Shooting Aboard An AAL Flight . . .

[Doug Taylor]

Originally Posted by pkrgod

BTW, what is "Cherokee and Fly Chicaga?"

Two users?

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

Who be talkin' 'bout me ?

[tonyw]

Originally Posted by Philip

yeah, why... I'd much rather see them blow up an airplane than get blasted by an air marshall

Except he didn't have a bomb.

And I'm with Lloyd. If the FAMs never had to fire their weapons, that would be fine by me. We have never launched our nukes, and I hope we never do, but you can't tell me they don't serve as a deterrent!

[Maximillian_Jenius]

Originally Posted by pkrgod

I dont see a problem with racial profiling. There is a much greater percent chance of a terrorist being middle eastern and muslim than any other group of person (just look at all the terrorists in Iraq and Afghanistan). Its still a small percent, but it seems foolish to me to not pay extra attention to these types of people as they are passing through security checks.

gaaaawwwww? Some of you people just don't get it do you? Furthermore you'd be singing a different song if you were the constant subject of said profiling. So you find it soooooo easy to say sure screen all those Arabs.
I might remind you of points made on this topic in a thread in the lav. About all those blone/blue jihadist ready and willing to blow themselfes up and anyone near them who don't fit the profile of so called islamic terrorist.
Lastly...as I mentioned previously. Terrorist look for holes or cracks in a society. So with an establish profile in effect the current government profile isn't accurate. More especially now since women are now actively being recruited as suicide bombers.

-Matthew

[tonyw]

Originally Posted by pkrgod

They may be from Saudi Arabia, but end up in Iraq or Afghanistan eventually. Like I said, terrorsits are typically middle eastern, regardless. No offense to you. The way I see it is if the odds are in your favor, you are a sucker for not exploiting that and will pay for it eventually if you dont.

Yep, that Tim McVeigh. Musta come from Saudi Arabia.

And yep, that Belgian woman who pulled off a suicide bombing in Iraq sure looked like a "middle Eastern male."

Nobody's ever been able to tell me what a "middle Eastern male" looks like. Folks, before you start ranting about Muslim extremists, do me a favor. Tell me what the country with the highest Muslim population is. And then tell me if they look like "middle Eastern males."

I tell you what, man. I know a guy who's helping fight the terrorists who looks like a "middle Eastern male." Maybe we should pull him off the front lines. We'd lose a hell of a pilot if we did that.

[pkrgod]

I didnt say focus only on middle easterns and nobody else, that would be more foolish. But saying you are going to scan an equal percent of all people is ridiculous, when there is a known profile of a typical terrorist. If there is a higher percent chance of a terrorist being from that decent, based on populations in the world, why wouldnt you scan a higher percent of people fitting that classification?????? And I would be extremely suprised if we werent doing this already, but making info like that public would only raise ridiculous arguments like we've seen on this board and would give terrorists something to try and get around.

Whos to say Im not Arab??

[BCTAv8r]

Why don't the FAMs use non-lethal bullets? It would be enough to disabillitate the terrorist but not enough to kill him. That way if the person is not really a threat the person doesn't get killed for nothing.

[Maximillian_Jenius]

Originally Posted by tonyw

Tell me what the country with the highest Muslim population is.

Tony...would that be Indonisia?

-Matthew

[Callous]

A quote "Son, we live in a world that has walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. Whose gonna do it? You?" From A Few Good Men.

It will be me, and others like me who have taken the oath, who will stand the wall. However, I cannot protect you from yourselves.

[Bigey]

Originally Posted by pkrgod

They may be from Saudi Arabia, but end up in Iraq or Afghanistan eventually. Like I said, terrorsits are typically middle eastern, regardless. No offense to you. The way I see it is if the odds are in your favor, you are a sucker for not exploiting that and will pay for it eventually if you dont.

Goddang you are the most ignorant person i've talked to!

"No offense, your kind is typically terrorists."

Man...Wow im really shocked. I hope you never attend a JC meet or something, cuz you'll be unwelcomed like no other.

I've learned though, let the dumbasses be just that, dumb and asses and it's not like you can help it, you just are. Keep up the goodwork.

How old are you, honestly?

Here how about a lil "terrorist talk:"
Moder Ghendeh! Khaley devooneh! Khaley coongoshadee!

[Callous]

Bigey, this isn't about you specifically. It is not about Middle Eastern men specifically. It's about terrorists specifically, and having the political will to realize that certain people are more likely subscribe to a set of beliefs than others. Without some model, everyone is a suspect, and we get a police state.

I have to take my shoes off at the airport just like all the other (potential)terrorists, I'm a WASP, and they didn't cut me any slack.

[Bigey]

Originally Posted by Callous

Bigey, this isn't about you specifically. It is not about Middle Eastern men specifically. It's about terrorists specifically, and having the political will to realize that certain people are more likely subscribe to a set of beliefs than others. Without some model, everyone is a suspect, and we get a police state.

I have to take my shoes off at the airport just like all the other (potential)terrorists, I'm a WASP, and they didn't cut me any slack.

Well just because i quoted one thing, it's because Mathew already quoted the other part of what he said.

[Bigey]

Originally Posted by Callous

Bigey, this isn't about you specifically. It is not about Middle Eastern men specifically. It's about terrorists specifically, and having the political will to realize that certain people are more likely subscribe to a set of beliefs than others. Without some model, everyone is a suspect, and we get a police state.

I have to take my shoes off at the airport just like all the other (potential)terrorists, I'm a WASP, and they didn't cut me any slack.

Also, why cant we keep that? Everyone a suspect? Just recently that american women blew herself up in iraq. Now if we keep with the idea of keeping middle easterns the "general" model then she could of been on an airplane or such.

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

Ordinarily, I would jump in here and start blasting away.

However, one of my pre-new year resolutions includes "not debating anything political or religious in any forums."

So, the "new and improved me" will offer no comment on this topic.

[Bigey]

Originally Posted by Cherokee_Cruiser

Ordinarily, I would jump in here and start blasting away.

However, one of my pre-new year resolutions includes "not debating anything political or religious in any forums."

So, the "new and improved me" will offer no comment on this topic.

You know what, that's a good idea.

Done here too.

[Maximillian_Jenius]

Originally Posted by Callous

I have to take my shoes off at the airport just like all the other (potential)terrorists, I'm a WASP, and they didn't cut me any slack.

Well as a WASP why are you even talking about it. Because as a WASP you should know that if you don't talk about a problem it doesn't exist. Continue to ignore the huge elephant in the room!



-Matthew

[shooter13]

Seems to me some profiling is in order.

I don't think we should profile middle eastern decent to the exclusion of all others. I don't even think we should publicize that profiling is happening. But I know from my brother who is a cop that profiling does in fact help them solve crimes and catch criminals. Does it help them catch everyone? no. It is simply a tool that can be used to narrow a focus. I understand I am not a member of the group that would be profiled in this case though my political views and comments I have made elsewhere should cause me the extra look but if you watch the videos sent out by Al Queda, it does seem like the majority of the wanna-be killers are young men of Middle-Eastern decent. It is foolish to search 80 year old blue hair ladies.

Lastly, there is a correction needed to a post by TonyW.

"We have never launched our nukes" No but we dropped them from an airplane."

[tonyw]

I'm all for TRUE profiling, based on behavior of a person, history of that person, and so on.

But racial profiling? Actually ethnic profiling in this case, because "middle Eastern males" are white.

Stoopid.

Easily defeated.

All they do is get someone who looks like the woman on the front page of this paper.



That woman on the front of that paper is a suicide bomber. Sure doesn't look like a "middle Eastern male" to me. Focus too much on those "middle Eastern males," and boom, airplane blown up. Kinda like those women in Chechnya. Betcha they didn't look like "middle Eastern males."

And Max, you get the kewpie doll. The country with the highest Muslim population is Indonesia. They've got problems with Muslim extremists as well -- Bali ring a bell, folks?

And I guaran-damn-tee you they don't look like "middle Eastern males."

Shooter, the nukes I was talking about were the nukes we built up as a deterrent to the Soviet Union. We have never launched those, and I hope to God we never do. But nobody can say they are not a very effective deterrent. In fact, I'd say one of the reasons why we have terrorism is because people know that messing with the United States means they'll get their ass whipped, be it through the use of conventional or nuclear weapons.

[Maximillian_Jenius]

Originally Posted by tonyw

And Max, you get the kewpie doll. The country with the highest Muslim population is Indonesia. They've got problems with Muslim extremists as well -- Bali ring a bell, folks?

Thanks...I figured it was. I watch the NBC Nightly News & CBS World News every night. I liked to stay informed about whats going on in my world.

-Matthew

[SteveC]

Well, which one is it? This:

Originally Posted by Maximillian_Jenius

I watch the NBC Nightly News & CBS World News every night.

or this:

I liked to stay informed about whats going on in my world.

You can't have it both ways.

[pkrgod]

Originally Posted by Bigey

Goddang you are the most ignorant person i've talked to!

"No offense, your kind is typically terrorists."

Man...Wow im really shocked. I hope you never attend a JC meet or something, cuz you'll be unwelcomed like no other.

I've learned though, let the dumbasses be just that, dumb and asses and it's not like you can help it, you just are. Keep up the goodwork.

How old are you, honestly?

Here how about a lil "terrorist talk:"
Moder Ghendeh! Khaley devooneh! Khaley coongoshadee!

This is your argument against me stating the fact that terrorsists are typically middle eastern????? Read what Im saying, dont just get offended automatically because you dont agree. Maybe if you read shooter13's post you will understand better, he has the same views. I dont think you can ask me how old I am when you are only 15 and making immature arguments like this!!!

I wasnt saying to screen only middle eastern males. The CIA is constantly gethering information that Im sure tracks recent recruiting trends of terrorists and Im saying that data should be used to screen a higher percent of those people, although not exclusively.

Next time you dont agree with something justify your thoughts, dont just blow up.

[tonyw]

Originally Posted by pkrgod

This is your argument against me stating the fact that terrorsists are typically middle eastern?????

You continue to insist this despite several posts pointing out how flawed this argument is. Indonesians aren't "middle Eastern." A Belgian woman isn't "middle Eastern." Nor are Chechyns. Nor are Serbs. Nor are people like McVeigh. Nor are the folks who released poison gas in the Japanese subway. Nor is the IRA, or the Basque separtists.

[pkrgod]

Originally Posted by tonyw

You continue to insist this despite several posts pointing out how flawed this argument is. Indonesians aren't "middle Eastern." A Belgian woman isn't "middle Eastern." Nor are Chechyns. Nor are Serbs. Nor are people like McVeigh. Nor are the folks who released poison gas in the Japanese subway. Nor is the IRA, or the Basque separtists.

Ok.... Whats your point?? You have a handful of examples. Now if we look at the numbers of all terrorist attacks over the last 5 years what type of person do you think is going to be shown to carry out a majority of those attacks? Like I said before, Im sure the CIA has the intelligence to help narrow down the scope for security checks and implement some sort of profiling. Im not saying middle easterns should be screened and nobody else. But, I would be shocked to learn that their intelligence has determined my great grandma is just as likely to perform a terrorist attack as a young middle eastern male.

[Chris_Ford]

Originally Posted by tonyw

You continue to insist this despite several posts pointing out how flawed this argument is. Indonesians aren't "middle Eastern." A Belgian woman isn't "middle Eastern." Nor are Chechyns. Nor are Serbs. Nor are people like McVeigh. Nor are the folks who released poison gas in the Japanese subway. Nor is the IRA, or the Basque separtists.

Okay, I'm not defending anyone's viewpoint, but I think that a clarification needs to be made:

Those saying "most terrorists are Middle Eastern" are looking at it semi-US-centrically [too many hyphens!]

Chechens aren't engaging the US. Nor are Serbs. Aum Shinrikyo poisoned the subway in Tokyo for publicity to their group (...sort of, in an effort to make their leader king...). The IRA was a domestic terroist group, as are Basque separatists. One Belgium woman does not void the fact that, if you look at the statistics, a convincing majority of terrorists involved in terrorist attacks against US interests have been from the Middle East.

What they're trying to say is sorta like: A Square is a rhombus, but a rhombus isn't necessarily a square.

/not justifying what anyone said, just offering clarification

[Maximillian_Jenius]

Originally Posted by SteveC

Well, which one is it? This: or this:

You can't have it both ways.

Can too have it both ways....I just have my b.s. meter up and running the whole broadcast.



-Matthew