CRJ 200 VS ERJ 145 Project

[aphilbin]

Hello All,

I am currently working on a project for my CRJ 200 systems class at the University of North Dakota. I am looking for any opinions from pilots who currently fly the ERJ 145 on how the aircraft performs in flight. I am looking for the common problems that you have experienced with the aircraft i.e. on the CRJ 200 it is the general consensus amongst pilots of the aircraft that it is underpowered for its size and that it is difficult to land smoothly. Also an opinion of an individual who has flown both aircraft would be great. Any other interesting information that can be offered on the ERJ 145 would be fantastic.

Thanks for the help,

Andrew Philbin

[FL270]

Well I haven't flown the CRJ but I can comment on the ERJ. Overall it is a great airplane to fly ... solid and stable, and the systems are very straightforward. Decent landings aren't too hard to come by.

My complaints are speed ... .80 or .82 would be nice instead of an Mmo of .78. Would love to see FL410 instead of our current FL370 ceiling. The cockpit temperature seems always to be roasting or freezing. The speed for extending flaps from 22 to 45 is VERY low (145 kts) and also very close to typical approach speeds (125-140 kts dependent on weight). Also a mild annoyance is the need to trim immediately after rotation ... "unstick" trim settings are significantly more nose-up than typically required in the climb.

Those minor gripes aside, it is an outstanding airplane.

[Doug Taylor]

How's the cockpit noise level? I jumpseated a CRJ and I wanted to give myself a 'cyanide snack' because my ears hurt. I guess I'm spoiled in the whisper-quiet -88.

[Kingairer]

ERJ is louder Doug, but it gets quiter everyday...

[DE727UPS]

"Would love to see FL410 instead of our current FL370 ceiling"

Ummm....that's what those Pinnacle guys thought. I think I'd be happy at 370.

[Doug Taylor]

When I first got into flying jets, the APU noise would drive me crazy during walkarounds. But it's not so loud anymore. Hmmm...

Flying has wrecked my hearing, primarily the reason why I preach about getting a quality headset no matter the cost. A el cheapo $120 headset is probably going to end up costing you thousands in audiologist visits and even a lost medical.

[aphilbin]

Hey guys thanks very much for the info....anyone have any other interesting facts on the ERJ that is what the presentation is on

[Axialflow]

I fly the CRJ-200 and I love it. I think it is a good marriage between pilot knowledge and mx systems - simplistic for a complicated piece of machinery. When landing the aircraft a smooth landing can be achieved .......or not .... no more than any other aircraft I presume.
I hear however on the ERJ that the brakes are electric and I don't know about you but I don't feel that comfortable about asking a computer if I can use the brakes.

[Kingairer]

[ QUOTE ]
I hear however on the ERJ that the brakes are electric and I don't know about you but I don't feel that comfortable about asking a computer if I can use the brakes.


[/ QUOTE ]

Im "sure" there are simlar systems on the CRJ. The brakes are electrically commanded and montoired but the brakes are hydraulic. Its hard to find many systems in modern airplanes that arent operated in this way. An electric command goes to something (applicable control Unit) and then another source, or simlar source actually does the work.

[FL270]

Yes, the brake control unit is electric ... it sends out commands based on pedal input to apply pressure to the hydraulically actuated brakes. Should there be a total failure of this system, the emergency brake handle in the cockpit is a direct hydraulic linkage to the brakes and can be used to stop the aircraft. We practice this in the simulator.

If you want to talk electrons, we don't directly control thurst on the EMB-145 either. When I move the thrust levers, a sensor determines thrust lever angle (TLA) and sends that information to the FADECs (Full Authority Digital Engine Control) which actually schedules fuel flow to the engine to deliver the appropriate quantity of thrust. Works great, actually.

And the cockpit noise level in the ERJ is unbelieveably loud. The only time the C-clamps can come off in flight is in holding ... below 200 knots it is great in there ... actually below 200 knots it is about the same noise level as the MD-88 in cruise. Otherwise, quite loud. I always tell my "mainline" jumpseaters they have to wear the clamps ... it's unbearable otherwise, especially if they're used to a quiet airplane.

[cime_sp]

Speeking of that...what kind of headsets do most of thr RJ folks wear.

I need to be purchasing myself a pair pretty soon!

[FL270]

Most of us just wear David Clarks. Company provides them in the airplane, three sets in every cockpit. I use my own, however, carried in my flight case. What other airlines do I'm really not sure.

[Maximillian_Jenius]

[ QUOTE ]
If you want to talk electrons, we don't directly control thurst on the EMB-145 either. When I move the thrust levers, a sensor determines thrust lever angle (TLA) and sends that information to the FADECs (Full Authority Digital Engine Control) which actually schedules fuel flow to the engine to deliver the appropriate quantity of thrust. Works great, actually.



[/ QUOTE ]


So the ERJ is FBW then?


Matthew

[NJA_Capt]

[ QUOTE ]
... nice instead of an Mmo of .78. Would love to see FL410 instead of our current FL370 ceiling.

[/ QUOTE ]
What purpose would it serve for an RJ to be at FL410?

What type of cabin dif is an RJ running at cruise?
We run a 9.3 dif.
Sea level to FL240
6000' @ FL410
8000' @ FL510

Nothing personal, but the LAST thing I want to see at FL410 is an RJ (737 and 757s for that matter). It's bad enough getting behind one in the terminal area. Please leave us the sanctity of FL410.

Nice option 2 days ago over the mid-west when mod-severe turbulence was between FL180 and FL410. We all went FL430 and above. Nice and quiet....and smooth up there.

[Kingairer]

Here we go again....

[Doug Taylor]

When I was a 727 engineer, I remember my pilots getting preturbed on the last leg when we were speed restricted behind almost everything except an L1011 flying back to base.

(in a real southern accent "That man say slow to .80? Gawl'dangit! Ammoh miss my flight to Savannah!"

[Astin]

One of the problems w/ the E-145 is that we are weight restricted quite a bit because of the max. landing weight. If Embraer would increase this, the plane would be much more feasible.

[flyover]

I guarantee that whatever airplane you go to you will miss the quiet MD-88 cockpit. It may be the quietest "Boeing" cockpit ever.

[Kingairer]

[ QUOTE ]
One of the problems w/ the E-145 is that we are weight restricted quite a bit because of the max. landing weight. If Embraer would increase this, the plane would be much more feasible.

[/ QUOTE ]

I tend to disagree. Its no more restrictive then any other RJ. Of course it depends on the model also.

[NJA_Capt]

[ QUOTE ]
Here we go again....

[/ QUOTE ]
Ohhhhh, calm down. I was just fooling around. Boy, you .70somethings sure are touchy
Remember these threads next time you get behind someone doing 45 mph in a 65 mph zone and nowhere to pass.....


Really, what is the diff on the CRJ/ERJs???

and

What benefit would there be for cruising an RJ at FL410??
I know why WE go up there, but the RJs aren't optimized for cruise up there.

[Kingairer]

OH, so you're the one who says "Memphis Center NETJETS 34 checking in FOUR_SEVEN_OH" , broadcasting to the world that you sir, are at 470, oh and its "SMOOTH"

Kidding Only!

[ex208driver]

the only thing on the erj you might be able to consider fly-by-wire would be the thrust levers, they are connected to the fadecs. All the fadecs do is make us lazy, controls the start , ie not adding the fuel, it is automatic. On takeoff you move the thrust levers into the detent and the computer sets the thrust on computed data already entered by someone, ie temp and thrust setting(ALT TO, TO , or E TO on the xrs only) and whether you will be in icing conditions below 1700' agl. The airplane will climb at 1000' / minute to fl 370 from 10,000' while achieving about 300 kias initially decreasing to fl370 at about 240 kias. Roughy .65 mach in leveling off. Every aircraft is different depending on variables. ie newer engines, light load, cooler temps. At fl370 no more than 15 degrees of bank allowed at heavy weights. Aircraft flies nice and stable in all modes of flight. Now if it would only stop doing the honeywell shuffle( it wants to go left or right initially for a turn when cleared direct to a fix from a heading). Those that fly this aircraft knows this tendency. The aircraft is fun to fly.

[NJA_Capt]

Kingerror
[ QUOTE ]
OH, so you're the one who says "Memphis Center NETJETS 34 checking in FOUR_SEVEN_OH"… and its "SMOOTH"

[/ QUOTE ]
No Goose….it’s 4-7-zero.
Actually, it is pretty funny listening everyone ask for FL350,370,390 to “get on top.” Then we throw in that the “tops” are at FL430-450. For some reason, everyone gets quiet.
PS….the call sign is really “Execjet xxx.”

ex208driver
[ QUOTE ]
The airplane will climb at 1000' / minute to fl 370 … decreasing to fl370 at about 240 kias. Roughy .65 mach in leveling off.

[/ QUOTE ]

See Kingerror, I let this one go and didn’t say anything!

[Kingairer]

[TaterSalad]

NJA Capt, don't suppose you ever fly into Rock Hill, SC do you? I've met a few different NetJets Citation X crews there recently..........I realize you have quite a few crews flying that plane, but thought I'd ask.