San Antonio is abuzz for XJT!

[Seggy]

Originally Posted by Captain_Bob

One thing I do agree with!! It's all a crap shoot.

Oh yeah... and that we need the luck!

Bob

Bob we ALL need the luck!

[Chris_Ford]

Originally Posted by Captain_Bob

Have you checked the price of fuel and the state of the economy lately vs. this time last year and the previous year?

UAL didn't pull out of SAT because of high costs, it was because of ridiculously low income. Their 50 seaters were routinely going out with 20ish people. Going to many of the same places.

Yep... LR's and XR's vs. ER's. More fuel efficient, longer range, less weight restrictions.

SAT-SMF, SAT-TUS and similar need LRs and XRs? I couldn't imagine there being that dramatic of a savings, but I don't know the cost structures.

Not "overgrowth" at all... We are operating the same equipment we always have. Just serving a different customer. We didn't need to "acquire" new planes, new pilots, new contracts, and have new training thrown in.

Yes, but look at the amount of capital you have tied up in this venture. And I'm not saying that XJT is going to go out of business. Like I said before, this thing will, at best, break even, and then it will be considered a HUGE success. More than likely it will lose a fair share, and eventually go by the wayside. It's not a bad temporary plan to keep planes flying, but it's not going to turn them into the next legacy.

Regarding the 18% below the poverty line... I personally haven't researched that so good on you for the google. But I do know that folks in higher paygrades than me did reserch it and thought it to be a good time to hit this market. (Not saying that people in higher paygrades are smarter than you and me... just saying they were paid to devote a lot of time and energy to that specific point).

You're right. Airline management is always so wise about these things. Thank God for it, I'm glad we're all getting our $15M bonus checks due to how wise every decision maker within every airline is of course. You know the people at FlyI had the same "upper paygrade" individuals working for them who said it could work also?

In addition... the 18% is not our market focus nor the "untapped market" we are looking at. We are being marketed toward the "business" traveler. Making life a bit more efficient for these guys at rates competitive with (not discounted from) the Major's in that market now... without the hassle of connecting/misconnecting in a city that is hundreds of miles and a few hours in the opposite direction of their destination.

Remember... SAT is a very small percentage part of our overall plan... so arguing this one city will not make or break this airline.

In addition to all that... our plan is fluid and flexible... if SAT does end up being stale like you say... we remove a route or two and place those aircraft on the routes that are successful in another part of the country. Something that a Regional working under a CPA does not have the ability to do.

Bob

That last part sounds a lot like the FlyI people too.

And hey, I'm not saying that I hope it fails, because I'm not. I'm just saying that I would keep a close eye on your Flavor Aid intake

[SpiraMirabilis]

Chris Ford - what the heck is your problem? San Antonio is not a black hole, KSAT is a nice enough airport, San Antonio has over a million people and its poverty levels are basically inline with Texas as a whole (17%).
If ExpressJet thinks they can make it work why don't you wait until they try and fail before you piss all over it?

[Chris_Ford]

Originally Posted by SpiraMirabilis

Chris Ford - what the heck is your problem? San Antonio is not a black hole, KSAT is a nice enough airport, San Antonio has over a million people and its poverty levels are basically inline with Texas as a whole (17%).
If ExpressJet thinks they can make it work why don't you wait until they try and fail before you piss all over it?

How am I "pissing all over it" by pointing out that this is literally page for page out of UAL's handbook when they tried this?

If I were "pissing all over it" I would point out tons of things. Like SWAs 49 flights out of the airport, or the fact that they list San Antonio as a "tourist destination" though the only people I've ever heard of going to San Antonio for vacation (I suppose to see the Alamo) was the black family friends of the Tanners on Full House. EDIT: It was actually Amarillo, so there are zero people I know who have gone to San Antonio on vacation (The alamo bowl, on the other hand, will fill up flights for approximately 3 days on either side of the 28th of December. Maybe that'll break them even!!!)

That would be pissing all over it.

[SpiraMirabilis]

San Antonio has a lot of tourists, actually. I'm not sure why because Austin is cooler but you see them all the time downtown.

[Captain_Bob]

Oh we are definately keeping a close eye on the kool-aid... we certainly are drinking a lot lately... but no where have I said... "IT WILL BE A SUCCESS!" I'm just arguing the minutia with you.

To each of your original points in the "different" arguement... I just debated a few facts...

I could further argue that TSA's 50 seaters going out with 20 people supports my argument that the economy was not as strong then as it is now. They didn't do the type of marketing that we are either.

You wondered if we were using a different type of 145... I said yes. How they fit that into the business plan is up to them... but they certainly are more efficient and folks are less likely to get bumped due to W&B issues... If we can get the planes full!

I'm also not saying that we don't have a lot of capital tied up in this... I'm just saying we aren't adding to those startup costs by taking even more unnecessary risks, like new fleet types... and let me be clear on this... No where... absolutely no where have we said that we plan on being the next legacy. That's taking a jump to the extreme there Chris for the sake of such a small debate. Our hope is to come up with a business plan that can work and serve smaller markets that may be untapped with direct service options. It's different... but you gotta admit the hub & spoke certainly isn't the "end all".

Most new businesses go out of business in the first 6 months. If they break even... they are a success with potential to streamline the process to make a profit. What's wrong with that? Breaking even would be better than many legacies have done in previous years.

At this point and time... it's not a "temporary" plan. If Management went into this with that thought process then it certainly will fail.

I totally get your sarcasm with the higher paygrade folks remark... that being said... our managment is a bit more respected than Indy's was. I certainly hope it helps.

Here's the type of responses that we are getting from former ACA pilots in our company forums:

Being a former employee of ACA/ACJet... I can assure you all that what ExpressJet is doing is head over heals better then the approach that ACA/flyI took. First off, 75% of our revenue is still comming from the CAL and we did not tell CAL to goF them selves. Also who are we compeating with and look at the rout structure. flyI was doing a hub and spoke system out of IAD going head to head with United and they ddi not have the A320's on line to the money markets at the initial start up. Also look at our management team vs Tom Moore and Kerry Skeen. Moore and Skeen had a good company ACA and beaked it by turning a regional structure into a major. Jim Ream and the other folks that are a few pay grades above us have been looking into this for a bit and they are not going to lead us on a kamakazi mission. Be positive and if this does not work out we are not out of jobs because we still are flying for CAL and possiby some other major in the future. I am excited for what ExpressJet is doing not scared like how I was over at ACA.

Hey... like I said... the kool-aid is good right now. Management has been upfront with us regarding their research into the markets, and the overall business plan. There is a tremendous surge of pride, not fear, going on in our ranks right now and I'm certainly happy to be a part of it. That said... we are looking at this whole venture with what I'd call "excited trepidation" on par with "cautious optimism" but with a little more umph! We are all willing to give it 100+% for the benefit of keeping those lower on the seniority list gainfully employed... as well as ourselves.

It might work... it might not.

All I'm asking for... again... is some love bro!

Bob

[bwade210]

"different time..." 1 year later... things have dramatically changed in SAT since 2005-06?



Well....Toyota just opened a multi million dollar production plant for the Toyota Tacoma in January of 2007.

[bwade210]

"...or the fact that they list San Antonio as a "tourist destination" though the only people I've ever heard of going to San Antonio for vacation (I suppose to see the Alamo) was the black family friends of the Tanners on Full House. EDIT: It was actually Amarillo, so there are zero people I know who have gone to San Antonio on vacation (The alamo bowl, on the other hand, will fill up flights for approximately 3 days on either side of the 28th of December. Maybe that'll break them even!!!)"



Oh....well there is that "small theme park" out 1604 by the name of Sea World of Texas or if you head a little farther east on 1604 and IH-10 you "might" notice Six Flags. But, I figure because of your know it all personality then you just just forgot to mention those "tourists attractions"....right? Just because Chris Ford doesn't know anyone who goes to San Antonio as a tourist then, Express Jet is making a mistake by operating non-stops to 8 locations out of KSAT. What a joke.