Logbook remarks

[riot shields]

random question, but what sort of things might not be so great to put into the remarks section of your/somebody elses logbook. such as diagrams, an airplane crashed into the ground for a bad xwind landing.. clouds with lightning bolts shooting out, taking off one of your wings, upside down airplanes for bad spin awareness...

i mean all this sounds pretty fun to draw , but i someeeeeehow think the airlines just might not see it to be as funny.

but honestly, anybody ever get any feedback as to what might be bad/better/great for some remarks in your own logbook ?

[Hacker15e]

Originally Posted by riot shields

random question, but what sort of things might not be so great to put into the remarks section of your/somebody elses logbook. such as diagrams, an airplane crashed into the ground for a bad xwind landing.. clouds with lightning bolts shooting out, taking off one of your wings, upside down airplanes for bad spin awareness...

Dunno about what the airlines might think, but that's hilarious! Do you have any scans of examples?

[riot shields]

oh i know better than to draw that in myyyy logbook

[Timbuff10]

most people just put in the flight maneuvers/approaches they do... You know, stuff that is required for ratings.

I like to write in other cool stuff too. Saw a rainbow in between clouds, witnessed another plane crash on the runway and had to circle for a while, student did this unique thing randomly, flew over the mississippi, stuff like that.

You probably want to avoid drawings and stuff like "flew through these cool clouds while VFR".

[Alchemy]

Be careful about putting "cutesy" items in the remarks section.

I got RIPPED by an FAA inspector on a checkride for this....and all I had in there were names of some of the people I was flying with. Honestly it's to the point where I would just put the minimum required info about the flight in there....

[Hacker15e]

What minimum required info? I was under the impression that, unless it was documenting maneuvers required for a rating (like Tim said), nothing was required in the comments section.

[Alchemy]

Exactly...if nothing is required (namely instructor signoff and description of maneuvers) I'd just leave it blank. If I shot an approach or performed a hold, I also put the name and type of approach and the fix where the hold occured. For 121 flights I will add the flight number....other than that, blank.

[KLB]

As an I instructor, I usually just list as....private manuevers, instrument manuevers, commercial manuevers and etc...

It saves me time.

[Looking4Lower]

Originally Posted by Alchemy

Be careful about putting "cutesy" items in the remarks section.

I got RIPPED by an FAA inspector on a checkride for this....and all I had in there were names of some of the people I was flying with. Honestly it's to the point where I would just put the minimum required info about the flight in there....

Why did this clown "RIP" you for logbook remarks? It wasn't like you put anything questionable or incriminating in there (I would understand if he got irritated with that).

I see my logbook as a record of my entire aviation experience, not just holds and maneuvers. It's great to look thru all those past entries and recall the things that have shaped me as a pilot. I have logged interesting or unusual events, people/crew I have flown with, and other things. Nothing that I would be afraid or ashamed of showing to anybody, be it an FAA inspector or a best friend.

When I'm an old man, and if my grandkids are sitting around asking about the flying I did throughout my life, I want to be able to browse thru my logs and be reminded of my flying adventures so I can tell them my story. I want more than hundreds of pages of "Flight #XYZ" or "Held at CSN" or "Airwork in preparation for Commercial Checkride."

But that's just my opinion.

If you really want a clean barebones logbook, use a presentation logbook for career purposes and keep a second log (or journal) to document the fun stuff. As a side note, I have worked over 7 flying jobs, including a 121 and a 135 job, and nobody has ever asked to see my logbooks. I think my ATP examiner thumbed thru it, but that just prompted a conversation about taildraggers.

[falconvalley]

Originally Posted by Alchemy

Be careful about putting "cutesy" items in the remarks section.

I got RIPPED by an FAA inspector on a checkride for this....and all I had in there were names of some of the people I was flying with. Honestly it's to the point where I would just put the minimum required info about the flight in there....

Elaborate, a little, about getting ripped about writing in your logbook.

[Timbuff10]

Just got back from the National Archives Building and got to peek at the Logbooks for the USS Missouri. I thought it was interesting to see that they wrote in there how the "Japanese Imperial Army surrendered today." I doubt they are required to write stuff in the logs like that but it was pretty neat to see in there!

As for the FAA guy "ripping you" I could totally see that happening but who cares really. Get your certificates, make the guy feel like an aviation god and move on.

I am kinda curious to know what he said to you though.

[falconvalley]

I wanna know what he said. The logbook belongs to the Airman, not the FAA. We can write whatever the heck we want in there. The regulations cover what has to be logged for currency and progression and what we can use for currency and progression, not what you can and can't write in there.

Of course, use your judgement. Some instructors keep a separate log (that they can destroy after 3 years). You don't want to keep anything that can get you in trouble after the statute. I'm just guessing that's what Alchemy is talking about. But we don't need misconceptions going around the aviation community. To many problems with people getting all bent out of shape over something that just isn't true, including me

[JaceTheAce]

Originally Posted by Alchemy

Be careful about putting "cutesy" items in the remarks section.

I got RIPPED by an FAA inspector on a checkride for this....and all I had in there were names of some of the people I was flying with. Honestly it's to the point where I would just put the minimum required info about the flight in there....

That FAA inspector is a complete idiot. Who tells you what you can put in the remarks section, is that a reg??????????? Umm no. I will continue to put "took my first passenger up flying for the first time" or "had my first engine failure" .................or..........."first flight that earned me a membership in the mile high club" (well, not that last one! haha)

[Bandit_Driver]

When I was instucting I kept it pretty simple and a little vague so if anything were to come back there was "wiggle" room.

When I was flying 135 freight I always noted who the crew was (if any) and if the leg was 91 or 135, since we often went over the flight time limits coming home 91.

In the airlines I just note the crewmembers employee numbers and names and if the leg was 91 I note that too. You never want to give the feds any extra info (evidence) if they were ever to want your logbook.

I do keep mx notes seperately, so I can watch problems with specific aircraft.

[Timbuff10]

For the CFIs out there, does anyone else write in the remarks section the name of the student you gave the dual to on that flight? I have been doing that and I think it is pretty cool to go back and look at how the students progressed.

I know it isn't required but for some reason, when I first started instructing I thought it was a requirement. Glad I stuck with it.

[bLizZuE]

On non training flights I'll write about my passengers, and what we did. Sight seeing or if it was just a trip. Even on my training flights- if I eat lunch somewhwere I will put down what I ate, and if it was good or not. Sometimes I remark on if my landings were good or not, and if I saw anything interesting along the way. It's nice to look through the logbook and see something, and be able to remember what I did on that specific flight. Otherwise it's all just a huge expensive blur.

[Alchemy]

Basically the inspector I'm mentioning took notice of the airplanes I was flying and the people I was carrying and said wow, I really question your judgement if you're flying family in that airplane...etc. etc.

One thing I've learned in my meager experience in aviation is that certain types of individuals will use anything they can find to the detriment of your career. Should you find yourself in a bad situation, you don't want to give these people additional ammo. The logbook, to me, is simply a document that outlines your flight experience, not some kind of nostalgic memoir (not that I don't wish mine could be, but after my experience I'm honestly not comfortable with putting certain details in there). Not trying to scare anyone, just sharing my experience. Something that you may think is a totally innocent remark might be just the bit of evidence for "reckless operation" that a fed needs so they can yank your certificates. Remember we are not talking about reasonable people here, we are talking about the federal government.

TimBuff....you are required to keep a record of the students you provide instruction for, and I believe listing their name in your logbook helps satisfy that requirment; so in a sense, it is required, although it doesn't necessarily have to be done in your logbook.

[falconvalley]

Exactly. Everyone's logbook is their business. Don't let someone bully you into doing it their way. As long as you have a record that shows you are legal, you're good to go. The rest of the stuff is cream filling. Some people like it, some people don't.

[Timbuff10]

Well, I know about the record that you have to keep to satisfy 61.189. But all it says is that you need to keep a record for three years of students that you endorse for a checkride, knowledge test or solo flight privileges. I am yet to see any requirements that say you have to keep a record of people that you gave dual to.

I keep my record in a little notebook... I guess putting it in your logbook would work too though? And I have seen people record every endorsement that they give in there too... Including those stupid TSA endorsements.

[falconvalley]

I think that's a misconception that results from people merely adding the students' names to their logbook entry. That will usually satisfy 189. Some CFIs take it further by adding the name to every dual given entry.

[UND_Flyer]

Originally Posted by Timbuff10

For the CFIs out there, does anyone else write in the remarks section the name of the student you gave the dual to on that flight? I have been doing that and I think it is pretty cool to go back and look at how the students progressed.

I know it isn't required but for some reason, when I first started instructing I thought it was a requirement. Glad I stuck with it.

As a CFI, I put the following in the remarks section of my logbook.

For Example:

Lesson 5 - Student's Last name
Steep Turns, Pwr. on/off Stalls, Traffic Pattern

I put the students name and lesson # and maneuvers, that way I can see how the progress and what I've covered.

[flyguy]

I usually put the names of the people I fly with, mainly because I'm afraid an inspector may say..."well if you didn't log it as solo, dual given, or dual recived, who were you flying with..." Also, I always put my students names in there for fear that they might acuse me of padding my logbook. By putting my student's names ith there, they can crosscheck my student's logbook and that'll be more than enough (theoretically) to prove my time. Also, I think of my logbook as my aviation diary. I won't put anything in there that I don't want anyone to see, but if I have a memorable experience, I'll put in a comment about it. If the FAA dosn't like that, I really don't care.

[Timbuff10]

Originally Posted by UND_Flyer

As a CFI, I put the following in the remarks section of my logbook.

For Example:

Lesson 5 - Student's Last name
Steep Turns, Pwr. on/off Stalls, Traffic Pattern

I put the students name and lesson # and maneuvers, that way I can see how the progress and what I've covered.

I heard a story about a CFI that went to an airline interview and after showing his logbooks to the interviewers they asked him "What is lesson five?". I guess it threw him for a loop and they didn't like that. If you also write in what lesson five is, then it probably wouldn't matter.

[Chris_Ford]

Originally Posted by Timbuff10

I heard a story about a CFI that went to an airline interview and after showing his logbooks to the interviewers they asked him "What is lesson five?". I guess it threw him for a loop and they didn't like that. If you also write in what lesson five is, then it probably wouldn't matter.

If one is using a syllabus and has a checklist of what was done on the lesson in their personal files, how is it an issue? (Not calling you out, calling the interviewers out).

I keep a checklist of every flight in my personal records, and in my logbook, I'll cite "Lesson X", so that if something does come up, I can refer to my dated file entry.

[MFT1Air]

Originally Posted by Timbuff10

Well, I know about the record that you have to keep to satisfy 61.189. But all it says is that you need to keep a record for three years of students that you endorse for a checkride, knowledge test or solo flight privileges. I am yet to see any requirements that say you have to keep a record of people that you gave dual to.

I keep my record in a little notebook... I guess putting it in your logbook would work too though? And I have seen people record every endorsement that they give in there too... Including those stupid TSA endorsements.

Whoa! My CFI. . .gosh, he's got over 20,000 hours. I kinda wonder if he even writes his hours in a logbook?