Demand for pilots sky-high

[Doug Taylor]

Originally Posted by OldTownPilot

The last street captains at the legacies are on "bad boy" lists. Namely Continental in '83, United in '85 and Eastern in '87.

If that does not happen again, there will be no more street captains at the legacies.

I just wanna fly!

[Seggy]

Originally Posted by Doug Taylor

There were several 15-month 737 captains down at Southernjets Express in MCO back in the day.

In fact, one of my pals went from being a Braslia captain in PSP at Skywest, went to Southernjets, did a year on the 727 flight engineer seat and right after probation was able to bid MCO 737 CA.

That's hot.



What is he now? MD-88 CA in NYC?

[Doug Taylor]

Originally Posted by Seggy

That's hot.



What is he now? MD-88 CA in NYC?

I can't remember his last name off-hand else I'd check. Jeff....dangit, Jeff something dutch... Handel! BRB, I'll go see, but I know he wasn't able to maintain that through all the happy-happy-joy-joy that was the industry in the last years.

[Seggy]

Originally Posted by Doug Taylor

I'll go see, but I know he wasn't able to maintain that through all the happy-happy-joy-joy that was the industry in the last years.

yeah thats what I figure, he probably is doing the NYC crashpad thing covering three airports as an FO...

[MQAAord]

There was one of the most senior guys in Bill's class was able to hold 737 CA in MCO. I don't know for how long he held it, but he obviously got bumped back to F/O post 9/11. The guys from Bill's class (Oct 1999) are just now getting into the 'possibility' realm of holding CA. Obviously very junior, NY based 88 CA!

Bill was 727 FE for about 3 months in NY, promptly got his transfer to CVG, then got his 88 bid in March of 2000.

[Seggy]

Originally Posted by MQAAord

There was one of the most senior guys in Bill's class was able to hold 737 CA in MCO. I don't know for how long he held it, but he obviously got bumped back to F/O post 9/11. The guys from Bill's class (Oct 1999) are just now getting into the 'possibility' realm of holding CA. Obviously very junior, NY based 88 CA!

Bill was 727 FE for about 3 months in NY, promptly got his transfer to CVG, then got his 88 bid in March of 2000.

I LOVE how the NYC bases for pretty much EVERY airline are junior.

That is of course I LOVE it now. Who knows where I will end up, the more and more I think about it the more and more I am thinking about Dallas, Chicago, or SOCAL.

[amorris311]

seggy need to make it socal.

[skydog]

Originally Posted by mattp1803

20 years to make captain at US Airways yikes! I saw that on APC as well.

Not all that unusual, and pretty much SOP back in the sixties and seventies. I knew a man, who was hired by UAL in 1962 who spent something like 18 years in the Flight Engineer and Co-Pilot's seats before he upgraded to 737 Captain. Then he spent another 10 years in that seat.

[skydog]

I disagree with the whole "first-year-is-dues-paying-year-so-the-pay-is-low" scenario, for a lot of reasons. A pilot fresh out of new hire school is doing the exact same job as a guy who has been in that seat for 5 or 10 years. Why should they be paid differently? Granted the 10 year guy's skills are likely to be more refined than the one year guy, but the airline doesn't charge a lower fare when the new guy is flying, so why should he be paid less? The airline derives value no matter who is in that seat. Also, a new guy is in no way insulated from the risks that go along with the job. He has just as much chance of getting injured or killed, or perhaps taking over for an incapacitated captain, as the 10 year guy. Nor is the FAA going to cut him any slack just because he is on first year probation. For these reasons, I think a day one pilot should be paid no less than a 30 year pilot, except for the obvious reasons of upgrade and/or airframe.

[typhoonpilot]

Originally Posted by DE727UPS

First year at UPS, 33K. Second year F/O, 96K.

Here is the major problem. A lot of pilots looking at going to another airline post 9-11 were coming from jobs where they made around $100K. It would be okay to go down to, say 75K for the first year, but to go all the way down to 33K is impossible for most people with families. That makes it very difficult for a professional pilot to start over again.

In just about every other industry you can take your experience with you to a new job and it will count for something. You will start near your old pay range.

This is not a dis on UPS, but just pointing out that it's not just people who are starting from the beginning of their career who have to look at first year major pay, it is older guys who are changing jobs as well.



TP

[typhoonpilot]

Originally Posted by mattp1803

20 years to make captain at US Airways yikes! I saw that on APC as well.

It could be a lot longer than that. If the USAirways seniority integration proposal goes through it will take a 1989 hire at USAirways 24-25 years to make Captain. If the AWA proposal goes through it will be closer to 30 years .


TP