Vaccuum System Failure

[MikeOH58]

Today I had a vaccuum system failure within the final 5 minutes of me returning from a C.C. Wasn't a big deal because I was nearly in the pattern about to land as it happened, so I didn't mention anything over the radio because it wasn't necessary IMO.

Sucks I even have to ask this question, but what is the appropriate action to take when a vacuum failure occurs say in mid flight half way through a cross country? In VFR wx it's not something to declare an emergency over right? (IFR yes). Furthermore, because the loss of Airspeed and Altimeter, does that mean one has to land as soon as practical because you would no longer be legally adhering to vfr equipment mins?

[Raskolnikov]

Originally Posted by MikeOH58

Today I had a vaccuum system failure... because the loss of Airspeed and Altimeter...

Did you have a pitot-static failure too?

[towhook]

You need some systems work bud. Go look up how your airspeed and altimeter work again.

[towhook]

Also take a look at required reports to ATC.

Depending on the range of possible situations you might be in it could be a very big deal (emergency) all the way to a non-issue (some planes don't even have a vacuum system).

[MikeOH58]

<---------- retarded

[MikeOH58]

Sorry guys, I type before I think. Pitot Static System Failure. ugh. Emberassing.

[towhook]

No biggie... they both involve air in tubes, right?

So how did your pitot static system fail? What indications were you getting? Did you try your alt static source?

I wouldn't declare an emergency. If I were in the position I assume you were in (uncontrolled field, in the pattern, 172) I would just have made it a full stop and taxied over to the mx hanger. Non event, keep it low key.

[MarkE]

What you flying? you can try the back up static system. Although not sure if that would be adequate for solid IMC.

[DE727UPS]

"In VFR wx it's not something to declare an emergency over right?"

Nope. In VFR weather I can't think of ANY instrument malfunction I'd declare an emergency over.

[MikeOH58]

Airspeed indicator was increasing speed in climbs....Furthermore, altimeter just kept winding and winding....

I guess my real question is....Suppose your on a 100nm C.C. in VFR conditions and you lose both your main and alt pitot static system. Because ALT and ASI are gone, are you required to land as soon as practical because vfr instrument requirements?

[OneNineHundy]

I had a vacuum failure in IMC shortly after I completed my instrument rating. I was about 15nm out to sea when it occured. I informed ATC that I had had the failure and they gave me vectors for the approach into the nearest suitable AD. Had to do compass turns for everything (that's why we practice them right!). It was a non event in the end, getting home was a different story I had to overnight somewhere without any money. Fun times!

[DE727UPS]

From my point of view, no. There is no MEL for my Cessna. However, part 91 gives me guidance on what's required for day VFR. It's been pounded into my head, as an airline pilot, that the MEL is a dispatch document. So, if I was in my Cessna and the airpeed was discovered inop before blockout, I'd be bound by the part 91 to not take off in an unairworthy aircraft. Once in flight, however, I have to refer to the POH and my experience as PIC. Does the POH say "Land as soon as practical if the airspeed indicator becomes inop"? I kinda doubt it. Do I, as the PIC, think it's safe to continue? I think yes, but to each his own. My CFI during my PPL, or maybe it was my CPL, I forget, but he made me land after coving up the airspeed and also made me land at night with no landing light. I've landed both my 152 and my 172 seaplane with no airspeed. It wasn't that big of a deal. So, that's my basis of knowledge to continue with no airspeed. That's not to say it would be wrong to land ASAP if you lost your airspeed in VFR. I just don't see a regulatory reason forcing you to.

[PanJet]

Originally Posted by MarkE

What you flying? you can try the back up static system. Although not sure if that would be adequate for solid IMC.

Why wouldn't it be? I've had to use the backup static system in solid IMC before. It's definitely nice to use at least to get you out of IMC so you can go VFR if the blockage continues.

[DE727UPS]

Alternate static, at least in an unpressurized Cessna, just moves a little valve which vents the static source to inside the airplane. It's no big deal.

You know what the alternate to alternate static is?

Smashing the VSI glass. That vents the static to inside the cockpit the same as the alternate static would.

I bet they don't teach that at ATP...hehe.

[OneNineHundy]

[quote=DE727UPS;609443
You know what the alternate to alternate static is?

Smashing the VSI glass. That vents the static to inside the cockpit the same as the alternate static would.

I bet they don't teach that at ATP...hehe.[/QUOTE]

Very true, I somehow don't think the boss would be too happy if you smashed the glass on the VSI during failure on a nice VMC day.

[mtsu_av8er]

Originally Posted by DE727UPS

Smashing the VSI glass. That vents the static to inside the cockpit the same as the alternate static would.

I bet they don't teach that at ATP...hehe.

They teach it at a whole lot of places . . .

[Berkut]

Originally Posted by mtsu_av8er

They teach it at a whole lot of places . . .

I'm waiting for the first report of a student doing that with a G1000.

[mikecweb]

Yeah I learned the smash the glass trick at humpty diddle. It will work in the G1000 also.

[Crockrocket94]

All in all it is good experience though.

Glad you made it back safe.

Yeah they teach the smash the vsi at ALOT of places...

[SierraPilot123]

Originally Posted by mtsu_av8er

They teach it at a whole lot of places . . .

I would like to see someone accomplish this while in the cockpit. The face of most VSI's are extremely thick and nearly impossible to break!!!

I had a friend who had a used one. He used a hammer to it and could not get it to break the face of the instruement.

I would not rely on this method as a backup alternate source.

[CameronF]

Originally Posted by DE727UPS

Alternate static, at least in an unpressurized Cessna, just moves a little valve which vents the static source to inside the airplane. It's no big deal.

You know what the alternate to alternate static is?

Smashing the VSI glass. That vents the static to inside the cockpit the same as the alternate static would.

I bet they don't teach that at ATP...hehe.

Lol we hear that a lot in our instrument training at Big Bend. Especially because most of our planes are not equipped with alt. static.

[CameronF]

Originally Posted by SierraPilot123

I would like to see someone accomplish this while in the cockpit. The face of most VSI's are extremely thick and nearly impossible to break!!!

I had a friend who had a used one. He used a hammer to it and could not get it to break the face of the instruement.

I would not rely on this method as a backup alternate source.

I thought that someone sold a special tool that would do the job? Maybe i heard wrong?