Logging time

CaliforniaSurfer · February 12th, 2005, 00:33

You are a private pilot ASEL on an IFR training flight in a C-172 with your CFII and you are IMC most of the flight, can the student log PIC?

We were kicking that one around the flight center today.

Also, you're a private pilot ASEL and you begin training for your complex endorsement. Can you log PIC on those training flights in the RG?

Surf

av8rmsu · February 12th, 2005, 00:40

[ QUOTE ]
You are a private pilot ASEL on an IFR training flight in a C-172 with your CFII and you are IMC most of the flight, can the student log PIC?

We were kicking that one around the flight center today.

Also, you're a private pilot ASEL and you begin training for your complex endorsement. Can you log PIC on those training flights in the RG?

Surf

[/ QUOTE ]

the first question .... absolutely

the second question ... no ... not rated for the aircraft... it's dual received

Windchill · February 12th, 2005, 00:42

To my knowledge (sorry, don't have any Reg books handy),

A: Yes

B: No

A: Yes because you are rated to fly that aircraft, and if you are piloting (operating the controls), you can log PIC, but so can your instructor because as the only IR pilot on board, he/she is "acting" PIC.

B: No, because you are not rated/endorsed/etc for the aircraft you are flying.

I'll try to look up the regs online ... in the mean time ... please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong in the interests of correct information.

GaTechKid · February 12th, 2005, 02:00

The answer to both questions is Yes. The solution is reading the regs and understanding the difference between logging PIC and acting as PIC.

As a private pilot with an ASEL rating you are rated for a Cessna 182 RG, therefore you can log PIC as the sole manipulator. However you must be complex endorsed in order to act as PIC, and this is why you must receive complex instruction before you can operate a complex airplane.

WIPilot · February 12th, 2005, 02:33

[ QUOTE ]
The answer to both questions is Yes. The solution is reading the regs and understanding the difference between logging PIC and acting as PIC.

As a private pilot with an ASEL rating you are rated for a Cessna 182 RG, therefore you can log PIC as the sole manipulator. However you must be complex endorsed in order to act as PIC, and this is why you must receive complex instruction before you can operate a complex airplane.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree. I was advised (and did) log both by all of the flight instructors I have talked with at my school about this.

Josh · February 12th, 2005, 02:54

Yes to both.

Heck, fly into a cloud on accident, you log it as PIC as well. IMC or VMC you log it if you are the solo manipulator of a SEL aircraft (unless a type rating is required, and I'm not aware of any 172 that requires a type

).

You are rated, SEL.
An endorsement is not a rating.

mtsu_av8er · February 12th, 2005, 15:02

[ QUOTE ]

You are rated, SEL.
An endorsement is not a rating.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah.

jawright · February 12th, 2005, 19:57

I certainly hope the answer to question #1 is "yes" because I've done it. It was a good experience while working on my private to see what actual IMC is like, both as a "preview" to instrument training/flying and as a lesson in why NOT to fly VFR into instrument conditions!
(sigh) Now if only I could raise the funds to finish my private so I can start learning to fly in IMC that would be great. Feel free to send donations....

MidlifeFlyer · February 12th, 2005, 20:23

[ QUOTE ]
You are a private pilot ASEL on an IFR training flight in a C-172 with your CFII and you are IMC most of the flight, can the student log PIC?

[/ QUOTE ]Yes. Absolutely. Anyone who says "no" doesn't understand the rule.

[ QUOTE ]
Also, you're a private pilot ASEL and you begin training for your complex endorsement. Can you log PIC on those training flights in the RG?

[/ QUOTE ]Yes. Absolutely. Anyone who says "no" doesn't understand the rule.

See Rule 1 in my PIC Logging FAQ. http://www.midlifeflight.com/faq/faq.php?s=2#3

To the extent that the answer to either of these wasn't clear at some time, the FAA Chief Counsel's office removed all doubt about 25 years ago.

February 12th, 2005, 00:40	#2
av8rmsu Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Pickwick Lake Posts: 448	Re: Logging time [ QUOTE ] You are a private pilot ASEL on an IFR training flight in a C-172 with your CFII and you are IMC most of the flight, can the student log PIC? We were kicking that one around the flight center today. Also, you're a private pilot ASEL and you begin training for your complex endorsement. Can you log PIC on those training flights in the RG? Surf [/ QUOTE ] the first question .... absolutely the second question ... no ... not rated for the aircraft... it's dual received

February 12th, 2005, 02:00	#4
GaTechKid Old Skool Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Frigid NWA Hub Posts: 1,882	Re: Logging time The answer to both questions is Yes. The solution is reading the regs and understanding the difference between logging PIC and acting as PIC. As a private pilot with an ASEL rating you are rated for a Cessna 182 RG, therefore you can log PIC as the sole manipulator. However you must be complex endorsed in order to act as PIC, and this is why you must receive complex instruction before you can operate a complex airplane.

February 12th, 2005, 02:33	#5
WIPilot Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: DTW Posts: 115	Re: Logging time [ QUOTE ] The answer to both questions is Yes. The solution is reading the regs and understanding the difference between logging PIC and acting as PIC. As a private pilot with an ASEL rating you are rated for a Cessna 182 RG, therefore you can log PIC as the sole manipulator. However you must be complex endorsed in order to act as PIC, and this is why you must receive complex instruction before you can operate a complex airplane. [/ QUOTE ] I agree. I was advised (and did) log both by all of the flight instructors I have talked with at my school about this.

February 12th, 2005, 02:54	#6
Josh Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Santa Cruz, California Posts: 686	Re: Logging time Yes to both. Heck, fly into a cloud on accident, you log it as PIC as well. IMC or VMC you log it if you are the solo manipulator of a SEL aircraft (unless a type rating is required, and I'm not aware of any 172 that requires a type ). You are rated, SEL. An endorsement is not a rating.

February 12th, 2005, 15:02	#7
mtsu_av8er Old Skool Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Utopia Posts: 12,403	Re: Logging time [ QUOTE ] You are rated, SEL. An endorsement is not a rating. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah.

February 12th, 2005, 00:33	#1
CaliforniaSurfer Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: SoCal Posts: 296	Logging time You are a private pilot ASEL on an IFR training flight in a C-172 with your CFII and you are IMC most of the flight, can the student log PIC? We were kicking that one around the flight center today. Also, you're a private pilot ASEL and you begin training for your complex endorsement. Can you log PIC on those training flights in the RG? Surf

February 12th, 2005, 00:42	#3
Windchill Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Mid-Atlantic, KMRB Posts: 1,925	Re: Logging time To my knowledge (sorry, don't have any Reg books handy), A: Yes B: No A: Yes because you are rated to fly that aircraft, and if you are piloting (operating the controls), you can log PIC, but so can your instructor because as the only IR pilot on board, he/she is "acting" PIC. B: No, because you are not rated/endorsed/etc for the aircraft you are flying. I'll try to look up the regs online ... in the mean time ... please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong in the interests of correct information.

February 12th, 2005, 19:57	#8
jawright Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: in search of the elusive "BowieGoat." Posts: 422	Re: Logging time I certainly hope the answer to question #1 is "yes" because I've done it. It was a good experience while working on my private to see what actual IMC is like, both as a "preview" to instrument training/flying and as a lesson in why NOT to fly VFR into instrument conditions! (sigh) Now if only I could raise the funds to finish my private so I can start learning to fly in IMC that would be great. Feel free to send donations....

February 12th, 2005, 20:23	#9
MidlifeFlyer Old Skool Join Date: May 2003 Location: Denver Colorado Posts: 2,918	Re: Logging time [ QUOTE ] You are a private pilot ASEL on an IFR training flight in a C-172 with your CFII and you are IMC most of the flight, can the student log PIC? [/ QUOTE ]Yes. Absolutely. Anyone who says "no" doesn't understand the rule. [ QUOTE ] Also, you're a private pilot ASEL and you begin training for your complex endorsement. Can you log PIC on those training flights in the RG? [/ QUOTE ]Yes. Absolutely. Anyone who says "no" doesn't understand the rule. See Rule 1 in my PIC Logging FAQ. http://www.midlifeflight.com/faq/faq.php?s=2#3 To the extent that the answer to either of these wasn't clear at some time, the FAA Chief Counsel's office removed all doubt about 25 years ago.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode