Prospects for foreign pilots in US

[Tristan]

Hi there,

I'm an Australian student pilot with aspirations of becoming a professional pilot. THe industry down here in oz is basically proportional to the population of 19-20 million. SOme argue that there is an over supply of commercial pilots in Australia, making it harder to find employment. There is a saying down here; 'as soon as you get the employment minimums, head north and knock on every door on the way'. Northern AUstralia has more job opportunities for pilots, due to the large network of regional communities which relies on air travel. However, most of the aircraft used for this part of the country are Cessna 182s etc.

It is highly likely that I'll be venturing in that direction when I get the quals and hours, but I was wondering what the prospects are for an Australian in getting employed in the US. I was thinking along the lines of small freight runs or regional? What is the process in making Australian licences valid in the US? SHould I consider doing my training in the US, or just do the training down here in oz, then make my way over there?

Thanks for reading

Tristan

[Spbeyond]

The industry is really strugling in the US right now. I dont really know how much better it would be here then down there. You might be able to do better here if there really are no jobs down their. But no one is going anywhere fast. Just my 2 cents.

[Tristan]

I think the industry down here is pretty much the same as the US in terms of trends. I guess I was under the impression that it was easier to pick up a job flying twins in the US, or even flying regional for that matter.

Tristan

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

Sorry if I missed it, but are you a US citizen?

If not, are you at least a permanent resident (a green card holder)?

If still not, you'll have to get sponsored to be able to live here and apply for a work permit.


Stuff like that isn't easy. Who will sponsor you?


Of course, this is only on the lines of employment. You can still train here.

Most airlines in the US will at least stipulate something along the lines of "Legally authorized to work in the U.S.A."

I don't think ANY airline in the US will be willing to sponsor you to work here.


So you face a problem of:

1. getting sponsored
2. obtaining work permit


And I can tell you getting sponsored, getting the right to live and work here, is not easy. If it was, everybody and their mother would have already moved here to America .



Now IF you want to just come to America to train, then that's a different story, you can get a visa for that. You'll have to be vetted through TSA's screening process for aliens, as far as I know.

But as far as employment in America is concerned, see the above.

[Tristan]

No I'm not a US citizen, so I guess I would have to jump through the beuracratic hoops. WHat do you mean by getting sponsored? I guess I should talk to US embassy people about living and working in America. Are there any non-US citizens on this forum working in the US?

On a change of topic, although I'm not American, I still find this forum to be the best source of information, motivation, and support for my flying, even though I'm on the other side of the planet. The common issues that AMerican pilots face are not that different to Australia. I hope you guys don't mind having an international flavour to this forum

Take care

Tristan

[Ramsey]

There's an article in this month's AOPA Flight Training telling us U.S. pilots to seek jobs overseas because there is a lack of qualified pilots. Asia and the Middle East are worst off right now according to the article.

[adreamer]

Why don't you try Southeast Asia or China? I know there are few airlines send their "future" pilots to your direction for training. Maybe you should give them a call.

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

Originally Posted by Tristan

No I'm not a US citizen, so I guess I would have to jump through the beuracratic hoops. WHat do you mean by getting sponsored? I guess I should talk to US embassy people about living and working in America.

My friend, to live and work in America, you have to have at least a visa and a work permit.

On what basis will you apply for a work permit? Someone (either a company or an organization of some type) has to sponsor you.

You CANNOT just come to this country, walk in at JFK, and expect the right to live and work here.

Think about it. If it was literally that easy, then everyone would flood to the United States to enjoy the good life we enjoy here.

It's not about "jumping through bureacratic hoops." LEGAL immigration is a serious matter.

It's not easy. What I do know is that you are gonna need some basis to have a right to live and work here.

You can attend school as an international student on a visa, but that visa is for education purposes only. At the end of that, you must go back to your country... unless of course you're hired by a company that is willing to sponsor you. That is getting more and more rare everyday.

Some people marry a US citizen, and on that basis, you will get permanent resident status (green card). Some come here and claim political asylum, but that kind of claim has been abused a LOT. I am not saying you should do these two things, but that's the kinda stuff people do.

You will have a problem getting the right to live and work here.

How do you plan on getting sponsored here? No airline in America will sponsor you to live and work here. All of them require at least the ability to be able to work in America.

Are there any non-US citizens on this forum working in the US?

Yes, I'm sure there are.

Keep in mind though, that permanent residents are non-Us citizens, but they are green card holders. Green card holdres have the right to live AND work in the United States. I was a green card holder back in 1997, and then I became a US citizen in 2002/2003. Getting a green card is usually a precursor to getting US Citizenship.

On a change of topic, although I'm not American, I still find this forum to be the best source of information, motivation, and support for my flying, even though I'm on the other side of the planet. The common issues that AMerican pilots face are not that different to Australia. I hope you guys don't mind having an international flavour to this forum

Take care

Tristan

Doesn't matter where you're from, everyone is welcome here! Doug will second that, I'm sure.

[TXaviator]

id love to go to australia and do some bush/outback flying!!

or maybe micro/polynesia and do some awesome island hopping and such!!

wanna trade spots?

[Airdale]

Originally Posted by Cherokee_Cruiser

You CANNOT just come to this country, walk in at JFK, and expect the right to live and work here.

Think about it. If it was literally that easy, then everyone would flood to the United States to enjoy the good life we enjoy here.

What are you talking about? It happens all the time. Hell, Mexicans are running across the border everyday. And they don't have to pay taxes, medicare or any other fee's, yet they can still get free health care and the ability to sue people. Happens in New Jersey all the time. In fact, just about every gas station in New Jersey has non-citizens pumping gas and collecting your cash. Once they get their bucks, they move back to their country.

Lets not sugar coat the fact that illegal immigration, or immigration for that matter is a huge Charlie Foxtrot in the U.S. Remember a few months ago all the illegals protested demanding better treatment from the U.S. government? I think they even wanted the National Anthem in Spanish.

[wheelsup]

Originally Posted by Airdale

What are you talking about? It happens all the time. Hell, Mexicans are running across the border everyday. And they don't have to pay taxes, medicare or any other fee's, yet they can still get free health care and the ability to sue people. Happens in New Jersey all the time. In fact, just about every gas station in New Jersey has non-citizens pumping gas and collecting your cash. Once they get their bucks, they move back to their country.

Lets not sugar coat the fact that illegal immigration, or immigration for that matter is a huge Charlie Foxtrot in the U.S. Remember a few months ago all the illegals protested demanding better treatment from the U.S. government? I think they even wanted the National Anthem in Spanish.

When the airlines start putting illegals in the front seats I'm outtie...

[Dazzler]

Originally Posted by Tristan

Are there any non-US citizens on this forum working in the US?

Yup - green card holder here.
And I'm a flight instructor.
Anything's possible...

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

Originally Posted by Dazzler

Yup - green card holder here.
And I'm a flight instructor.
Anything's possible...

Well, about that "anythings possible" ......

I too used to have a green card. A green card lets you live and work in America.

So saying "anything's possible" to Tristan doesn't help.

How will he be eligible for a green card?

He needs someone to sponsor him to live here and sponsor him for a work permit.

I don't see that happening from any airline... no airline in America is going to provide a visa to sponsor someone to live and work in America.

You must already have the right to live/work in this country.

That was my point. Tristan can't just come to America and expect a green card.

What are you talking about? It happens all the time. Hell, Mexicans are running across the border everyday. And they don't have to pay taxes, medicare or any other fee's, yet they can still get free health care and the ability to sue people. Happens in New Jersey all the time. In fact, just about every gas station in New Jersey has non-citizens pumping gas and collecting your cash. Once they get their bucks, they move back to their country.

Lets not sugar coat the fact that illegal immigration, or immigration for that matter is a huge Charlie Foxtrot in the U.S. Remember a few months ago all the illegals protested demanding better treatment from the U.S. government? I think they even wanted the National Anthem in Spanish.

You're right, illegal Mexicans are here by the millions probably.

But you cannot work at an airline as a pilot by being an illegal immigrant.


So that option is out for Tristan.

[riot shields]

so much for the "land of opportunities"

[wheelsup]

There are a few CFI's with green cards that I met. A few were at Riddle and one was at my school in New Jersey. They were basically stuck in their CFI jobs for YEARS. The ones at Riddle probably had it OK - as senior guys they are making $35k or so.

Qantas requires 500 TT - how much time do you need to build? I was born outside Penrith.

[PWMURPHY]

China and India are certainly a much easier prospect in terms of getting a work visa. Our company has no problem getting any pilot from just about any ICAO country what is essentially the same thing as a "green card" in the US. But you must be sponsored by an employer.

However, both the life and flying are tougher in Asia than in Australia or the USA. If you are considering Asia, I'd suggest taking an extended trip through there to visit not only the countries but some flight school locations to see what life is like. Get outside the major cities and see what life for an expat flight instructor would be like. Later, if you decide to fly for an airline, you may be able to live more of an "international" life in a major city.

Pat Murphy

[BrettInLJ]

My sim partner here at a regional is a foriegn citizen. He instructed in California to get the hours. There was several months delay at the airline because of the TSA process and class dates getting rescheduled, but he is living proof that it is doable.

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

Originally Posted by BrettInLJ

My sim partner here at a regional is a foriegn citizen. He instructed in California to get the hours. There was several months delay at the airline because of the TSA process and class dates getting rescheduled, but he is living proof that it is doable.

A green card holder is still a foreign citizen. You are not a US citizen at that point.

Your friend either,
1. has a green card, or
2. got sponsored by someone/organization for the right to live/work here.

[deserteaglle]

Come to Texas to go to school, chicks dig the accent, find one to get yourself hitched to and then you're good.










Don't ask me how I know chicks dig the accent...ok yeah, go ahead and ask.lol

[Tristan]

You all raise good points regarding US employment. I would tend to go for the Asian option, as I speak Chinese and I've already lived there (CHina) for 2 years. It would be awesome to incorporate my Chinese background (uni major) with flying. I was contemplating instructing over there, I've already read a post on instructing in China. I'm not sure how the Chinese would see ozzy instructors, but I know that their major flag carriers send their cadets to Jandakot in Perth. The way I see it, the industry in China is just gonna get bigger, pretty much all their airlines have brand new boeing/airbus jets, and they have been forced to hire Western pilots to meed the demand.

But it's not all strawberries and cream, there are many challenges when living in CHina, especially as a foreigner. I guess it all depends on what sort of person you are, and what ticks you. But I think if I'm doing something over there that I really love doing, then living in China would be a satisfying adventure.

Take care

Tristan

[Tristan]

Originally Posted by wheelsup

There are a few CFI's with green cards that I met. A few were at Riddle and one was at my school in New Jersey. They were basically stuck in their CFI jobs for YEARS. The ones at Riddle probably had it OK - as senior guys they are making $35k or so.

Qantas requires 500 TT - how much time do you need to build? I was born outside Penrith.

Wheelsup, are you Australian? How did you make your way to America? Yes, Qantas require 500TT, but me thinks the reality differs somewhat.

[adreamer]

There are a few CFI's with green cards that I met. A few were at Riddle and one was at my school in New Jersey. They were basically stuck in their CFI jobs for YEARS

I am one of those CFIs w/ a green card. That is not good to hear. However, I finally start my citizenship application process.

Qantas requires 500 TT

maybe I should go over there.

[AngelFuree]

Originally Posted by adreamer

I am one of those CFIs w/ a green card. That is not good to hear. However, I finally start my citizenship application process.

maybe I should go over there.

Hmm...so you guys are saying that it's harder to get a job if you only have a green card....? hmmmm..............

Could anyone else clarify this? It doesn't sound logical since the green card allows you to do everything a citizen would, except vote. I had never heard of something like this.

[wheelsup]

Originally Posted by Tristan

Wheelsup, are you Australian? How did you make your way to America? Yes, Qantas require 500TT, but me thinks the reality differs somewhat.

Parents were US citizens. My father was in the Air Force and stationed over there when I was born. I've heard conflicting reports if I am in fact a dual citizen or not because I was born on AU soil, but to US parents.

At a former CFI job I had a co-worker who was from New Zealand. He's now at Skywest (a US regional). No idea how he got to the US, but he did get here. Your biggest hurdle will be getting a company to sponsor you I think, especially as a CFI, but it DOES happen. I've seen that first hand. As far as regionals go, I don't believe any will sponsor you. You already have to have the right to work in the US.

If the conversion from FAA to Australian licenses wasn't so expensive I would be done there right now doing it! I've heard of some RJ FO's leaving their jobs here for Qantas, I have yet to get in touch with any of them first hand though.