Part 135 Mins Question

[GADD45B]

Excerpt from part 135 PIC Qualifications --

(2) Has had at least 1,200 hours of flight time as a pilot, including 500 hours of cross country flight time, 100 hours of night flight time, and 75 hours of actual or simulated instrument time at least 50 hours of which were in actual flight; and

Questions:
1. Cross country time for this requirement would follow the definition of part 61.1 paragraph 3.i. (see excerpt below). So, any time acquired in which a landing is made at an airport other than departure (even at an airport 10nm away) would count toward cross country time. . Is this correct?

2. The 50hrs of instrument time "50hr of which were in actual flight". I read this as hood time in the airplane as counting toward this 50 and not necessarily flying in IMC. Is this correct?


From part 61.1 Applicability and Definitions
(3) Cross-country time means--

[(i) Except as provided in paragraphs (b)(3)(ii) through (b)(3)(vi) of this section, time acquired during a flight--]
(A) Conducted by a person who holds a pilot certificate;
(B) Conducted in an aircraft;
(C) That includes a landing at a point other than the point of departure; and
(D) That involves the use of dead reckoning, pilotage, electronic navigation aids, radio aids, or other navigation systems to navigate to the landing point.

[(ii) For the purpose of meeting the aeronautical experience requirements (except for a rotorcraft category rating), for a private pilot certificate (except for a powered parachute category rating), a commercial pilot certificate, or an instrument rating, or for the purpose of exercising recreational pilot privileges (except in a rotorcraft) under Sec. 61.101(c), time acquired during a flight--]
(A) Conducted in an appropriate aircraft;
(B) That includes a point of landing that was at least a straight-line distance of more than 50 nautical miles from the original point of departure; and
(C) That involves the use of dead reckoning, pilotage, electronic navigation aids, radio aids, or other navigation systems to navigate to the landing point.

[(iii) For the purpose of meeting the aeronautical experience requirements for a sport pilot certificate (except for powered parachute privileges), time acquired during a flight conducted in an appropriate aircraft that-
(A) Includes a point of landing at least a straight line distance of more than 25 nautical miles from the original point of departure; and
(B) Involves, as applicable, the use of dead reckoning; pilotage; electronic navigation aids; radio aids; or other navigation systems to navigate to the landing point.

(iv) For the purpose of meeting the aeronautical experience requirements for a sport pilot certificate with powered parachute privileges or a private pilot certificate with a powered parachute category rating, time acquired during a flight conducted in an appropriate aircraft that -
(A) Includes a point of landing at least a straight line distance of more than 15 nautical miles from the original point of departure; and
(B) Involves, as applicable, the use of dead reckoning; pilotage; electronic navigation aids; radio aids; or other navigation systems to navigate to the landing point. ]

(v) For the purpose of meeting the aeronautical experience requirements for any pilot certificate with a rotorcraft category rating or an instrument-helicopter rating, or for the purpose of exercising recreational pilot privileges, in a rotorcraft, under Sec. 61.101(c), time acquired during a flight--
(A) Conducted in an appropriate aircraft;
(B) That includes a point of landing that was at least a straight-line distance of more than 25 nautical miles from the original point of departure; and
(C) That involves the use of dead reckoning, pilotage, electronic navigation aids, radio aids, or other navigation systems to navigate to the landing point.

(vi) For the purpose of meeting the aeronautical experience requirements for an airline transport pilot certificate (except with a rotorcraft category rating), time acquired during a flight--
(A) Conducted in an appropriate aircraft;
(B) That is at least a straight-line distance of more than 50 nautical miles from the original point of departure; and
(C) That involves the use of dead reckoning, pilotage, electronic navigation aids, radio aids, or other navigation systems.

(vii) For a military pilot who qualifies for a commercial pilot certificate (except with a rotorcraft category rating) under Sec. 61.73 of this part, time acquired during a flight--
(A) Conducted in an appropriate aircraft;
(B) That is at least a straight-line distance of more than 50 nautical miles from the original point of departure; and
(C) That involves the use of dead reckoning, pilotage, electronic navigation aids, radio aids, or other navigation systems.

[Ian J]

Originally Posted by GADD45B

Excerpt from part 135 PIC Qualifications --

(2) Has had at least 1,200 hours of flight time as a pilot, including 500 hours of cross country flight time, 100 hours of night flight time, and 75 hours of actual or simulated instrument time at least 50 hours of which were in actual flight; and

Questions:
1. Cross country time for this requirement would follow the definition of part 61.1 paragraph 3.i. (see excerpt below). So, any time acquired in which a landing is made at an airport other than departure (even at an airport 10nm away) would count toward cross country time. . Is this correct?

2. The 50hrs of instrument time "50hr of which were in actual flight". I read this as hood time in the airplane as counting toward this 50 and not necessarily flying in IMC. Is this correct?

Yes to both.

[HMS CALPE]

How much PIC as safety pilot can you use to meet the minimums?

[mikecweb]

Originally Posted by HMS CALPE

How much PIC as safety pilot can you use to meet the minimums?

As little as possible....but that probably wasn't the answer you were looking for.

[HMS CALPE]

Originally Posted by mikecweb

As little as possible....but that probably wasn't the answer you were looking for.

Thanks Mike.
That is what I thought, but I threw that out there so that a credible source, you, could let the guys thinking of, or that are in, the "academies" know that half of the x/c twin time they get there is safety pilot time. This usually applies to time building programs too. There is only one school I know of that sends a CFI up with you to act as the safety pilot on time building programs so you can log all of the time as true PIC. That info might help when considering the cost and value of advertised total times you might graduate with at an academy or gain in a time building scheme.

[PatrickCPS]

Originally Posted by HMS CALPE

Thanks Mike.
That is what I thought, but I threw that out there so that a credible source, you, could let the guys thinking of, or that are in, the "academies" know that half of the x/c twin time they get there is safety pilot time. This usually applies to time building programs too. There is only one school I know of that sends a CFI up with you to act as the safety pilot on time building programs so you can log all of the time as true PIC. That info might help when considering the cost and value of advertised total times you might graduate with at an academy or gain in a time building scheme.

I'm assuming you are referring to us, i.e. Career Pilot School. I think we are the only "academy" type program where ALL of a student's time is true, flown the left seat, PIC. We have a chart on our website that compares the cost of flight training with us vs other academy programs, both from an advertised program cost vs hours logged, but also time logged from the LEFT seat as true PIC. I think for those that are comparing flight training costs, this is really a wake up call.

To me the question comes down to this: when you go apply for a job, and I don't care where it is- regional, freight, charter- do you want to show them legitimate flight time, either time you paid to fly, or were paid to fly whether as a ferry pilot, CFI, etc whatever or do you want to show them line after line back and forth of "safety pilot for John Doe?"

[HMS CALPE]

Originally Posted by PatrickCPS

or do you want to show them line after line back and forth of "safety pilot for John Doe?"

Originally Posted by PatrickCPS

I'm assuming you are referring to us, i.e. Career Pilot School.

Yes Patrick I was. It amazes me how many students, or prospective students, don't realize this. By the way, your programs really stand out from the other schools. Some real cutting edge ideas have gone into your programs. Not only that, you are in K.C. Bar-B-Que territory. Mmmm the best Bar-B-Que I've ever had has been in K.C.. QOL is great in that area as well.

[PatrickCPS]

Originally Posted by HMS CALPE

Yes Patrick I was. It amazes me how many students, or prospective students, don't realize this. By the way, your programs really stand out from the other schools. Some real cutting edge ideas have gone into your programs. Not only that, you are in K.C. Bar-B-Que territory. Mmmm the best Bar-B-Que I've ever had has been in K.C.. QOL is great in that area as well.

If you're ever in KC, drop us a line and we'll get BBQ!