rain, SUN!, partial panel, ANR problems--lesson

[DrBenny]

Arggg. Partial panel in IMC. Then, in and out of clouds, right about on top. This is so much more distracting than just plain Jane IMC. Now you're in a cloud, and the windshield is pelted with rain. Now suddenly you are out and the SUN IS RIGHT IN YOUR EYES! Now you aren't just partial panel--you're having trouble seeing the panel at all.

A few ILSs, a few misseds, one nonprecision approach. Plus, at my request, some landings--soft, short, engine-out, even engine loss at 50 feet. I had to pee after that one. (It had been a few months since we did that one.)

ANR was intermittent, and I couldn't figure out why.

After a first, slightly wobbly landing, all the remaining four were quite sweet. Short and soft--ain't nothin' like it!

Gotta eat my cheap burrito now--missed dinner at home, and I have two students coming.

[Kingairer]

Question...Why do you train for Partial panel? My answer is, To fly the plane good enough to get back on the ground safely when you are in IMC conditions...Why are giving yourself simulated failures in the actual condition.

[DrBenny]

Question:

[ QUOTE ]
Why are giving yourself simulated failures in the actual condition.

[/ QUOTE ]
Answer: Why the heck not?

At this point, partial panel is not difficult under the hood, nor is flying actual in stratus. Finally, having a gyro fail in VMC is a non-issue. A failure in IMC is where it counts.

My feeling is that any pilot who cannot fly partial panel in IMC should not fly in IMC. I am glad to have the opportunity to practice this. Of course, we had a safety net--the lowest layer was at 2,000-2,500 feet.

[DrBenny]

I would only add that Taco Bell burritos are incredibly cheap, and I enjoy them greatly after IMC.

[mtsu_av8er]

Hmmm...love the Grilled Stuft Burrito...especially steak!!

[Hootie]

[ QUOTE ]
Hmmm...love the Grilled Stuft Burrito...especially steak!!

[/ QUOTE ]

Living on the high horse. I had to settle for a chili cheese burrito tonight, but im still very grateful for taco bell.

[Kingairer]

[ QUOTE ]
Question:

[ QUOTE ]
Why are giving yourself simulated failures in the actual condition.

[/ QUOTE ]
Answer: Why the heck not?

At this point, partial panel is not difficult under the hood, nor is flying actual in stratus. Finally, having a gyro fail in VMC is a non-issue. A failure in IMC is where it counts.

My feeling is that any pilot who cannot fly partial panel in IMC should not fly in IMC. I am glad to have the opportunity to practice this. Of course, we had a safety net--the lowest layer was at 2,000-2,500 feet.

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course you should practice partial. But i dont think you should do it in an actual condition. Ive been up in your area all week, and its been low. Thats like being an MEI and cutting the fuel selector off at V1.

[USMCmech]

[ QUOTE ]
Question:

[ QUOTE ]
Why are giving yourself simulated failures in the actual condition.

[/ QUOTE ]
Answer: Why the heck not?

At this point, partial panel is not difficult under the hood, nor is flying actual in stratus. Finally, having a gyro fail in VMC is a non-issue. A failure in IMC is where it counts.

My feeling is that any pilot who cannot fly partial panel in IMC should not fly in IMC. I am glad to have the opportunity to practice this. Of course, we had a safety net--the lowest layer was at 2,000-2,500 feet.

[/ QUOTE ]


If you can't do it in actual, you can't do it at all.

I know a guy who flys his own Barron. His reccurect training is to go flying on a IMC night with a CFII. He flys single engine, partial pannel, at night, in actual IMC, just with the VOR/ILS.

If you can mastter that, then you can do anything.

His instructor has instruments on his side and a handheld GPS that he can see. So this minimizes the risk.

Very good training in my opinion.

[Kingairer]

I can see it if you have standby intrstruments the CFI can moniter. So as a CFI you cover up the HI and ATT I. So now your student is flying in actual, on an approach?? And when you go off course or let your student go to far before correcting, then what? Its your ticket.

[DrBenny]

[ QUOTE ]


Of course you should practice partial. But i dont think you should do it in an actual condition. Ive been up in your area all week, and its been low.

[/ QUOTE ] Yesterday wasn't low. The lowest scattered layer when I launched was at about 1,500, and the lowest broken was at 2,700--all with excellent visibility. We're talking VFR, here. Although the failure occured in IMC, one must bear in mind that the failure also didn't occur until we were stabilized at 5,000. It was an easy transition. Indeed, the only thing that made it difficult was the in-and-out of clouds and rain, mixed with brilliant sunshine. But that's the reality. As much as I don't like to think about it, a gyro failure could indeed happen someday under similar circumstances. I'm not training for my IFR rating--I am training to be a conversant IFR pilot.
[ QUOTE ]
Thats like being an MEI and cutting the fuel selector off at V1.

[/ QUOTE ] Again, I disagree. Under the conditions I've outlined above, the OEI at V1 is much higher-risk.

[DrBenny]

[ QUOTE ]



If you can't do it in actual, you can't do it at all.

[/ QUOTE ]Do you know my instructor, or something?

[ QUOTE ]
I know a guy who flys his own Barron. His reccurect training is to go flying on a IMC night with a CFII. He flys single engine, partial pannel, at night, in actual IMC, just with the VOR/ILS.

If you can mastter that, then you can do anything.

[/ QUOTE ] I'd only add to that from reading the accident reports, the above scenario is unlikely, yet possible. If you are comfortable with everything less than this, why not train to this standard? Add "layers" of safety into your overall skill level.

[Kingairer]

Im just curious...Are you guys out doing manuevers and doing this? Or shooting approaches? Are you filed IFR in this case?