You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!!

NEWBY101 · February 27th, 2008, 20:11

Why is it 9 out of 10 people or schools I talk to tell me I'm not going to make money as a pilot? I understand you start at the bottom when you get out of school, you need to build hours, experience, ratings and I'm sure much more I don't know about, but damn, I'm not looking to make it rich, I just want to pay my mortgage, start paying back my student loans and maybe take a trip somewhere every once in a while. I have talked to at least four schools in the Tucson area that have told me I will not make more than 18-20k a year for 5-10 years after I get out of flight school with a CFII! I can handle that for a couple, maybe even a few years, but is this true? Will I starve my family if I decide to be a pilot?
I have only spoken to one school that has said,"Sure, you will graduate in 16 months and be ready to start applying to regional airlines. You won't make a lot of money to start, but give it a few years and you will start to work your way up the pay scale". Granted I understand I might not get hired for the spot, but can't I get work somewhere so I can pay my mortgage and still eat until I do get called into an interview? I could sustain my simple little life on 30k a year for a long time. I just need the hope that I won't make that for the rest of my simple life!

Very frustrated right now!!!!

youngflyer · February 27th, 2008, 20:24

You might start at 18-20 but you will move up quick. Maybe pulling 70k in four years as a regional CAPTAIN.

Stomp16 · February 27th, 2008, 20:24

People can make money flying. It just isn't that much compared to pre 9/11. By comparison, pre 9/11 wages were a heck of a lot better than they are today. But , 9/11 happened followed by bankruptcies and people were willing to PAY to keep their job. This pay to fly thing really caught on. And let's face it, as a business manager/owner/whatever, wouldn't you love for people to pay to work for you? That's what's happening right now and this topic has been discussed to death. The reality of the situation is that airlines and working for airlines is very volatile and nobody knows what tomorrow will bring. If your taking up flying to make A LOT of money and that's your only goal behind it, you will probably be disappointed along the way. Do it because you want to do it and love it. If you have the right attitude, the right job will find you. I see it happen to people all the time. Make good impressions with EVERYONE you meet and somewhere along the way you will get that job and make decent money at it. Good luck with your future endeavors and don't listen to much to the all the negative. It will only make you hate this profession.

PGT · February 27th, 2008, 20:34

..

kids are expensive
marriages are expensive
divorce lawyers are expensive
child support is expensive

repeat above in that order

then you have:
alcohol
strip clubs
cigarettes

AV8TOR · February 27th, 2008, 20:49

I asked the same question before taking the big dive into flying, and now here I am scraping by,.... i got a family, mort and kids.

We cut back on a lot of the flashy items and not eating out so much, the wife has got a job and it helps.

I've been here at the regionals for about a year and i'm looking forward to second year pay, that's about a $7 jump an hour, I try to pick up OT when no one will be at the house, try to pick up something in the morning and try to be off by 5 or 6, to still see the family, that's where it helps money wise.

all the captains that I fly with, say after their 5th or 6th year, a majority of their wives don't work because they are making good pay.... not Great but good enough for them to support their family

I also decided to get my masters, and I'm using the GI Bill, that's also about $1100 that is helping out quite a bit

hope that helps

NEWBY101 · February 27th, 2008, 20:59

This is all very good to hear! Thank you again.

NEWBY101 · February 27th, 2008, 21:06

Thats all I needed to hear. I just think its in my best intrest to make sure I'm not going to end up homeless just because I love flying. Its great to do things you love for a living, but its also nice to eat. You gave me great advice and I really respect your opinions! I sure I will have a whole bunch more for everyone. Thanks again

PCL_128 · February 27th, 2008, 21:09

Here's how it went for me after finishing my ratings and starting the career:

Year 1 - $13k
Year 2 - $18k
Year 3 - $24k
Year 4 - $28k
Year 5 - $50k
Year 6 - $65k
Year 7 - $55k (took a paycut mid year when I left the regionals for AirTran)
Year 8 - $60k (projection for this year)

That's it so far. The first few years sucked, but it got much better after the Captain upgrade. Still not "good" pay, but livable. With any luck, I'll upgrade here in the next few years and finally be making some pretty decent money. You can definitely make it work. Just try not to get too deep into debt while working as a regional FO the first few years.

NEWBY101 · February 27th, 2008, 22:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by PCL_128

Here's how it went for me after finishing my ratings and starting the career:

Year 1 - $13k
Year 2 - $18k
Year 3 - $24k
Year 4 - $28k
Year 5 - $50k
Year 6 - $65k
Year 7 - $55k (took a paycut mid year when I left the regionals for AirTran)
Year 8 - $60k (projection for this year)

That's it so far. The first few years sucked, but it got much better after the Captain upgrade. Still not "good" pay, but livable. With any luck, I'll upgrade here in the next few years and finally be making some pretty decent money. You can definitely make it work. Just try not to get too deep into debt while working as a regional FO the first few years.

That will work for me!!! Thank you.

DenverPilot8 · February 27th, 2008, 22:29

Yet EVERY year when the top 20 highest paid jobs list comes out the "Airline Pilot" is ALWAYS in there. This year it was in between surgeon and Marketing Executive. There is definately a perception out there that ALL ariline pilots are making bank. The truth is only the old captains and the FED Ex/UPS guys are really scewing the scale.

Kristie · February 27th, 2008, 22:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by PGT

..

kids are expensive
marriages are expensive
divorce lawyers are expensive
child support is expensive

repeat above in that order

then you have:
alcohol
strip clubs
cigarettes

was that really necessary??

PGA07 · February 27th, 2008, 22:36

There are other segments within aviation in which you could make money as a pilot as well. There are far more individuals on these boards who can elaborate, but I will share in a broad scope what I know.

Early on, once you become a CFI/II, you can make some decent ($30,000+) money if you teach a the right school. If you do end up at a good flight school, making some decent or livable wages, it may behove (SP) you to stay there and build time. You may end up making more than you would at a regional during the first few years. Then when you have competitive times, either fly frieght, charter, or if you are lucky corporate Part 91. This is all of course, if you do not want to fly Part 121.

Otherwise you may look into becoming a sim. instructor at a place such as Simuflite (SP) or Flight Safety.

All in all, the pay will be poor early one, but it will get better. When compared to most every day jobs, you will be much happier in your aviation career. Also, don't kid yourself about that $100,000/yr. mark! It is a misconseption that everyone in the business world is making that. Fact is, most do not, nor will they. If you can make $75,000 at any career and be happy doing it, what more could you ask for.

Don't be to frusterated, work hard and you will realize your dreams. Good Luck!

PCL_128 · February 27th, 2008, 22:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by DenverPilot8

The truth is only the old captains and the FED Ex/UPS guys are really scewing the scale.

Not really. The truth is, even after all of the paycuts, pretty much every Captain at all the majors and legacies is making over $150k. The FedEx and UPS guys are making much, much more (over $300k in most circumstances), but the wages of most major airline Captains exceeds the figures you see in the salary surveys they post every year. Hell, ASA has ATR Captains making over six figures. The salary surveys aren't lying. It just seems like it when you're a first year FO at a regional.

Toonces · February 28th, 2008, 00:08

Am I the only one that is pissed off by "Newbies'" first post? I am tired of people coming to this profession with such low expectations. People wonder why airlines aren't handing out fists full of cash. Answer: because too many chumps come crawling out of the woodwork who only wish to make enough to pay the rent on their mobile home and have enough left over to buy a six pack. Do all the real professional aviators a favor and take that "I don't need to make money" attitude to walmart.

We need to expect more if we are to get more.

PCL_128 · February 28th, 2008, 00:17

Eh, he'll learn. I was the same way when I was a noob, but now I'm about as militant as they come.

If he sticks around here, he'll get a good education.

PGT · February 28th, 2008, 00:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kristie

was that really necessary??

yes it was

Toonces · February 28th, 2008, 00:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by PCL_128

Eh, he'll learn. I was the same way when I was a noob, but now I'm about as militant as they come.

If he sticks around here, he'll get a good education.

Let's hope so. I am guessing this guy is a 18 year old virgin who lives with his parents. Someday he may grow up and want to take a real girl someplace other than Mcdonalds. Pretty hard to do that when you make less than a high school janitor.

ChadW346 · February 28th, 2008, 01:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toonces

Let's hope so. I am guessing this guy is a 18 year old virgin who lives with his parents. Someday he may grow up and want to take a real girl someplace other than Mcdonalds. Pretty hard to do that when you make less than a high school janitor.

He said in another thread that he's 31.

My understanding is not that he's coming in with lowered expectations. He's just new and wants to understand the reality of working up the ladder in this profession. I would say this is a great place to come and figure that out before deciding to pursue it.

PCL_128 · February 28th, 2008, 01:06

Ouch! Kinda harsh.

Doug Taylor · February 28th, 2008, 01:12

I wrote an entire website about it!

X-Forces · February 28th, 2008, 01:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toonces

Let's hope so. I am guessing this guy is a 18 year old virgin who lives with his parents. Someday he may grow up and want to take a real girl someplace other than Mcdonalds. Pretty hard to do that when you make less than a high school janitor.

Dude, Chill.

bike21 · February 28th, 2008, 01:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by PCL_128

Just try not to get too deep into debt while working as a regional FO the first few years.

There it is folks. The magic answer. Stay away from accruing debt before, during and after training. Don't buy the hype from the big academy recruiters that you will be making 100k within a couple of years. Trust me, paying $800 bucks a month on student loans isn't fun!

SIUav8er · February 28th, 2008, 02:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by PGT

..

kids are expensive
marriages are expensive
divorce lawyers are expensive
child support is expensive

repeat above in that order

then you have:
alcohol
strip clubs
cigarettes

and that ladies and gentlemen is the TRUTH! lol, in a funny sort of way.

SIUav8er · February 28th, 2008, 02:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toonces

Am I the only one that is pissed off by "Newbies'" first post? I am tired of people coming to this profession with such low expectations. People wonder why airlines aren't handing out fists full of cash. Answer: because too many chumps come crawling out of the woodwork who only wish to make enough to pay the rent on their mobile home and have enough left over to buy a six pack. Do all the real professional aviators a favor and take that "I don't need to make money" attitude to walmart.

We need to expect more if we are to get more.

man, that was a little harsh! the guys in the right place. im sure if he sticks around here, he'll learn! (I sure did!) but just the opposite will happen if everyone makes these types of comments to a new member of the forum. IMO jetcareers is really geared toward newer pilots getting started, or consdiering a career in aviation. Its great that there is so much experience in the membership here, but if you really look at the big picture, a huge part of JC is about helping the new guys.

BajtheJino · February 28th, 2008, 02:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toonces

Am I the only one that is pissed off by "Newbies'" first post? I am tired of people coming to this profession with such low expectations. People wonder why airlines aren't handing out fists full of cash. Answer: because too many chumps come crawling out of the woodwork who only wish to make enough to pay the rent on their mobile home and have enough left over to buy a six pack. Do all the real professional aviators a favor and take that "I don't need to make money" attitude to walmart.

We need to expect more if we are to get more.

Come on, man. Low expectations keeps me in the ladies!

The reasons the airlines aren't handing out fist of cash-F.O.s mommy and daddys already bought them their IPOD and had their tips frosted for them. After that everything else is petty cash for light beers and lime wedges (pre-sliced no less).

That being said, my first freight gig paid $30+ the first year and I've been gaining by leaps and bounds since. This year I'll pull in close to $50+. THERE IS MORE TO AVIATION THAN REGIONALS.

February 27th, 2008, 20:11	#1
NEWBY101 Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: TUCSON Posts: 54	You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! Why is it 9 out of 10 people or schools I talk to tell me I'm not going to make money as a pilot? I understand you start at the bottom when you get out of school, you need to build hours, experience, ratings and I'm sure much more I don't know about, but damn, I'm not looking to make it rich, I just want to pay my mortgage, start paying back my student loans and maybe take a trip somewhere every once in a while. I have talked to at least four schools in the Tucson area that have told me I will not make more than 18-20k a year for 5-10 years after I get out of flight school with a CFII! I can handle that for a couple, maybe even a few years, but is this true? Will I starve my family if I decide to be a pilot? I have only spoken to one school that has said,"Sure, you will graduate in 16 months and be ready to start applying to regional airlines. You won't make a lot of money to start, but give it a few years and you will start to work your way up the pay scale". Granted I understand I might not get hired for the spot, but can't I get work somewhere so I can pay my mortgage and still eat until I do get called into an interview? I could sustain my simple little life on 30k a year for a long time. I just need the hope that I won't make that for the rest of my simple life! Very frustrated right now!!!! __________________ Stupid is dangerous

February 27th, 2008, 20:24	#2
youngflyer Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: KSYR Posts: 416	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! You might start at 18-20 but you will move up quick. Maybe pulling 70k in four years as a regional CAPTAIN.

February 27th, 2008, 20:24	#3
Stomp16 Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Tulsa, OK via Scottsbluff, NE Posts: 150	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! People can make money flying. It just isn't that much compared to pre 9/11. By comparison, pre 9/11 wages were a heck of a lot better than they are today. But , 9/11 happened followed by bankruptcies and people were willing to PAY to keep their job. This pay to fly thing really caught on. And let's face it, as a business manager/owner/whatever, wouldn't you love for people to pay to work for you? That's what's happening right now and this topic has been discussed to death. The reality of the situation is that airlines and working for airlines is very volatile and nobody knows what tomorrow will bring. If your taking up flying to make A LOT of money and that's your only goal behind it, you will probably be disappointed along the way. Do it because you want to do it and love it. If you have the right attitude, the right job will find you. I see it happen to people all the time. Make good impressions with EVERYONE you meet and somewhere along the way you will get that job and make decent money at it. Good luck with your future endeavors and don't listen to much to the all the negative. It will only make you hate this profession. __________________ For the rich, there's therapy. For the rest of us, there's flying. CP-ASEL/AMEL-IA CFI/CFII, AGI/IGI

February 27th, 2008, 20:34	#4
PGT Old Skool Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: DSM Posts: 2,950	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! .. kids are expensive marriages are expensive divorce lawyers are expensive child support is expensive repeat above in that order then you have: alcohol strip clubs cigarettes __________________ PPL 55 hours TT

February 27th, 2008, 20:49	#5
AV8TOR Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 140	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! I asked the same question before taking the big dive into flying, and now here I am scraping by,.... i got a family, mort and kids. We cut back on a lot of the flashy items and not eating out so much, the wife has got a job and it helps. I've been here at the regionals for about a year and i'm looking forward to second year pay, that's about a $7 jump an hour, I try to pick up OT when no one will be at the house, try to pick up something in the morning and try to be off by 5 or 6, to still see the family, that's where it helps money wise. all the captains that I fly with, say after their 5th or 6th year, a majority of their wives don't work because they are making good pay.... not Great but good enough for them to support their family I also decided to get my masters, and I'm using the GI Bill, that's also about $1100 that is helping out quite a bit hope that helps

February 27th, 2008, 20:59	#6
NEWBY101 Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: TUCSON Posts: 54	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! This is all very good to hear! Thank you again. __________________ Stupid is dangerous

February 27th, 2008, 21:06	#7
NEWBY101 Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: TUCSON Posts: 54	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! Thats all I needed to hear. I just think its in my best intrest to make sure I'm not going to end up homeless just because I love flying. Its great to do things you love for a living, but its also nice to eat. You gave me great advice and I really respect your opinions! I sure I will have a whole bunch more for everyone. Thanks again __________________ Stupid is dangerous

February 27th, 2008, 21:09	#8
PCL_128 Old Skool Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: ATL Posts: 3,223	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! Here's how it went for me after finishing my ratings and starting the career: Year 1 - $13k Year 2 - $18k Year 3 - $24k Year 4 - $28k Year 5 - $50k Year 6 - $65k Year 7 - $55k (took a paycut mid year when I left the regionals for AirTran) Year 8 - $60k (projection for this year) That's it so far. The first few years sucked, but it got much better after the Captain upgrade. Still not "good" pay, but livable. With any luck, I'll upgrade here in the next few years and finally be making some pretty decent money. You can definitely make it work. Just try not to get too deep into debt while working as a regional FO the first few years. __________________ Not one nickel, not one job. No concessions!

February 27th, 2008, 22:29	#10
DenverPilot8 Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 152	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! Yet EVERY year when the top 20 highest paid jobs list comes out the "Airline Pilot" is ALWAYS in there. This year it was in between surgeon and Marketing Executive. There is definately a perception out there that ALL ariline pilots are making bank. The truth is only the old captains and the FED Ex/UPS guys are really scewing the scale.

February 27th, 2008, 22:36	#12
PGA07 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Western Chi-Town Burb's Posts: 596	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! There are other segments within aviation in which you could make money as a pilot as well. There are far more individuals on these boards who can elaborate, but I will share in a broad scope what I know. Early on, once you become a CFI/II, you can make some decent ($30,000+) money if you teach a the right school. If you do end up at a good flight school, making some decent or livable wages, it may behove (SP) you to stay there and build time. You may end up making more than you would at a regional during the first few years. Then when you have competitive times, either fly frieght, charter, or if you are lucky corporate Part 91. This is all of course, if you do not want to fly Part 121. Otherwise you may look into becoming a sim. instructor at a place such as Simuflite (SP) or Flight Safety. All in all, the pay will be poor early one, but it will get better. When compared to most every day jobs, you will be much happier in your aviation career. Also, don't kid yourself about that $100,000/yr. mark! It is a misconseption that everyone in the business world is making that. Fact is, most do not, nor will they. If you can make $75,000 at any career and be happy doing it, what more could you ask for. Don't be to frusterated, work hard and you will realize your dreams. Good Luck! __________________ Gone Fishin'.....................Once The Lakes Thaw! "Shoot for the moon, even if you miss, you'll land among the stars!"

February 28th, 2008, 00:08	#14
Toonces Junior Member Join Date: May 2005 Location: Are you stalking me? Posts: 228	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! Am I the only one that is pissed off by "Newbies'" first post? I am tired of people coming to this profession with such low expectations. People wonder why airlines aren't handing out fists full of cash. Answer: because too many chumps come crawling out of the woodwork who only wish to make enough to pay the rent on their mobile home and have enough left over to buy a six pack. Do all the real professional aviators a favor and take that "I don't need to make money" attitude to walmart. We need to expect more if we are to get more.

February 28th, 2008, 00:17	#15
PCL_128 Old Skool Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: ATL Posts: 3,223	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! Eh, he'll learn. I was the same way when I was a noob, but now I'm about as militant as they come. If he sticks around here, he'll get a good education. __________________ Not one nickel, not one job. No concessions!

February 28th, 2008, 01:06	#19
PCL_128 Old Skool Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: ATL Posts: 3,223	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! Ouch! Kinda harsh. __________________ Not one nickel, not one job. No concessions!

February 28th, 2008, 01:12	#20
Doug Taylor Agent Smith Join Date: Dec 1969 Location: KSDL Posts: 39,824 Blog Entries: 1	Re: You Can't Make Money Being A Pilot!!! I wrote an entire website about it! __________________ Doug Taylor http://76school.flyblog.com (old!) http://30west.flyblog.com (updated 11/28)

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