Careful if you are flying out of New York State Airports

[Seggy]

http://www.wnbc.com/news/14956823/de...ss=ny&psp=news

Basically, we as flight crews are breaking the law if we keep passengers on airplanes for more than three hours. Not sure if any company has disseminated information concerning this, mine has not, but I want to get the word out there.

[JEP]

Originally Posted by Seggy

http://www.wnbc.com/news/14956823/de...ss=ny&psp=news

Basically, we as flight crews are breaking the law if we keep passengers on airplanes for more than three hours. Not sure if any company has disseminated information concerning this, mine has not, but I want to get the word out there.

I don't think it is the crews they are getting at. Looking at the article:

Starting Tuesday, the state's 'airline passenger bill of rights' requires airlines to provide food, water, clean toilets and fresh air to passengers stuck on the ground for more than three hours.

The new rules come after a series of delays last winter John F. Kennedy International Airport left some passengers stranded on the tarmac for more than 10 hours with no food or water, overflowing toilets and no air conditioning.

I don't think it is too much to ask for the things in the article. At best, maybe it will force better planning on the airlines. I cannot see any reason for being locked up on the plane for that period.

[Seggy]

Jim, if an airline gets fined, they will come down hard on the poor flight crew that put them in that situation.

The mess Valentines Day was inexcusable. I hate to Armchair Quarterback, which I am about to do, but, why the heck didn't the flight crews declare an emergency?

[JEP]

Originally Posted by Seggy

Jim, if an airline gets fined, they will come down hard on the poor flight crew that put them in that situation.

The mess Valentines Day was inexcusable. I hate to Armchair Quarterback, which I am about to do, but, why the heck didn't the flight crews declare an emergency?

How are they going to come down on the crew if you are stuck on the ramp? I just don't see how it is your fault if:

gates are full
you cannot depart
you're in the box
etc.....

I would just HOPE that it makes for better planning on the management of traffic at the field. Somewhere that if this were to occur you could park, get services, etc... without having to keep people locked up in the plane for that amount of time.

I got stuck in the box once at EWR for about an hour but I knew we were in trouble after making a few right hand turns and seeing the same planes at the gates more than once. I understand the problems that exist, but as a paying customer it would drive me nuts to be on the plane for an extended amount of time. Even when we were at EWR we returned to the gate after an hour. Just a good thing the wx wasn't an issue.

[Seggy]

It is our fault, because when we sign for the aircraft we take responsibility for things that occur.

If it breaks three hours they will ask, why we didn't start making plans to go back to the gate at 2 hours 30 minutes. Well at 2 hours 30 minutes, everything was pointing to us departing within 15 minutes, but then NY Approach but a hold on departures.

I agree, being stuck on a plane sucks. But if an airline gets a fine for $74,000 they are going to look to hang the crew.

[JEP]

I understand that signing for the a/c it is now yours, but you cannot take responsibility for:

wx
ground stops
etc.......

from the planning standpoint, I would HOPE they develop some guidance/planning for these situations. If it gets to 'x' and you have not departed, then .......

I will be curious to see happens the first time this occurs. I am sure we have some winter storms left in the season....

[Doug Taylor]

JFK is pretty easy to solve.

Kick out Virgin America. No reason having a new cabotage-bending "foreign entrant" in an already overly congested airport.

Put a "minimum gauge restriction" on scheduled flights at certain times. IMHO, anything less than 100 seats operating out of JFK at peak hours is idiotic.

Give the controllers what they're asking for. They want a raise, better work rules and updated equipment.

Voila! (that's "wa lah!" for the Texans in the crowd)

[jynxyjoe]

Originally Posted by Doug Taylor

JFK is pretty easy to solve.

Kick out Virgin America. No reason having a new cabotage-bending "foreign entrant" in an already overly congested airport.

Put a "minimum gauge restriction" on scheduled flights at certain times. IMHO, anything less than 100 seats operating out of JFK at peak hours is idiotic.

Give the controllers what they're asking for. They want a raise, better work rules and updated equipment.

Voila! (that's "wa lah!" for the Texans in the crowd)

nope. voila is pronounced "go-bless-texas" in texas. the french part is silent. you can also replace it with the word "Freedom" or "frog".

i'm sure colgan will get around to giving u guidance seggy, just as soon as pinnacle finds out what other folks are doing then they'll copy it right away.

[launchpad]

Seggy is absolutely correct...the crew is the sole entity responsible for everything that happens on that plane when it's not at the gate......the first time a plane gets stuck for 3 hours and 1 second with a lawyer on board, EVERYONE's getting sued. The pilots, the flight attendant, the hotel van driver, the airline, the fuel truck driver, the CSA's, the airport, the city, the state, the country.....etc. etc. etc. etc. ....... it's gonna be a real friggen mess...the best thing to do when theres no place to put the plane, and no way to get food to it, is to open the door and let the passengers fend for themselves on a snowy, icy taxiway.......

[jynxyjoe]

Thank god i have a union.

[ComplexHiAv8r]

What would happen if you (at the 2 hour mark) say we are going back to the gate and doing that? They question you and you tell them that you had the company's interest at mind and didn't want to have them get the fine.

Also, do you have to deplane to get the clock to stop, or return ot the gate, open the door, turn off the seat belt signs? Then turn them back on and push back!

[jynxyjoe]

If ur at LGA and you and you look out the old window and see folks backed clear up and more WX comming in with high winds (only one runway in use), call up dispatch and tell them ur delaying the flight because you're gonna be sitting out there too long. then go grab one of those burrito things from the pizza place. or a pizza from the burrito place. not sure which is worth. both you'll need a stop at the bathroom.

[wheelsup]

My company put out info on this a few weeks(?) ago. If I remember correctly they said we must communicate between dispatch and ops as to what to do if we are approaching that 3 hour mark. They are treating it as a non-event since we already meet all the requirements (food, bathroom, etc.).

[daru1]

Good job for New York, long overdue. No, I don't think it's ever our fault, because it's not. Hopefully, it will make people act more quickly when more situations like last Feb occur.

[mrivc211]

You can keep me in your plane as long as you want as long as that hunk of a guy in your avatar is sitting next to me! Wink Wink!

[saxman66]

So what if you DO have plenty of food and water? Are we ok then? Or what if we're number 3 for departure and its now over 3 hours. We going to go back to the gate then?

[OldTownPilot]

Another joy of flying the 19-hunnert.

Food
Water
restroom

HA! in your wildest dreams

[Seggy]

Originally Posted by wheelsup

My company put out info on this a few weeks(?) ago. If I remember correctly they said we must communicate between dispatch and ops as to what to do if we are approaching that 3 hour mark. They are treating it as a non-event since we already meet all the requirements (food, bathroom, etc.).

Talking to a LGA Sup today, adequate food does NOT include stuff in aircraft galleys.

They are still trying to figure this law out.

[Doug Taylor]

So are airlines supposed to pack MRE's and keep them in dry storage?

[JaceTheAce]

Wonderful. So the airlines are responsible for someone else's delays?