Trans-Atlantic Terror Threat Busted

[CapnJim]

Hey, RPM, relax man. Just be grateful they haven't resorted to hiding bombs up their ass.

[kellwolf]

Heh, then what would they ban?

Here's the main point: okay, so someone has a liquid explosive they are planning on detonating in a suicide bomberish way. Oh no, now they have to check their bag! Plot foiled? Nope. It's on a timer, so the bomb STILL goes off and the plane STILL explodes. 100% positive bag match would deter people NOT suicide bombers, if we had that anymore. Now that all bags are "screened," you can pull a passenger and let his/her bag go on their merry way (unless it's int'l). TSA has said the reason for the ban is that they have no way of detecting the liquid explosives. Do they magically have a way of detecting it if your bag is checked instead of carried on?

I'm cool with a TEMPORARY ban on this stuff as long as they are working on a new detection system. Otherwise, it's a cop out to keep them from having to do their jobs. They're passing the buck to the general public to more or less keep themselves safe instead of taking some initiative. What security breakthroughs have we had since TSA was implemented? What screening techniques beyond banning certain items are different than pre-9/11? The "bomb sniffing" machine that doesn't work most of the time? A little air puff gate to walk through? The only major difference I see is the matching uniforms.

No one has mentioned the whole profiling thing, either. Certainly wouldn't have worked in this instance seeing as none of them were Arabic.

[Bandit_Driver]

Originally Posted by kellwolf

Do they magically have a way of detecting it if your bag is checked instead of carried on?

Kell, as I understand it. Liquid explosives consist of two parts that need to be mixed, prior to detonation. Checking the bags in the cargo bin prevent the terrorist from mixing the cocktail in the lav.

I would imagine the screening of checked bags would be able to detect any mechanical detonator and/or means of automatically mixing the liquids..

They still allow liquid meds past TSA though. So they are assuming terrorists wouldn't hide it in a medical bottle

$.02

[surreal1221]

Originally Posted by kellwolf

No one has mentioned the whole profiling thing, either. Certainly wouldn't have worked in this instance seeing as none of them were Arabic.

hahah. . .

I hope I can be your FO one of these days. I like the way you think Kell.

[Maximillian_Jenius]

Originally Posted by surreal1221

hahah. . .

I hope I can be your FO one of these days. I like the way you think Kell.

But he pre-judges people. Example:

Las Vegas 2004 Hawthorne hotel.

Were both at the check in counter Kell is there with his wife. I announce to the counter guy that I was in Vegas for the Jetcareers convention.

Kells immediately turns around and says.

"Hi my name is Steve,Kellwolf from Jetcareers this is my wife Nessa."

I say. "Hi my name is Matthew,Maximillian_Jenius on the board."

He looks me up and down and says "yeaaaaah I had you pegged as Max before you said so....lol!"

[Kristie]

well, remember max.. before that big blowout, you had your photo as your avatar!!

[Maximillian_Jenius]

Originally Posted by Kristie

well, remember max.. before that big blowout, you had your photo as your avatar!!

Lol...true. I just like teasing Steve bout it.

[B767]

Originally Posted by kellwolf

I'm cool with a TEMPORARY ban on this stuff as long as they are working on a new detection system.

No one has mentioned the whole profiling thing, either. Certainly wouldn't have worked in this instance seeing as none of them were Arabic.

There was an article in the NYT about two separate companies that have been working on devices tht can detect liquid explosives. One is just like the metal detector you walk through, which would just be another machine your bag has to go through after the e-ray one. The other device is something that can be installed in the x-ray machines that examine the pixels or something like that and can match certain pixels to certain explosives. One of them was being tested at 30 U.S airports and I believe the other was for the defense department, but hopefully will become common at airports.

Lastly, I read where something like 20 of the suspects were of Pakistani decent. Not trying to press the issue, just what I read.

[TheShortOne]

um, pakistanis aren't arabic. They're pakistani. look more like indians than middle eastern

[Maximillian_Jenius]

Originally Posted by TheShortOne

um, pakistanis aren't arabic. They're pakistani. look more like indians than middle eastern

Oh but c'mon Em you know all those dark skinned people all look alike more especially with their hethen religion!!!

[B767]

It's still a common profile non-the-less. What percent of America do you think can actually tell the difference between Indians, Pakistani's, and Arab's? My guess is not very many. The only way most people will be able to tell the difference is because Arab women wear garments to cover their face and the men wear them on their head.

[Maximillian_Jenius]

Originally Posted by B767

It's still a common profile non-the-less. What percent of America do you think can actually tell the difference between Indians, Pakistani's, and Arab's? My guess is not very many. The only way most people will be able to tell the difference is because Arab women wear garments to cover their face and the men wear them on their head.

Wrong again. Because there are Indians (from India) who belong to a religion called Sheiks (sp) that wear religious garb that can be misconstrued as muslim but you'd be wrong.

This is why education is such an important thing and we Americans need to get out of our american centralized world perspective and actully become more informed bout other cultures and the world around us. And not just how the world is protrayed to us americans on the evening news.

[TheShortOne]

Originally Posted by Maximillian_Jenius

Wrong again. Because there are Indians (from India) who belong to a religion called Sheiks (sp) that wear religious garb that can be misconstrued as muslim but you'd be wrong.

This is why education is such an important thing and we Americans need to get out of our american centralized world perspective and actully become more informed bout other cultures and the world around us. And not just how the world is protrayed to us americans on the evening news.

damn dude. have you been reading my anthro books again?? you totally sound like me. yeah!!! it's nice to know all my blathering on here hasn't fallen completely on deaf ears

[kellwolf]

I wonder if all this profiling stuff would still be being pushed if the 9/11 hijackers had been from the IRA. Then all white people would have to be profiled.....

I doubt most Americans can tell the difference b/w Chinese and Japanese. Plus, it's not like all Arabs/Pakistanis/Indians are Muslim. That would be like pointing to a random American and saying "You're Methodist."

[Maximillian_Jenius]

Originally Posted by TheShortOne

damn dude. have you been reading my anthro books again?? you totally sound like me. yeah!!! it's nice to know all my blathering on here hasn't fallen completely on deaf ears

Lol...actually I know ALOT of anthro majors. My best friends mom growing up had a masters in Anthro and was studying for her PH.D. Her passion was primates and thats how I found out about the bisexualality of the Bonobo's.

That and alot of gays seem to pick anthro as a major at least the ones I know. Perhaps it makes gives them something to better understand and counter the bible thumpers who claim their lifestyle is wrong.

But definately you JH and others words have rubbed off on me. I soak up alot of info here on JC. Might joke around alot and be sarcastic a bit but I'm always listening and learning!

[B767]

Originally Posted by Maximillian_Jenius

Wrong again. Because there are Indians (from India) who belong to a religion called Sheiks (sp) that wear religious garb that can be misconstrued as muslim but you'd be wrong.

Which is what I'm trying to say. I'm not big in to religion but have learned a lot as my english teacher was really in to it and almost everything we read she somehow related it to one religion or another (I rarely saw it...but I'm horrible when it comes to literature). MOST (maybe an exageration) Americans view all middle-easterners as the same. They all "look alike" and things like that. Just like the majority would probably not be able to tell the difference between Chinese, Japanese, and Koreans, like Kell said. I have no idea why the whole profiling thing is going on, but I assume it's because of the media that most people usually tend to believe because it's on the TV which gives it some degree of reliability I guess? I think both Max and Short One should become teachers .

Sorry to hijack the thread.

[TheShortOne]

i would love to become a college professor - but i have issues with writing books/long papers etc (as in, I hate to do it) I like to talk about this stuff but I can't stand writing about it

[n57flyguy]

Originally Posted by Ripper3785

What, the 'fact points' on your three conspiracy theory websites? Give me a break. Your opinion is exactly that, and worth $.02. Same as mine.

All I'm saying is that Ive been researching the facts for months. When I first heard this stuff I thought it was outragous to think, then I said, okay let me prove it wrong. So Ive looked intently at both sides of the story and to me the 'conspircy' side makes sense to where its all pointing and the big picture. Dont take it from me, look it up your self, and there is my $0.02 opinion for you.

[n57flyguy]

Originally Posted by Maximillian_Jenius

Welcome back buuuuuudy!

thx

[Doug Taylor]

Originally Posted by B767

It's still a common profile non-the-less. What percent of America do you think can actually tell the difference between Indians, Pakistani's, and Arab's? My guess is not very many. The only way most people will be able to tell the difference is because Arab women wear garments to cover their face and the men wear them on their head.

Woo! Where to start with this one?

[jtrain609]

Originally Posted by Doug Taylor

Woo! Where to start with this one?

Dunno, might want to tell him that women cover their hair and the dudes wearing the things on their heads are normally Hindi.

But hey that's just a guess!

[WestIndian425]

Originally Posted by kellwolf

I wonder if all this profiling stuff would still be being pushed if the 9/11 hijackers had been from the IRA. Then all white people would have to be profiled.....

I doubt most Americans can tell the difference b/w Chinese and Japanese. Plus, it's not like all Arabs/Pakistanis/Indians are Muslim. That would be like pointing to a random American and saying "You're Methodist."

I doubt there would be any general profiling if it was the IRA. It's easier when it's something we know little about to start the generalizations.

I'll be a bible thumper and take two verses out of the bible that says "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge" and "In all your getting, get understanding".

Neil

[Fly777bigBIRD]

travel now just seems to piss me off now.....why?
there is no more freedom in traveling and flying. Man i can't even bring anything nowadays. crap.

[tonyw]

Originally Posted by Champcar

So lets forget about security becasue $30 of makeup is so much more important. Wow our priorities are still the same.

You tell me how this makes us any more secure, Champcar. When all you have to do is check the same stuff in the belly of the plane and then have it detonate down there, how the hell is that safer?

You have said before that you don't have the education nor knowledge of various subjects. And you act as if that's totally cool with you.

Well, you're doing it again.

Anyway, this is just stupid. And guess who will be the MOST inconvenienced? The people who pay the freight, the business travellers.

Business travellers HATE checking bags. They want to roll onto the plane, roll off it, and go where they need to. Asking them to check bags is one hell of a way to piss them off.

And so now, instead of taking ten trips a quarter, they'll take seven. Keep in mind that their ten trips probably run, oh, about ten grand versus ten trips from Aunt Bessie that run about three grand. So, by pissing them off, you just lost the equivalent of an Aunt Bessie's full year's travels EVERY SINGLE QUARTER!

You tell me how that helps keep your airline in the black.

[kellwolf]

Or they'll just charter.....