"USAPA versus ALPA" Thoughts.

[Doug Taylor]

Just got off a jet, took a peek at the ALPA national forum and it about gave me a rash watching the "Easties" versus "Westies" go at it.

That type of activity isn't going to be tolerated on Jetcareers, so consider that a fair warning.

It's an emotional event on many fronts, but when you lose your cool like that, the "other side" wins because it makes you look like a dork and your opponents use it as an example of your unreasonableness.

Even if you're not being unreasonable. Even if you have a point.

Ok, back to the books for me.

[KLB]

Doug,

I know that needed to be said!

It reminds me of when mom used to say, "We're going in this store, you will behave, and you better not touch nothin'!"

.....or when my aunts used to tell my cousin before going into church, "You better sit still and you better not go to sleep. I'll be watchin' you from the choir stand."

Gotta love those "pre-emptive motivational" speeches!

[kellwolf]

Oooh. I've only got a half day tomorrow in upgrade training. I might have to jet over to the ALPA forums to watch the fireworks.

[Polar742]

...also...

If you're new to industry, and by that I meant the following:

-You have not served under the entire term of a contract under the RLA
-You have not endured Section 6 negotiations under the RLA
-Have not had a group-wide grievance arbitrated under the RLA


I would step back. Listen. Try not too get too involved (unless you're at LCC), measure both sides of the debate, and figure out your position. Sooner or later these issues will affect you in your career. Use this as an opportunity to learn about the process, what a union provides and does not provide.

Between the mergers, the recency of bankruptcy, and now, the dis-enfranchisement of ALPA, this is going to be a very defining time. If you're wrapped up in a fight that your dog's not in, you might miss alot.

Best of luck to all of us. We need it.

[UPSpilot]

All I'm going to say is that I'm VERY glad NOT to be ALPA. I have NOT spoken to a SINGLE UPS pilot that was with a previous ALPA carrier that wishes that ALPA was at UPS.

[kellwolf]

Originally Posted by UPSpilot

All I'm going to say is that I'm VERY glad NOT to be ALPA. I have NOT spoken to a SINGLE UPS pilot that was with a previous ALPA carrier that wishes that ALPA was at UPS.

I guess it's different for me. I have no problems with ALPA, and they've been nothing but great here at PCL. Things have gotten better, actually, since when I started here. To me, that just shows what a change in local leadership will do. We went from "eh, we might get something done" to "look, this is how it's gonna be. Don't like it, we'll sue ya in federal court."

[BobDDuck]

Originally Posted by kellwolf

I guess it's different for me. I have no problems with ALPA, and they've been nothing but great here at PCL. Things have gotten better, actually, since when I started here. To me, that just shows what a change in local leadership will do. We went from "eh, we might get something done" to "look, this is how it's gonna be. Don't like it, we'll sue ya in federal court."

That may be in part because you (9E) hasn't gone through a downturn/furlough/concession since you've been there. Yes, you are a whole bunch of years into section 6, but it hasn't really gotten ugly.

Most of the anger at ALPA (deserved or not) stems from when the going gets rough.

[PCL_128]

Originally Posted by BobDDuck

That may be in part because you (9E) hasn't gone through a downturn/furlough/concession since you've been there. Yes, you are a whole bunch of years into section 6, but it hasn't really gotten ugly.

Most of the anger at ALPA (deserved or not) stems from when the going gets rough.

In other words, pilots blame ALPA for things outside of its control. ALPA is an easy scapegoat for the uninformed and uneducated.

[crashmbern]

Not sure if its true or not but he said that if US Airways voted ALPA out that the majority of ALPA pilots would be regional pilots.

[Moose17]

I've had no problem with ALPA at Alaska Airlines. Good insurance rates, great medical help and negotiations are going on. The company has F & H on the payroll so I am glad we have ALPA.

[PCL_128]

Originally Posted by crashmbern

Not sure if its true or not but he said that if US Airways voted ALPA out that the majority of ALPA pilots would be regional pilots.

It won't be regional pilots, but it will be what we call "B-carriers." In other words, pilots that don't work for the big legacy carriers and FedEx. Pilots at the Canadian carriers, the charter operators, and the smaller cargo carriers are also included, so it's not really a majority of regional guys, but the majority being from legacy airlines is no longer the case I believe.

[stuckingfk]

With ALPA recently being voted out at US Air, how much money per year in fees are they going to lose?

[PCL_128]

Over the past few years, ALPA has likely spent far more money on AAA than they received in dues.

[surreal1221]

They'll be back. . .if they are still around.

[Velocipede]

Over/under = 3 years.