the regionals with his skydiving hours. Alot of companies are not fans of skydive hours, but at least its fun flying. I would recomend getting your cfi asap.

[Hawks]

I have to say I was lucky when I started flying skydivers in the 206, at 315 hours TT. But happening to be a skydiver and a rigger probably helped with that.

Working at dropzones can be an interesting experience. You have to as much as possible stay out of the DZ drama.

But I agree that getting my CFI tickets ASAP would probably be a good idea, so I can start adding in dual given, XC, night flying, etc under my belt.

[ackeight]

I was lucky enough to land a job with a wet commercial. Being the nieve youngster, I didn't ask the pertinant questions. Like, was their insurance?When was the last annual, ect. I just wanted to fly. It was two beautiful 1956 (not a typo) 182's. Oh boy! The absolute most fun and hands on experience I had ever that at that point. Flew out of a grass strip too, which made it even better. You get to hear and see the craziest stories EVER. There was this one video of a guy doing a half cuban(not sure the technical term in jumpology) very close to the ground. He did it a little too close smacked the ground, bounced, hit the cowling of a parked airplane and flipped over into the hangar. By far the funniest thing I've ever seen in my life. Unfortunatly, it came at a price of a broken leg, but the owner wanted to kick his A$$. Never saw him again. The busted cowling still on the hangar wall.
Overall I think it's good experience. Go in their with an open mind, don't worry about the pay, and make sure everthing is legit.

[Greg01]

Nice! I'm flying a 1957 C182. It's a nice piece of equipment. I've always wanted to jump and the stars aligned yesterday and it happened. Such a blast. Flying jumpers and CFI'ing is a really good deal and it keeps me productive. The combo is great!

It's fun when you beat the jumpers to the ground!

Greg

[Murdoughnut]

So what if you have a CPL and someone comes to you and asks if they can pay you to jump out of your 172. Anything illegal about that? (assuming they can actually get out of the plane).

[jrh]

Originally Posted by Murdoughnut

So what if you have a CPL and someone comes to you and asks if they can pay you to jump out of your 172. Anything illegal about that? (assuming they can actually get out of the plane).

Nope, totally legal. Just make sure your plane has a current 100 hour / annual inspection.

Or, if they're not paying you, all you need to do is follow the regs for parachute operations. A private pilot certificate and airworthy aircraft is enough as long as it's not a "for hire" operation.

[Murdoughnut]

Originally Posted by jrh

Nope, totally legal. Just make sure your plane has a current 100 hour / annual inspection.

Or, if they're not paying you, all you need to do is follow the regs for parachute operations. A private pilot certificate and airworthy aircraft is enough as long as it's not a "for hire" operation.

Interesting...

[Propilot]

Originally Posted by jrh

Nope, totally legal. Just make sure your plane has a current 100 hour / annual inspection.

Or, if they're not paying you, all you need to do is follow the regs for parachute operations. A private pilot certificate and airworthy aircraft is enough as long as it's not a "for hire" operation.

Sorry, not true. Back when I took Aviation Law we went over a case study of a pilot who was violated because of this. The pilots logged hours were considered compensation. I'm sure you can find some local POI to say otherwise, but when the **** hits the fan, its the Administrative Law Judge who will decide your fate, no one else.


Also, the FAA is cracking down on parachute ops. You can expect more ramp checks in the future. The USPA has published an updated guide on how to comply with federal regulations and it is available on its website, www.uspa.org. This is an attempt to pre-empt drastic reg changes/restrictions due to the high number of parachute plane accidents in recent years.




To the original poster, my career progression was...

Skydive C206 PIC (Cape Cod, MA)
Skydive C206 PIC (Fremont County, CO)
Skydive DHC-6 PIC (Tecumseh, MI)
Ameriflight BE99 PIC (Salt Lake City, UT)
Eastway Aviation BE350 PIC (Reading, PA)
BE200 PIC (Bamako, Mali & Kamis Saudi Arabia)
BE200 PIC (Denver, CO)


Did it hurt my progression? Id say no, because the turbine twin time in Tecumseh helped get me the job with AMF. However, I will say this: Flying skydivers for a long time made the learning curve at Ameriflight very very steep. Had it not been for a sympathetic training captain I would have certainly washed out. I had no IFR experience (not even IFR flight plan experience) before that job except for my IFR rating training.

In short, take the job if you can get one, try to instruct on the side (preferably instrument students), and move up to twin turbine aircraft soon or move on.

Good luck.

[twdeckard]

Originally Posted by Propilot

Sorry, not true. Back when I took Aviation Law we went over a case study of a pilot who was violated because of this. The pilots logged hours were considered compensation.

In the hypothetical the pilot is flying their airplane and bearing the cost. There is no compensation in the form of free flying hours. The Aviation Law case(s) refer to situations in which a pilot flys for free and is regarded as being rewarded with the free flying (someone else is absorbing the aircraft costs).

Dropping jumpers on your barbecue party is a part 91 operation and a 100 hour is not necessary.

[Murdoughnut]

Originally Posted by Propilot

Sorry, not true. Back when I took Aviation Law we went over a case study of a pilot who was violated because of this. The pilots logged hours were considered compensation. I'm sure you can find some local POI to say otherwise, but when the **** hits the fan, its the Administrative Law Judge who will decide your fate, no one else.

Good luck.

In my example, I said someone with a CPL ... if that matters

[Cptnchia]

Originally Posted by Giggity

He had a hell of a time getting a job at the regionals with his skydiving hours. Alot of companies are not fans of skydive hours, but at least its fun flying. I would recomend getting your cfi asap.

I guess it depends on the time and company. My diver driver time came in handy with ASA and I had a few good stories to tell when I interviewed with Delta. I even told the shrink that he had a bigger death wish than me because as a skydiver, at least I had a reserve while he, as a hang gliderer, didn't have squat. He actually agreed with me.


FWIW, I also was instructing during the week and working the DZ on the weekend.

[jrh]

Originally Posted by Propilot

Sorry, not true. Back when I took Aviation Law we went over a case study of a pilot who was violated because of this. The pilots logged hours were considered compensation. I'm sure you can find some local POI to say otherwise, but when the **** hits the fan, its the Administrative Law Judge who will decide your fate, no one else.

If I own a plane (which I do), and I have skydiver friends (which I do), who want to jump out of my plane, it's completely legal. That's all I'm saying.

Now, how to safely exit a C-140, that's the question...

Originally Posted by Propilot

Also, the FAA is cracking down on parachute ops. You can expect more ramp checks in the future. The USPA has published an updated guide on how to comply with federal regulations and it is available on its website, www.uspa.org. This is an attempt to pre-empt drastic reg changes/restrictions due to the high number of parachute plane accidents in recent years.

I know. Our rival drop zone just balled up a 182 a few weeks ago (poorly trained pilot + overloaded aircraft + short grass strip = crash). It's a miracle nobody was killed.

The skydiver in me hopes the USPA is successful and continues to self-regulate the industry in order to keep the sport cheaper and easier to enter while maintaining adequate safety. The pilot in me wouldn't mind if the the feds tightened everything down. I'm not really surprised by how many accidents happen. The industry is full of mediocre pilots flying mediocre aircraft. It's really amazing what some DZs get away with.

[Murdoughnut]

Originally Posted by jrh

If I own a plane (which I do), and I have skydiver friends (which I do), who want to jump out of my plane, it's completely legal. That's all I'm saying.

Now, how to safely exit a C-140, that's the question...



I know. Our rival drop zone just balled up a 182 a few weeks ago (poorly trained pilot + overloaded aircraft + short grass strip = crash). It's a miracle nobody was killed.

The skydiver in me hopes the USPA is successful and continues to self-regulate the industry in order to keep the sport cheaper and easier to enter while maintaining adequate safety. The pilot in me wouldn't mind if the the feds tightened everything down. I'm not really surprised by how many accidents happen. The industry is full of mediocre pilots flying mediocre aircraft. It's really amazing what some DZs get away with.

On an unrelated note, a buddy of mine just bought a 140 and is looking to replace the wheels that are on it (apparently they flex or something, like a B-52 the way he described it). Know anyone with parts to spare?

[jrh]

Originally Posted by Murdoughnut

On an unrelated note, a buddy of mine just bought a 140 and is looking to replace the wheels that are on it (apparently they flex or something, like a B-52 the way he described it). Know anyone with parts to spare?

I don't know anyone personally, but send your friend to the 120-140 Association. It's the aircraft's type club. They're extremely helpful and can find just about anything. Saved me more than once.

http://www.cessna120-140.org/

[canadian_atc]

Did it for one summer, flying a Cessna 182 "Super"
(New Engine, ported etc) Me plus 5 jumpers getting 1200FPM off the ground, never less than 500 FPM all the way to 10.5K

Kinda miss it.

[Jbroz04]

Anyone have any info on central michigan skydiving? They offerend me a job about a month ago which I turned down because I dont want to go up there with the season almost over but they asked about next year. Just wondering how busy they are and if they are a good operation?