who to call, how to find out?

[Matt13C]

I was on my long cross country today and I had some unexpected weather. I got a detailed briefing from DUAT and also looked over the maps on Aviationweather.noaa.gov before I departed and all signs pointed to a go. Winds calm, scattered at 8000 for the whole area and nothing pointed to weather moving into my path.

As I was flying the clouds started to close in on me, they were down around 4000. Certainly did not expect this. I tuned in the AWOS for the landing airport but was too far out to pick it up. I was already talking to approach control for flight following but he was kind of busy and I have heard they do not like when you ask for a weather update.

I went on a bit further and conditions continued to deteriorated, got good and turbulent, clouds got darker and they looked like they were down below my altitude up ahead so I decided to turn back and try another day.

How would you have handled the situation? Would you have asked approach for a weather update or ask to change frequency to contact FSS for a weather update? I am not exactly sure how they work, will they give me the current situation or just read me the metar?

[scooter2525]

Originally Posted by Matt13C

How would you have handled the situation? Would you have asked approach for a weather update or ask to change frequency to contact FSS for a weather update? I am not exactly sure how they work, will they give me the current situation or just read me the metar?

Haven't been on a CC in a while due to current job but....

might try flightwatch 122.0. Im sure center wouldnt have a problem with you changing freq real quick....

[Grabo172]

Originally Posted by scooter2525

might try flightwatch 122.0. Im sure center wouldnt have a problem with you changing freq real quick....

You handled the situation well... sounds like you made a good decision to turn around before you got in the soup (IMC).

If you want to talk to flight watch just ask the controller for a "temporary frequency change to contact flight watch" and they'd probably say " frequency change approved, report back on this frequency".

Good job!

[mooneyguy]

Originally Posted by Matt13C

I was on my long cross country today and I had some unexpected weather. I got a detailed briefing from DUAT and also looked over the maps on Aviationweather.noaa.gov before I departed and all signs pointed to a go. Winds calm, scattered at 8000 for the whole area and nothing pointed to weather moving into my path.

As I was flying the clouds started to close in on me, they were down around 4000. Certainly did not expect this. I tuned in the AWOS for the landing airport but was too far out to pick it up. I was already talking to approach control for flight following but he was kind of busy and I have heard they do not like when you ask for a weather update.

I went on a bit further and conditions continued to deteriorated, got good and turbulent, clouds got darker and they looked like they were down below my altitude up ahead so I decided to turn back and try another day.

How would you have handled the situation? Would you have asked approach for a weather update or ask to change frequency to contact FSS for a weather update? I am not exactly sure how they work, will they give me the current situation or just read me the metar?

As was mentioned flight watch to get an update, but lets face it the best and most acurate weather report you will ever get is what you see out side your window! I think you did good! A lot of training is learning to make decisions, and making the right ones. You got your weather, made a go decsion, when the weather turned bad, you turned around...VERY GOOD!

[charlie1017]

Originally Posted by Matt13C

I was on my long cross country today and I had some unexpected weather. I got a detailed briefing from DUAT and also looked over the maps on Aviationweather.noaa.gov before I departed and all signs pointed to a go. Winds calm, scattered at 8000 for the whole area and nothing pointed to weather moving into my path.

Welcome to real world aviation!

[Matt13C]

Originally Posted by scooter2525

Haven't been on a CC in a while due to current job but....

might try flightwatch 122.0. Im sure center wouldnt have a problem with you changing freq real quick....

Is flight watch the same as contacting a FSS through a VOR? I thought I had a grasp of this stuff. Then I actually had a use for it today and could not remember if the R next to the frequency meant I call them on that frequency or if that is what I listen on. Then I started questioning how to talk to them and what to say since it would have been a remote transmission.

Reading it in a book and having it explained is one thing, putting it to use in a real world situation is totally different. I am taking today as a lesson and a clue that I need to work on my in-flight weather briefings.

[scooter2525]

Originally Posted by Matt13C

Is flight watch the same as contacting a FSS through a VOR?

Negative. You broadcast just over that frequency (and someone fill in here how it contacts the closest center...I forget ). Make sure to give them an idea of where your at. IE. Flight Watch N1234 4 miles south of LAX vor etc




Hmmm.... Faa says it better then me.... haha

http://www.faa.gov/ats/afss/newyork/EFAS.htm

[flyguy]

Originally Posted by Matt13C

I was on my long cross country today and I had some unexpected weather. I got a detailed briefing from DUAT and also looked over the maps on Aviationweather.noaa.gov before I departed and all signs pointed to a go. Winds calm, scattered at 8000 for the whole area and nothing pointed to weather moving into my path.

As I was flying the clouds started to close in on me, they were down around 4000. Certainly did not expect this. I tuned in the AWOS for the landing airport but was too far out to pick it up. I was already talking to approach control for flight following but he was kind of busy and I have heard they do not like when you ask for a weather update.

I went on a bit further and conditions continued to deteriorated, got good and turbulent, clouds got darker and they looked like they were down below my altitude up ahead so I decided to turn back and try another day.

How would you have handled the situation? Would you have asked approach for a weather update or ask to change frequency to contact FSS for a weather update? I am not exactly sure how they work, will they give me the current situation or just read me the metar?

I might have just landed somewhere close to where you were to either wait out the weather and/or call FSS for an update. No reason to waste the time and money and not even try to complete the mission (unless of course FSS gives you some bad news when you land). As long as you eventually make it to your intended destination and back you can still log the whole flight as cross county, and even make a note in your logbook about the diversion. That'll demonstrate good judgement to anyone looking through your logbook, such as an examiner or prosepective employer. On the other hand, if you are a student pilot you can't land somwhere you aren't endorsed unless you have an emergency. If that is your case, you handled the sitaution perfectly. One thing to keep in mind is, even if you call Flight Watch and they tell you its good up ahead but you look out the window and don't feel good about it, get out of there. Either way I think you made a good choice to turn back. That's always your safest option, and its always better to be conservative if you are ever unsure.

[kellwolf]

Turning around was probably a good decision. Others have already mentioned flight watch, too. Don't let the fact that ATC might not like something stop you from asking for it. If you're getting into a WX situation you're not comfortable with, ask ATC for a WX update. Doesn't matter if they like it or not, it's part of their job. Odds are the controller will be MUCH happier to hear you asking to keep tabs on the situation than just barelling through. It also gives him a heads up as to what you might be doing, be it turning around or landing somewhere close by. You might actually be surprised how helpful some controllers can be in this situation by not only giving you an update at your destination, but also giving you WX for other airports close by that might still be VFR.

[Matt13C]

Originally Posted by flyguy

I might have just landed somewhere close to where you were to either wait out the weather and/or call FSS for an update. No reason to waste the time and money and not even try to complete the mission (unless of course FSS gives you some bad news when you land). As long as you eventually make it to your intended destination and back you can still log the whole flight as cross county, and even make a note in your logbook about the diversion. That'll demonstrate good judgement to anyone looking through your logbook, such as an examiner or prosepective employer. On the other hand, if you are a student pilot you can't land somwhere you aren't endorsed unless you have an emergency. If that is your case, you handled the sitaution perfectly. One thing to keep in mind is, even if you call Flight Watch and they tell you its good up ahead but you look out the window and don't feel good about it, get out of there. Either way I think you made a good choice to turn back. That's always your safest option, and its always better to be conservative if you are ever unsure.

Yeah, I am still a student so I couldn't land, it was not an emergency, just was not comfortable with the situation.

[flyguy]

Originally Posted by Matt13C

Yeah, I am still a student so I couldn't land, it was not an emergency, just was not comfortable with the situation.

Good job then! Kudos!

[AngelFuree]

You did well, Matt. Never push yourself into a situation you are uncomfortable with.

Regarding your question...when trying to contact FSS through certain VORs, you'll notice the "R" next to the frequency. That means the FSS receives on that frequency, i.e. you transmit on it. I know it sounds backwards, but it's very logical...the "R" frequency is normally the VOR frequency itself. You listen to it just as you do AWOS.

Also, with regards to your decision, you made the right choice, congrats!

Also, remember that flying without visual reference to the ground is not permitted for student pilots:

Sec. 61.89

General limitations.

(a) A student pilot may not act as pilot in command of an aircraft:
(1) That is carrying a passenger;
(2) That is carrying property for compensation or hire;
(3) For compensation or hire;
(4) In furtherance of a business;
(5) On an international flight, except that a student pilot may make solo training flights from Haines, Gustavus, or Juneau, Alaska, to White Horse, Yukon, Canada, and return over the province of British Columbia;
(6) With a flight or surface visibility of less than 3 statute miles during daylight hours or 5 statute miles at night;
(7) When the flight cannot be made with visual reference to the surface; or
(8) In a manner contrary to any limitations placed in the pilot's logbook by an authorized instructor.

[Goldmember]

2 things..Flight watch is a great tool. Make sure the next time you're up with your instructor, have them dial up flight watch for you and see how it works.

Also, weather is an ever-changing continual event. Even en route, Flight Watch may not have the weather you are experiencing like if you are in an area where there aren't a whole lot of weather reporting stations. Sure they can see thunderstorms etc.. but may not see the 5 mile band of low overcast at 1200 on your route because all the stations around you off course are reporting 3500.

[flyguy]

Unexpected weather is a good reason to give a PIREP also. Obviously, your first priority is going to be to fly the airplane and get yourself on the ground safely, but if possible call up flight watch and let them know the conditions you are experiencing. It will be very helpfull to other pilots who will be flying in the area.

[Matt13C]

Originally Posted by Goldmember

2 things..Flight watch is a great tool. Make sure the next time you're up with your instructor, have them dial up flight watch for you and see how it works.

Also, weather is an ever-changing continual event. Even en route, Flight Watch may not have the weather you are experiencing like if you are in an area where there aren't a whole lot of weather reporting stations. Sure they can see thunderstorms etc.. but may not see the 5 mile band of low overcast at 1200 on your route because all the stations around you off course are reporting 3500.

As I understand it flight watch is for above 5K feet. If I call and do not report a current altitude will they just give me the weather anyway? Does it include anything happening below 5K or is that handled by FSS?

One question, when calling FSS through a remote station how does the transmission go? "Millville radio, cessna 1234 Wiskey, transmitting one two three point four, receiving remote through east texas one one eight point two, three miles west of hodash VOR at three thousand five hundred, landing WWD, looking for enroute weather"?

Is that about right, did I miss anything, add to much? How am I sure they are even listening to me, should I get their attention first just like when calling tower or approach? Is calling Flight Watch the same and is it ever routed through a remote terminal or is it always on 122.0 and they can just tell where my transmission is being routed from?

Sorry for the questions, I am trying to learn as much as I can before I go over it again with my instructor tomorrow.

Thanks!

[flyguy]

You can try flight watch at lower altitudes, you just might not be too low to get a good signal. If you can't hail anyone on 122.0 try the local FSS. As for the callup, that sounds perfect except on initial callup just give them your callsign and what you are transmitting and recieving on. When they say "callsign go ahead" then rattle off all the rest of it. The reason is they don't usually have someone sitting right there by the radio like ATC does, so when they get a call someone will usually have to put down their donut, put away the crossword puzzle, walk across the room to the radio and answer your call. You don't want to bombard them with too much information until they are there and ready to copy. Same goes for flight watch. In fact, I could be wrong, but my understanding is 122.0 simply transimts to the nearest FSS. If you call them "Flight Watch" on initial callup, all that means to them is you are transmitting and recieving on 122.0.

[AngelFuree]

From my limited experience flying, around here you don't have to specify your location to the FSS. Usually, FSS is just for getting some sort of updated briefing or opening up flight plans. I've never been asked my location. All I say is, "Good afternoon Princeton Radio, callsign, transmitting on 123.6, listening 116.2"

They'll come back and say, "callsign, Princeton Radio, go ahead." At that point, you can just give them your request.

I've only dealt with Grand Forks FSS and Princeton FSS, and well....Rancho Murieta FSS, once. They're all pretty much the same. You'll notice there really isn't any "standard", per se, for the FSS. For the most part, they're helpful and relaxed.