Hired by airline with low hours? Watch out!

[t-cart]

What am i missing here. I am not a 121 guy,but i thought the x/c requirements for the Atp were 500 hrs. I am not understanding this 100 hrs. Please clarify this for me. Thanks FLY SAFE T.C.

[kellwolf]

We've got a waiver here at PCL, but you still need 250 hours PIC time. Honestly, I'd be scared of a guy upgrading with less than that, even if he did play the "hey, I'm acting PIC game." If you get your IR under Part 61, you're half way there anyway. Toss in the stuff for your Comm, and you're even closer. There's really no reason you shouldn't have this stuff before you get your CSEL/CMEL rating. Seriously. I'm talking about the ATP mins for PIC, not the 250 PIC for the waiver. I'm sure as more of our 250 hour wonders get closer to upgrade, they'll revist the waiver.....or try to re-cert them under the MPL or something if they've got it by then.

I'm not a big fan of the "acting PIC" time thing in an RJ. Personally, I think it's skirting the rules on a technicality and totally disregarding what the the FARs intend. If an FO asked me to let him be "acting PIC" on a flight I was CA of, I'd have to laugh. If that makes me "mean" or a bad person, so be it. I don't think I'm pulling the ladder up behing me, and I don't think I'm saying anything like "I did it, so you have to." I'll be damned if I agree to that, there's an emergency in flight and I have a 280 hour FO saying "But.....but....you said *I* could act as PIC!"

[surreal1221]

So what about the part 141 guys that end up getting their CSEL/CMEL at 190 hours? Or, in my case, closer to 210 hours.

Once I have a few private students, I'll be up there at the 250 PIC level, but only after that.

But anyway, what the hell do I care. . .I've got a while to go. The 100 hour XC time is only 44.2 hours shy, and the night requirement is almost there as well (6.1 needed).

[mtsu_av8er]

Originally Posted by kellwolf

I'm not a big fan of the "acting PIC" time thing in an RJ. Personally, I think it's skirting the rules on a technicality and totally disregarding what the the FARs intend. If an FO asked me to let him be "acting PIC" on a flight I was CA of, I'd have to laugh. If that makes me "mean" or a bad person, so be it. I don't think I'm pulling the ladder up behing me, and I don't think I'm saying anything like "I did it, so you have to." I'll be damned if I agree to that, there's an emergency in flight and I have a 280 hour FO saying "But.....but....you said *I* could act as PIC!"

I agree . . . it's the silliest thing I've heard in a while.

Well, that and this whole "Autopilot on at 600 feet" thing.

[skidz]

Originally Posted by bike21

The requirement people seem to be getting tripped up on is the night PIC and cross country requirement as PIC. (25 hours and 100 hours)

I think people shouldn't be even applying for the airlines with less than that. It's good to have this in mind though. I'll make sure I get that before embarrasing myself

[mikecweb]

wow

[bike21]

Originally Posted by Velocipede

Does the ATP require PIC time or just raw flight time? If its just hours, then the SIC time would suffice. We had a guy who hired on in the "olden" days with just a Commercial ticket. He ended up getting his ATP and upgrade with no problem, so I always assumed the ATP only required 1500 hours. When I got mine, it was all military time, over half of which was Aircraft Commander, so I never really paid attention to the requirements.

In these specific examples it is PIC time. It is certainly nice for those of us who never had to worry huh?

Originally Posted by kellwolf

We've got a waiver here at PCL, but you still need 250 hours PIC time. Honestly, I'd be scared of a guy upgrading with less than that, even if he did play the "hey, I'm acting PIC game." If you get your IR under Part 61, you're half way there anyway. Toss in the stuff for your Comm, and you're even closer. There's really no reason you shouldn't have this stuff before you get your CSEL/CMEL rating. Seriously. I'm talking about the ATP mins for PIC, not the 250 PIC for the waiver. I'm sure as more of our 250 hour wonders get closer to upgrade, they'll revist the waiver.....or try to re-cert them under the MPL or something if they've got it by then.

I'm not a big fan of the "acting PIC" time thing in an RJ. Personally, I think it's skirting the rules on a technicality and totally disregarding what the the FARs intend. If an FO asked me to let him be "acting PIC" on a flight I was CA of, I'd have to laugh. If that makes me "mean" or a bad person, so be it. I don't think I'm pulling the ladder up behing me, and I don't think I'm saying anything like "I did it, so you have to." I'll be damned if I agree to that, there's an emergency in flight and I have a 280 hour FO saying "But.....but....you said *I* could act as PIC!"

Well said. If an FO asked me, I would say 'ok' just to help a brother out but I would also make my disclaimer something to effect of this, "now, if anything bad does actually happen let us remember who signed the manifest and who is actually PIC, I am just trying to help your poor planning a$$ out."

Originally Posted by surreal1221

So what about the part 141 guys that end up getting their CSEL/CMEL at 190 hours? Or, in my case, closer to 210 hours.

Once I have a few private students, I'll be up there at the 250 PIC level, but only after that.

But anyway, what the hell do I care. . .I've got a while to go. The 100 hour XC time is only 44.2 hours shy, and the night requirement is almost there as well (6.1 needed).

Well, you won't have this problem since you are an esteemed member of JC and have been edumacated

Originally Posted by skidz

I think people shouldn't be even applying for the airlines with less than that. It's good to have this in mind though. I'll make sure I get that before embarrasing myself

Agree 100%. I do not condone getting 'hours' this way, just a heads up to those who have taken this path. And more so a heads up to folks NOT to take this path.

Get some real hours first folks. My advice is to sign off at least 10 students and sign off at least one in the following areas - IRA, Multi, Commercial (single and multi), CFI. Now, some might say, "but to sign to sign off a CFI that means I would have to instruct for at least 2 years!". I say, "so be it, you will thank me later."

[kellwolf]

Originally Posted by mtsu_av8er

I agree . . . it's the silliest thing I've heard in a while.

Well, that and this whole "Autopilot on at 600 feet" thing.

I'll call "AP on" at 600 ft in a few cases: when the WX is total crap, and I'm gonna have to pay attention to deviating around it, when there's a ton of traffic in the area or when I'm dog tired after a highspeed or a reduced rest overnight where I got about 5 hours of sleep.