Demand for pilots sky-high

[TheFlyingTurkey]

http://www.sltrib.com/business/ci_5152069

Airline expansion
Demand for pilots sky-high

Regional carriers fuel much of the market; some worry that companies may lower standards
By Paul Beebe
The Salt Lake Tribune

Article Last Updated: 02/07/2007 12:50:58 PM MST

Fresh on the heels of hiring 610 pilots last year, SkyWest Airlines intends to hire another 700 this year to keep even with the regional carrier's snowballing growth.

It will be a daunting task. Regionals are flourishing as they pick up less-profitable and shorter routes that national carriers no longer want to fly. The consequence is a shortage of commercial pilots, which some in the industry predict could reach a crisis level and others say has compelled some airlines to lower their hiring standards closer to government minimums in order to fill seats in their cockpits.

"We are looking nationwide. We have a full-court press throughout the system," said Necia Clark-Mantle, vice president of people for St. George-based SkyWest. "The market in general is pretty difficult."
SkyWest executives say the airline has not lowered its hiring benchmarks. Its applicants need 1,000 hours of flying time, including 100 hours piloting multi-engine airplanes in order to get a job interview, and its typical candidate has 1,800 hours of experience. The Federal Aviation Administration requires 250 hours of flight time for a commercial license.
"Anything above and beyond what is stated [in FAA rules] is a business decision on the part of the airline," FAA spokesman Les Dorr said.
Because SkyWest is unwilling to relax its requirements, it must work harder than some airlines to hire qualified pilots.

Great Lakes Airlines demands 750 hours and is not feeling a shortage of acceptable candidates, said Monica Taylor, a spokeswoman for the Cheyenne, Wyo.-based regional carrier. American Eagle, which is hiring 30 to 60 pilots a month, accepts as few as 400 hours if applicants complete pilot training at approved flight schools, spokesman Dave Jackson said. American Eagle is a subsidiary of AMR Corp., which also owns American Airlines.

SkyWest has posted help-wanted notices on its Web site, and it will conduct pilot career fairs in Salt Lake City and seven other cities this month. The airline wants to talk to pilots who fly for other regionals or who have been furloughed by bigger carriers. And it's combing through university aviation programs, looking for acceptable candidates.
There might be no time like the present to become a pilot for hire. Airlines hired about 8,500 aviators last year, and the pace should continue at that level or higher for the next 10 years, according to AIR Inc., which tracks pilot hiring. Aerospace giant Boeing Co. estimates the global appetite for new pilots at 17,000 a year through 2024.

"All I can say is it's the best time to get into the industry," said Mike Kraus, program director for the aviation studies program at Westminster College, which graduates about 110 commercial pilots a year, ready for the job market. "When you are born sometimes controls your destiny and opportunities."

The remarkable turnaround of the airline industry - whose fortunes ebbed after 9/11 - is behind much of the demand for pilots, said Kip Darby, president of Atlanta-based AIR. Much of the industry is returning to profitability after wresting huge pay and benefits concessions from employees, shedding expensive retirement programs and shifting more flying to contract carriers such as SkyWest. Rising fares and falling jet fuel prices are helping, too.

At the same time, the military - traditionally one of the best sources of commercial pilots - is retaining more of its aviators. And many pilots who leave the military are choosing other careers, underlining the instability in the airline industry that has pushed many carriers to extract big pay and benefit cuts from their employees.

"The next big crisis is a lack of qualified crews," said Ed Thiel, a Delta Air Lines captain and member of the executive council of the Delta unit of the Air Line Pilots Association. "The airlines are having difficulty finding qualified applicants. There are not as many people coming out of the military route, and it's almost prohibitively expensive to go through the civilian route, while the career has degraded to the point where it doesn't make sense to go into the business."

Aspiring pilots who enroll in aeronautical colleges can expect big tuition bills. An undergraduate degree at Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University in Florida costs almost $100,000. Thiel said nonacademic routes to a job at a major airline can be as expensive and take 10 years to complete.
All the same, a job isn't hard to find after a pilot earns a commercial license.

Two years ago, Frank Ayers, chairman of Embry-Riddle's flight department, was able to keep graduates on as flight instructors for a couple of years before they landed a job flying for a regional airline or other employer.
"I'm lucky now if I keep someone six months," Ayers said. "Don't get me wrong; it's a good problem to have. Despite all the bankruptcies, it appears that the increased demand for air travel is solid. Airlines have finished downsizing and have figured out how to fly profitably."

Analysts are betting that most airlines will report strong earnings in 2007. Ray Neidl of Calyon Securities thinks that American Airlines could earn earn $4.06 per share, or about $889 million, with United Airlines earning $4.80, or abut $531 million. SkyWest is expected to be the most profitable regional carrier, earning $2.71 a share, or close to $173 million, this year.
"There is a relationship between airline profits and hiring," AIR's Darby said. He believes that some airlines will earn as much as $1 billion a year as their profitability builds during the rest of the decade. "If that relationship holds true, we will see a lot of hiring."

The pilot hiring that SkyWest is undertaking is part of a broader plan to expand its 10,000-employee work force by up to 4,000 workers this year. In part, turnover is pushing the airline to accelerate pilot hiring. Regionals historically have been where young pilots assemble enough flying experience to move to bigger airlines.

About 10 percent of SkyWest's pilots leave the company each year. Some pack it in when they reach age 60. (Last week, the FAA said it would propose raising the compulsory retirement age to 65.) Others leave for jobs at other airlines, said Camille Ence, manager of pilot recruitment.
Most pilots who leave hope to hire on at national airlines and air cargo companies, which pay more and give better benefits, Darby said. FedEx pays an Airbus A380 captain with 10 years of experience $17,464 a month, according to WillFlyForFood.cc, a Web site that compares pilot pay. An American Airlines captain flying a Boeing 767 earns $11,008 a month. SkyWest jet captains with a decade of experience earn about $3,000 a month. First officers are paid $1,425 a month, according to WillFlyForFood.
Although some bankrupt carriers have turned their retirement programs over to the government Pension Benefit Guarantee Corp., most retirement packages at the bigger airlines are still defined-benefit programs instead of 401(k) programs. Bigger airlines also provide more rest time between flights, Darby said.

The key reason why SkyWest must hire hundreds of new pilots this year is its growing alliance with Delta. In November, Delta selected SkyWest Inc. to take over some of the regional flying business operated by its Comair subsidiary. This month, Delta will shift the flying of 12 Canadair regional jets to SkyWest, The company also is waiting to hear whether Delta will award it another 131 Comair jets. Each aircraft needs a rotation of nine pilots.
Delta also granted eight of the 70-seat jets to SkyWest when it bought Atlantic Southeast Airlines in September 2005. Those aircraft are scheduled to be delivered between now and May.

The growth in the numbers of pilots and other employees "will be primarily dedicated to our Delta mainline partnership," SkyWest's Clark-Mantle said.
pbeebe@sltrib.com

[DE727UPS]

"All I can say is it's the best time to get into the industry," said Mike Kraus, program director for the aviation studies program at Westminster College"

Easy for him to say. His paycheck depends on it.

Then there is a Kit Darby quote. The usual.

Then, the ALPA guy says "...while the career has degraded to the point where it doesn't make sense to go into the business." as he discusses the pending pilot shortage.

So, while it seems there are airline jobs out there, they aren't your fathers airline jobs. Hopefully the next generation can raise the bar.

[MSUDAWG]

[quote=TheFlyingTurkey;532029]

FedEx pays an Airbus A380 captain with 10 years of experience $17,464 a month, according to WillFlyForFood.cc, a Web site that compares pilot pay.


FedEx has A380's?? Wow thats amazing, those sneaky people I thought they cancelled their order

Where do these writers get their numbers and information? Seems to me they would do their homework before they wrote something so wrong as that....

[caliginousface]

Originally Posted by DE727UPS

So, while it seems there are airline jobs out there, they aren't your fathers airline jobs. Hopefully the next generation can raise the bar.

I don't know man, I was talking to a few friends and they were talking about how mins were dropping to 400/100 or something. I said I wouldn't feel comfortable flying a jet with people behind me, but they didn't really care. I mean come on, it's a jet.

[jtrain609]

[quote=MSUDAWG;532087]

Originally Posted by TheFlyingTurkey

FedEx pays an Airbus A380 captain with 10 years of experience $17,464 a month, according to WillFlyForFood.cc, a Web site that compares pilot pay.


FedEx has A380's?? Wow thats amazing, those sneaky people I thought they cancelled their order

Where do these writers get their numbers and information? Seems to me they would do their homework before they wrote something so wrong as that....

There was still a pay rate for the equipment type that was negotiated in the last contract, I believe.

[mpenguin1]

[quote=MSUDAWG;532087]

Originally Posted by TheFlyingTurkey

FedEx pays an Airbus A380 captain with 10 years of experience $17,464 a month, according to WillFlyForFood.cc, a Web site that compares pilot pay.


FedEx has A380's?? Wow thats amazing, those sneaky people I thought they cancelled their order

Where do these writers get their numbers and information? Seems to me they would do their homework before they wrote something so wrong as that....

When airlines place order for aircraft, they have to negotiate a pay scale for that aircraft. So, yes FEDEX, recently cancelled their A380 order, though, they placed the order for the A380, years ago, and had to negotiate the A380 pay scale.

When Airtran placed their 737-700 order with Boeing, there is also a 737-800 payscale, which Airtran does not have.

Years ago, Alaska was looking at an Airbus order, & Alaska set up an Airbus payscale.

[Texasspilot]

The next big crisis is a lack of qualified crews," said Ed Thiel, a Delta Air Lines captain and member of the executive council of the Delta unit of the Air Line Pilots Association. "The airlines are having difficulty finding qualified applicants. There are not as many people coming out of the military route, and it's almost prohibitively expensive to go through the civilian route, while the career has degraded to the point where it doesn't make sense to go into the business."


Didn't we go over this article already?

A shortage of crews will be appearent when the mini-majors raise there pay to an acceptable level to compete with the real airlines.

The only real "regionals" left are colgan, bigsky, and the like.

[DE727UPS]

This article is different from the one I posted, if that's what you're thinking of.

[Ralgha]

From the article:

Originally Posted by TheFlyingTurkey

SkyWest jet captains with a decade of experience earn about $3,000 a month.

Whatever moron spewed that little jem got their numbers from the jet FO column, not the captain column. Whether that pay is good or not is beside the point.

[surreal1221]

Originally Posted by DE727UPS

So, while it seems there are airline jobs out there, they aren't your fathers airline jobs. Hopefully the next generation can raise the bar.

Besides what you do here on JC Don, what are you doing to raise the bar for the future generation? Or are you just going to let us deal with it when we get there?

I'm afraid there won't be a bar for us to even raise within the next 3-6 years.

[Maximillian_Jenius]

That seemed more like an employment ad for Skywest! Oh, yea and if you didn't get it from the article. They're hiring!!!

[SeanD]

What do they mean "not as many people coming from the military route"? Are military pilots staying in longer or are there less aviators enlisted these days. Im not sure I understand. I guess I was looking for him to back up that statement. Yes the civilian route is $$$$$$$$$ thats for sure. It has stopped me from training for right now.

[LoadMasterC141]

Originally Posted by SeanD

What do they mean "not as many people coming from the military route"? Are military pilots staying in longer or are there less aviators enlisted these days. Im not sure I understand. I guess I was looking for him to back up that statement. Yes the civilian route is $$$$$$$$$ thats for sure. It has stopped me from training for right now.

Pilots are commisioned. Aircrew are enlisted

Yes less pilots in the military these days. Also, the commitment is ten years, and then they offer a 6 figure lump sum bonus to stay for another ten. Coupled with the fact that the majors don;t pay what they used to, and the instability, military pilots are fools not to do their 20 (Just my opinion of course)

[SeanD]

Originally Posted by LoadMasterC141

Pilots are commisioned. Aircrew are enlisted

Yes less pilots in the military these days. Also, the commitment is ten years, and then they offer a 6 figure lump sum bonus to stay for another ten. Coupled with the fact that the majors don;t pay what they used to, and the instability, military pilots are fools not to do their 20 (Just my opinion of course)

Wow, things sure have changed. Thanks for clearing that up for me. When my father was in the military the airlines came to them. Is that something thats going to happen again on a major level not regional? I have heard it is pretty tough to get your wings in the military these days.

[LoadMasterC141]

Actually, being "Eligible" for pilot training is easier than ever. Just one eample: I was disqualified for my eyes. Now they let you have laser surgery.

The point is, if you were say, A C-17 Pilot in Charleston with 10 years in and close to Major, would you take the $120-some grand bonus(Think that is what it currently is) or go off to fly for a major that is bankrupt still?
Would you throw away complete stability, full medical and dental, and the opportunity to do fun flying all over the world, just to be an airline pilot? I mean, look at pay rates in the military. They are not bad anymore, especially considering most everything is paid for you (Housing, cheap food, entertainment, etc...).

Some do go, but most stay and get at least their twenty, and nice 50% retirement pay, full medical for life......See where I am going?

I think it was smart of the military to try and better retain their pilots. The amount of money they put into them to leave after 6 years for the airlines was ridiculous.

[DE727UPS]

"Besides what you do here on JC Don, what are you doing to raise the bar for the future generation"

Well, what would you LIKE me to do? We signed a contract earlier this year that gave me a $33/hr raise. I guess that's a start...

[surreal1221]

Which is a start, don't get me wrong.

One that is needed greatly in the passenger realm, imho.

[DE727UPS]

"Which is a start"

What else would you like me to do?

[ComplexHiAv8r]

Originally Posted by DE727UPS

"Besides what you do here on JC Don, what are you doing to raise the bar for the future generation"

Well, what would you LIKE me to do? We signed a contract earlier this year that gave me a $33/hr raise. I guess that's a start...

If I can ask, what did first year CA & FO go up?
I ask as we hear the senior rates seem to go up and the 1st year don't do as well.

What can a pilot do to help increase the bar beside refuse the job in the first place?

[Seggy]

Originally Posted by ComplexHiAv8r

If I can ask, what did first year CA & FO go up?
I ask as we hear the senior rates seem to go up and the 1st year don't do as well.

What can a pilot do to help increase the bar beside refuse the job in the first place?

Because, throughout the history of the airlines, first year is a 'probabtionary period'. You have to pay your dues with first year pay, no union protection, and doing the airport appreciation tour with reserve. Once you get past your first year, the thought is you can function at the company, and they reward you with good pay and protection.

There are also no first year captains at any Major.

There is NOTHING wrong with first year pay being 'low' at Majors. That is the way it should be. Once you get to second year pay, that is a whole different story!

[tonyw]

I'll bet if they would raise the pay for pilots, there'd be a lot more people looking to do it.

Hell, man, I love flying as much as the next guy, but why the hell should I give up my nice cushy gig in order to do more work for a third of the pay?

[PurduePilot]

There is NOTHING wrong with first year pay being 'low' at Majors. That is the way it should be. Once you get to second year pay, that is a whole different story!

I agree, however, pay should not be so low as to not be livable. In my book no one can survive on $18,000/year. A more reasonable wage would be in the low $30,000s. That's not an unreasonable sum, in my opinion.

[fly8slep]

Originally Posted by Seggy

Because, throughout the history of the airlines, first year is a 'probabtionary period'. You have to pay your dues with first year pay, no union protection,!

<Unnecessary personal slam removed. >

What we really need is an overall higher payscale ESPECIALLY first year or two. 21/ hour is not going to cut it. 35 should be first year pay and on. Unless the companies don't realize this then they're not even going to find commercial pilots let alone 1000 hour ones. I mean it's just crazy when a company has trouble finding peple they don't lower the requirements they give more benefits and higher pay. That's why people should continue to support airlines like Skywest who continue to keep their mins even if they can't find anybody.

[PurduePilot]

Something's gonna have to give... with airlines parking airplanes and JetBlue shutting down their entire 190 ops for nearly 3 days because of a lack of crews, it's hit a critical mass.

I took the ATC job, a job that I would not rather of have taken, because it paid a lot better than any flying job out there. My first year pay: $36,000.

[Seggy]

Originally Posted by PurduePilot

I agree, however, pay should not be so low as to not be livable. In my book no one can survive on $18,000/year. A more reasonable wage would be in the low $30,000s. That's not an unreasonable sum, in my opinion.

Originally Posted by fly8slep

<Unnecessary personal slam removed. >


What we really need is an overall higher payscale ESPECIALLY first year or two. 21/ hour is not going to cut it. 35 should be first year pay and on. Unless the companies don't realize this then they're not even going to find commercial pilots let alone 1000 hour ones. I mean it's just crazy when a company has trouble finding peple they don't lower the requirements they give more benefits and higher pay. That's why people should continue to support airlines like Skywest who continue to keep their mins even if they can't find anybody.

Folks I am NOT talking about Skywest here, I am talking about the legacy carriers. I have said it once and will say it again. Making 30-35 bucks an hour for your FIRST year at a legacy carrier, NOTHING wrong with that. Second year pay, it should be in the low to mid 90s.

As someone who is looking close to a two year upgrade at a place that has second year pay at 22 an hour don't preach to me on how I like to take it from the company, you misread what I wrote there buddy.

It is disgusting what the regionals are paying for first year pay, buy my post wasn't talking about the regionals, I was talking about the legacy places.