Watching sheep to the slaughter

[Cosmo1999]

Ever wanted to see what it looks like having sheep walk to the slaughter?? Well here is the closet thing to it. Gulfstream academy has a webcam of there classes, click here to see it . LOL I can almost see the glazed over look in their eyes just dreaming of shelling out as much money as they can to THE MAN.

[Doug Taylor]

Wearing a uniform to an airline systems ground school?

You gots to be kidding.

[ready2fly]

Hey, they wear uni's at FSA, too.

...and they're they "industry leader" in flight training. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Doug Taylor]

I can see an academy, but I was under the impression that it was Gulfstream Airlines FO ground school.

[adreamer]

It is an "PFT" school. You pay them about something like 20 grands, then you get to fly Beech 1900 for 8 dollars per hour. For about 250 hour or so

adreamer

[Cosmo1999]

[ QUOTE ]
Wearing a uniform to an airline systems ground school?

You gots to be kidding.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was thinking the same thing myself! I mean give me a break. Every airline that I know of uses buisness casual for training. What a joke that is over there. Funny thing is is that the uniform isnt even included in all that money you dish out to fly their airplane [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/insane.gif[/img]

[eeg]

It's 30K.

[ QUOTE ]
It is an "PFT" school. You pay them about something like 20 grands, then you get to fly Beech 1900 for 8 dollars per hour. For about 250 hour or so

adreamer

[/ QUOTE ]

If it is 8 dollars per hour then why do people consider it so bad? Multi time in a B1900D for $8h sounds awesome. What's the catch?

[Cosmo1999]

[ QUOTE ]
If it is 8 dollars per hour then why do people consider it so bad? Multi time in a B1900D for $8h sounds awesome. What's the catch?

[/ QUOTE ]

By god man have you lost your mind? First of all $8/hr is way too little to make as a required crew member of an aircraft. Remember you dont get paid on a $40 hour week you get paid by the flight hour. Most places pay $18-$25 to sit in that seat and thats still not enough in my opinion. Plus you pay them $30,000 or whatever the cost is to sit in that seat. $8/hr at 250 hours = $2000 and a big woo de do. Now you paid $28,000 instead of $30,000 to sit in that seat that should be a paid position. Just remember that kind of thinking is not a good thing!!

[WindyCityPilot]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It is an "PFT" school. You pay them about something like 20 grands, then you get to fly Beech 1900 for 8 dollars per hour. For about 250 hour or so

adreamer

[/ QUOTE ]

If it is 8 dollars per hour then why do people consider it so bad? Multi time in a B1900D for $8h sounds awesome. What's the catch?

[/ QUOTE ]

Oh man...here we go again......

[JEP]

[ QUOTE ]
Multi time in a B1900D for $8h sounds awesome. What's the catch?

[/ QUOTE ]

Two letters my friend.........altogether now...............SA

The catch is that is what you are getting paid. It is not [b]what you are paying to fly (rent) the airplane.

(at I hope I am reading your question right) [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

If I have a company on the side or something I'm working on, I really don't care how much I get paid if I'm building time. I would never pay $30,000 for PFT. I will never do PFT. BUT if it was to be $8 an hour and that's it then it would be worth it. And stop with the SA crap.

[montanapilot]

[ QUOTE ]
BUT if it was to be $8 an hour and that's it then it would be worth it.

[/ QUOTE ]


no it wouldnt be actually. the fact that you are STEALING someones job should come into play here.

[kellwolf]

[ QUOTE ]
If it is 8 dollars per hour then why do people consider it so bad? Multi time in a B1900D for $8h sounds awesome. What's the catch?

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I wouldn't mind.

[/ QUOTE ]

And this people is how this operations survive. Congrats, Brian. You are now a "starry eyed potential pilot who would fork over thousands to THE MAN." This is exactly what these guys are thinking. First of all, you should NEVER take a wage for less than you are worth, no matter what profession. I started out at more than $8/hr as a RAMPER for SWA, and that's considered the low end of the spectrum for rampers. $8/hr is roughly between half and a third of what Mesa pays their B1900 FOs. This is right there along the lines of flying for free. It's not about supporting YOURSELF (even if you had a business on the side), it's about standing up for the INDUSTRY.

And how would a person be "stealing the job"?

[kellwolf]

[ QUOTE ]
And how would a person be "stealing the job"?

[/ QUOTE ]

By paying a company $30K to work for a sub-human wage, when there are hundreds of qualified people out that can (and do) the same job for close to three times the wage being offered. Basically, you're saying "I don't care that I'm being treated as a social security number with a bank account." This is convered IN LENGTH in all the PFT articles all over the site. I've tried to explain it several times, I am officially throwing my hands up in frustration and moving on.

[montanapilot]

because someone should be paid to do what you are paying for.


To quote someone famous who I forgot their name "There is a sucker born every minute"

[kellwolf]

[ QUOTE ]
To quote someone famous who I forgot their name "There is a sucker born every minute"

[/ QUOTE ]

PT Barnum, I think.

[Cosmo1999]

dude get the stars out of your eyes and wake up. $8/flight hour to fly an airplane? That is a freaking joke. There are plenty of professionals out there who would like to make a living flying airplanes but your starry eyed syndrome wants to do whatever it takes to "build time" and cut everyone else off. Your time building is over once you get your commercial ticket and or cfi ticket. After that each job you have is a required, professional position for which you should be properly compensated for.

[ready2fly]

Question for you, Brian:

Would you pay to work at MacDonalds, Wal Mart, Buger King...... or anywhere else you might want a job??

[DE727UPS]

PFT is wrong, Brian, because it's traditional in the industry for pilots to be compensated for doing a job. $8/hr is a token amount required to meet state employment regs....they wouldn't pay anything if they could get away with it.

In other words, Gulfstream and TAB express management are exploring new lows on how far the bar can be lowered for the profession. People who buy into this program are doing their part to bring down the career, too. You see it as a cheap way to build multi time. I see it as management taking advantage of pilots and hurting our profession.

What's to stop these schemes from spreading? Next thing you know it will be Delta coming up with a program for DCA grads to pay 50K for 200 hours in a 737-200. Don't think PFT can spread to larger aircraft?

Check this out http://www.simcenter-carolina.com/B727fo.htm

[CaptainMatt]

8 dollars an Hour is Nothing! I make more than that and I still have No money! I have to live at my parents just to stay alive. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

[Tokyo007]

oh man more acronyms to learn..

sorry for being dumb what does PFT mean (professional flight training?) I'm searching..also this "AS" thing pops up too lol whats the deal with that..? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] (sorry in advance)

back to the subject on that gulfstream class.. ugg I love the uniform and hope to wear one some day but wow how cheap it makes the industry look..and I won't get into the whole $8 an hour mess.. ugg.. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif[/img]

Matthew

[MarineNav]

Quote:
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BUT if it was to be $8 an hour and that's it then it would be worth it.


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no it wouldnt be actually. the fact that you are STEALING someones job should come into play here

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Stealing? Call the police!

It's the employer's choice on how to fill the seats. Stealing? No. Money-based discrimination? Probably.

Regards,

JR

[Kristie]

ok.. I think something got off track here... Brian said he would never DO PFT... that is what I heard... so his "I wouldn't mind" isn't pertaining to PFT.. it's pertaining to making $8/hr to FLY an airplane...

now, THAT i have a problem with because in a sense, your acting like all the starry eyed people out there who have no problem flying for nothing to build time...that's what brings the industry down as far as pay scales go.. .cuz a major airline company like DL or NWA or whoever would LOVE to hire brian and pay him diddly squat to risk his life & the life of the passengers & fly people around on a daily basis...

the only problem brian - you don't get paid for commuting, you don't get paid for being away from home for 4 days or what not...you don't get paid while your on the ground.. the only time you get paid is in the air... and like doug went thru yesterday - he went thru a 12 hr day with only 6 hrs of FLIGHT time... and that's the amount of money you'd be making... so in essence, your willing to fly a plane, willing to be ON THE JOB for 12 hrs but only be paid for 6 hrs total at $8/hr... that means you didn't earn $96 for your day.. you only earned $48 for your day....

$8/hr is LESS than a mcdonalds employee.. have you thought of that?

now the question after this is would you - really - consider flying an airplane for peanuts at the age of 22, where your forced to live at home feeding on taco hell?? [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]