Can't wait to get to the regionals???

FalconCapt · August 16th, 2004, 12:36

to fly that "cool" jet and live the glamourous life?

Check out this thread...

http://jetcareers.com/ubbthreads/sho...b=5&o=&fpart=1

Ryan · August 16th, 2004, 12:53

What a messed up industry we work in [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif[/img]

CaliforniaSurfer · August 16th, 2004, 12:56

I must have missed the part where it said the internship was 40 hours a week.

FalconCapt · August 16th, 2004, 13:04

[ QUOTE ]
I must have missed the part where it said the internship was 40 hours a week.

[/ QUOTE ]

Full time internship (Full time is generally considered 40 hours/week)...

Regardless, this is a INTERNSHIP position paying MUCH more than a Regional Airline F/O position... Imagine what the starting pay for the regular position is... I would guess $22-$25/hour which would be $45,760-$52,000 per year... Now that is rivaling Regional Captain pay...

Cachon · August 16th, 2004, 13:06

I agree with you, this is very sad.
I think that eventually pilot are going to be force to go to

another career.

It will be hard for the airlines to find pilots willing to work for

those wages and the salary will rise again.

Ok I'm awake now
This was just a dream! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif[/img]

mtsu_av8er · August 16th, 2004, 13:10

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I must have missed the part where it said the internship was 40 hours a week.

[/ QUOTE ]

Full time internship (Full time is generally considered 40 hours/week)...

Regardless, this is a INTERNSHIP position paying MUCH more than a Regional Airline F/O position... Imagine what the starting pay for the regular position is... I would guess $22-$25/hour which would be $45,760-$52,000 per year... Now that is rivaling Regional Captain pay...

[/ QUOTE ]

That's great pay. Can't really compare it to a pilot salary - it's not one!

mastermags · August 16th, 2004, 13:35

cachon, did you copy and paste the same post?

ready2fly · August 16th, 2004, 13:36

Well, again, that falls under the category of: They have us (lower time pilots looking for that first gig after instructing) over a barrell.

Sure, some of us can turn them down and demand a higher wage - but the INSTANT we do - some single, and/or early-20-something, and/or still-living-at-home, and/or no car-payment, and/or no-insurance, and/or no-mortgage, and/or no-dependant, recent college grad will GLADLY step up and say "I'll take that #####ty wage and be happy!!"

So.... we're screwed.... UNTIL we - collectively - as a group of guys who want to one day fly for a living - ALL say "NO THANKS! I'll go work at MacDonald's until you (the regionals) get real with your salary."

But, we all know that's never going to happen because there will always, always, always be those aforementioned pilots who can and will take that job for crappy wages... just to be able to say they've "made it."

[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

[/rant}

R2F

Cachon · August 16th, 2004, 13:42

[ QUOTE ]
cachon, did you copy and paste the same post?

[/ QUOTE ]

yeap
I wanted to posted here, but I made a mistake. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

mastermags · August 16th, 2004, 13:42

Agreed... that's why you had better know what you are getting into before hand.

jonnyb · August 16th, 2004, 13:52

R2F, although I totally understand what you're saying, there are other options for the "(lower time pilots looking for that first gig after instructing)". [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

There are plenty of 135 cargo and charter jobs out there. You just have to look and be willing to move. I got my first job as a King Air F/O with 880 hours and 5 multi. My starting salary was $30K. Then after about six months, I was trained in the Bravo and received a raise.

I'd be lying if I said I never thought about going to a regional, cause I have. But I'm sure glad I never did. I knew I was worth more than 19K/year and I wasn't going to settle. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

Just remember, there are options other than regionals. Lot's more! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

mtsu_av8er · August 16th, 2004, 13:56

[ QUOTE ]
I'd be lying if I said I never thought about going to a regional, cause I have. But I'm sure glad I never did. I knew I was worth more than 19K/year and I wasn't going to settle. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Just a curious question from a guy who hasn't ever seen the real world or had a job or lived away from home or suffered through real misery....

What if a guy WANTS to follow the regional airline track, he WANTS to build experience that way, and he is willing to accept the really low pay for a year or two....

Does that just make him a total d%^k?? If so, why?

kellwolf · August 16th, 2004, 14:08

Stan, that is why I'm moving back in with my parents. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[ QUOTE ]
There are plenty of 135 cargo and charter jobs out there. You just have to look and be willing to move.

[/ QUOTE ]

True, but it takes a certain type to fly cargo, and those charter jobs are tough to get unless you know someone who knows someone who knows someone. Hence the reason I'm on this board. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Trust me, I'm totally willing to move (and so is my wife) to get the job I need. I'm just not gonna move somewhere for a wage that I can't afford to feed and clothe myself.

ready2fly · August 16th, 2004, 14:11

[ QUOTE ]
R2F, although I totally understand what you're saying, there are other options for the "(lower time pilots looking for that first gig after instructing)".

There are plenty of 135 cargo and charter jobs out there. You just have to look and be willing to move.

[/ QUOTE ]
Oh, I know, Johnnyb - and to be honest, that's pretty much going to be the way I go. I've been leaning towards the charter/corporate side of things for quite some time.

My point was kind of rhetorical = meaning that the industry will probably always be the way it is now with regional airlines paying diddly simply because they know they can as there will never be a concerted effort on the part of "wannabe's" to do something about it.

Sure, we'll bitch and moan and cry and whine and say we'll "never drag down the industry like that", but the INSTANT we get that call saying "we have a class date for you", our song changes.

That's where I was comin' from.

ready2fly · August 16th, 2004, 14:16

[ QUOTE ]
What if a guy WANTS to follow the regional airline track, he WANTS to build experience that way, and he is willing to accept the really low pay for a year or two....

Does that just make him a total d%^k?? If so, why?

[/ QUOTE ]
Lloyd, I don't think THAT would make you a d%^k.... you learned that in the Marines.

[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

I kid... I'm a kidder. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

I just don't think that - financially - I can do that for very long and still have my life, wife and home.

For those who can - then, by all means - go for it, but I really do wish that those who did want to go the regional route would demand a higher wage.

But, if wishes were dollars.... I'd be a millionaire. If wishes-come-true were dollars... I'd have a couple of bucks. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

MarineNav · August 16th, 2004, 14:20

Hmm, a prime reason why there should be only one union!

JR

jonnyb · August 16th, 2004, 14:26

[ QUOTE ]
Just a curious question from a guy who hasn't ever seen the real world or had a job or lived away from home or suffered through real misery....

What if a guy WANTS to follow the regional airline track, he WANTS to build experience that way, and he is willing to accept the really low pay for a year or two....

Does that just make him a total d%^k?? If so, why?

[/ QUOTE ]
Lloyd, to answer your question regarding my opinion: If that's what someone want's to do, and they can afford it, then I say go for it and enjoy! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

The problem is, so many choose this route and then bitch to no end after about six months about pay and QOL issues. I just get tired of hearing it and to some of my buddies I've said, "sorry dude, but I told you so."

There's a difference between those with a family to support and single guys and gals. The salary is almost liveable for singles and impossible for married, single income households like mine. So...........
[ QUOTE ]
Does that just make him a total d%^k??

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course not!! I'm just saying there are other options if you don't want to settle for FBO fueler pay. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

tonyw · August 16th, 2004, 14:26

[ QUOTE ]
My point was kind of rhetorical = meaning that the industry will probably always be the way it is now with regional airlines paying diddly simply because they know they can as there will never be a concerted effort on the part of "wannabe's" to do something about it.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know, my friend. I think that as there are less and less spots paying the "big bucks" at the mainline carriers, people at the regionals may start to demand more since they won't be looking at the regionals as just a springboard.

I don't know if it will happen, but it is a possibility.

mtsu_av8er · August 16th, 2004, 14:27

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What if a guy WANTS to follow the regional airline track, he WANTS to build experience that way, and he is willing to accept the really low pay for a year or two....

Does that just make him a total d%^k?? If so, why?

[/ QUOTE ]
Lloyd, I don't think THAT would make you a d%^k.... you learned that in the Marines.

[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

[img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] I hear you, Stan! My only issue is that, like you, I don't think that everyone would pull together like that. We could all organize and demand better pay and benefits for CFI and regional jobs, and as soon as we picked up a picket, our jobs would be taken. So, we're stuck between a rock and a big-a$$ rock.

I'm at a flight school that pays $20/hour to the lowest paid CFI, and that's as good as it gets around here. We also strive to give a great product so that the customer walks away happy and not upset that he just paid an arm and a leg for instruction. We actually have a guy moving here from Florida this month to work with us. It feels kinda weird. I'm waiting for my boss to come tell me he way joking and that I'll only be getting $8.00.... [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

For me, it'll be hard to ever leave here and go make less at a regional....

mtsu_av8er · August 16th, 2004, 14:29

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just a curious question from a guy who hasn't ever seen the real world or had a job or lived away from home or suffered through real misery....

What if a guy WANTS to follow the regional airline track, he WANTS to build experience that way, and he is willing to accept the really low pay for a year or two....

Does that just make him a total d%^k?? If so, why?

[/ QUOTE ]
Lloyd, to answer your question regarding my opinion: If that's what someone want's to do, and they can afford it, then I say go for it and enjoy! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

The problem is, so many choose this route and then bitch to no end after about six months about pay and QOL issues. I just get tired of hearing it and to some of my buddies I've said, "sorry dude, but I told you so."

There's a difference between those with a family to support and single guys and gals. The salary is almost liveable for singles and impossible for married, single income households like mine. So...........

[/ QUOTE ]

Point well taken.

Personally, I wouldn't mind going the regional route because that's what I've set out to do. However, I agree that you can't moan and whine about it when you knew it was coming!!!

jonnyb · August 16th, 2004, 14:38

[ QUOTE ]
Personally, I wouldn't mind going the regional route because that's what I've set out to do. However, I agree that you can't moan and whine about it when you knew it was coming!!!

[/ QUOTE ]

Then you should definitely go for it. You will have a great time and I have a pretty good feeling we won't be hearing much moaning and whining from you, Lloyd. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

FalconCapt · August 16th, 2004, 15:31

[ QUOTE ]
There are plenty of 135 cargo and charter jobs out there. You just have to look and be willing to move. I got my first job as a King Air F/O with 880 hours and 5 multi. My starting salary was $30K. Then after about six months, I was trained in the Bravo and received a raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree, my next job after instructing was as a King Air/Lear F/O for a 135 Charter Company... My starting pay (day 1) was $28,000/year (in 1994 dollars, roughly $37,600 in 2004 dollars)... After 4 months I upgraded to King Air Captain and my pay went to $33,000/year (in 1994 dollars, roughly $44,300 in 2004 dollars)...

I didn't know anyone at the company, just was persistent... At the time my other option was to go to a Regional paying $18,000/year (in 1994 dollars, or about $18,000/year in 2004 dollars... Hhhmmm... same starting pay 10 years later??? That is equivalent to getting about a 33% pay cut during the last 10 years!) [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

eeg · August 16th, 2004, 15:52

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
There are plenty of 135 cargo and charter jobs out there. You just have to look and be willing to move. I got my first job as a King Air F/O with 880 hours and 5 multi. My starting salary was $30K. Then after about six months, I was trained in the Bravo and received a raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree, my next job after instructing was as a King Air/Lear F/O for a 135 Charter Company... My starting pay (day 1) was $28,000/year (in 1994 dollars, roughly $37,600 in 2004 dollars)... After 4 months I upgraded to King Air Captain and my pay went to $33,000/year (in 1994 dollars, roughly $44,300 in 2004 dollars)...

I didn't know anyone at the company, just was persistent... At the time my other option was to go to a Regional paying $18,000/year (in 1994 dollars, or about $18,000/year in 2004 dollars... Hhhmmm... same starting pay 10 years later??? That is equivalent to getting about a 33% pay cut during the last 10 years!) [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

So what can be done about this? What can "WE" the future professional pilots do? Should we unite and demand better pay? I'm pretty sure it's posible, hard but possible... [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Stone Cold · August 16th, 2004, 15:58

I hate to be the negative guy on this one, but CFI's stab each other in the back enough (in general), i.e., charging lower rates for BFR, free multi instruction, etc. to get the numbers in the logbooks. How can you get a bunch on newbies directly out of CFI'ing to not kill eachother for the time in multi-engine airplanes, especially an airliner, to stand together and demand pay much less better pay.

As you can tell, I am hoping to avoid that route. I did not work all these hours and years to get squat while somebody slave drives me and then pays peanuts. I'll go charter, cargo, whatever before I do that to myself.

Unless I get an interview, then all bets are off...I am still a CFI after all. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/argue.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bandit.gif[/img]

Betabry · August 16th, 2004, 16:01

I'm personally developing a super secret formula to be distributed in the coffee at all airport restaurants which casues you to forget any and all aviation training thus totally eliminating my competition and making me the most sought after pilot in the industry!!! MUA HA.. oh wait I wasn't supposed tell you that... curses foiled again!

Seriously though .. unless people just stop wanting to become pilots, I think pilot pay is going to continue to decrease until it gets to a level that safety becomes an issue.

August 16th, 2004, 12:36	#1
FalconCapt Banned Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: USA Posts: 489	Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? to fly that "cool" jet and live the glamourous life? Check out this thread... http://jetcareers.com/ubbthreads/sho...b=5&o=&fpart=1

August 16th, 2004, 12:53	#2
Ryan Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: KFRG, Nu\' yark Posts: 234	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals... What a messed up industry we work in [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif[/img]

August 16th, 2004, 12:56	#3
CaliforniaSurfer Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: SoCal Posts: 296	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals... I must have missed the part where it said the internship was 40 hours a week.

August 16th, 2004, 13:04	#4
FalconCapt Banned Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: USA Posts: 489	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals... [ QUOTE ] I must have missed the part where it said the internship was 40 hours a week. [/ QUOTE ] Full time internship (Full time is generally considered 40 hours/week)... Regardless, this is a INTERNSHIP position paying MUCH more than a Regional Airline F/O position... Imagine what the starting pay for the regular position is... I would guess $22-$25/hour which would be $45,760-$52,000 per year... Now that is rivaling Regional Captain pay...

August 16th, 2004, 13:06	#5
Cachon Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Boston MA Posts: 200	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals... I agree with you, this is very sad. I think that eventually pilot are going to be force to go to another career. It will be hard for the airlines to find pilots willing to work for those wages and the salary will rise again. Ok I'm awake now This was just a dream! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/banghead.gif[/img]

August 16th, 2004, 13:10	#6
mtsu_av8er Old Skool Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Utopia Posts: 12,590	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals... [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I must have missed the part where it said the internship was 40 hours a week. [/ QUOTE ] Full time internship (Full time is generally considered 40 hours/week)... Regardless, this is a INTERNSHIP position paying MUCH more than a Regional Airline F/O position... Imagine what the starting pay for the regular position is... I would guess $22-$25/hour which would be $45,760-$52,000 per year... Now that is rivaling Regional Captain pay... [/ QUOTE ] That's great pay. Can't really compare it to a pilot salary - it's not one!

August 16th, 2004, 13:35	#7
mastermags Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Atlanta, Ga Posts: 1,311	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals... cachon, did you copy and paste the same post?

August 16th, 2004, 13:36	#8
ready2fly Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: DFW Posts: 7,373	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? Well, again, that falls under the category of: They have us (lower time pilots looking for that first gig after instructing) over a barrell. Sure, some of us can turn them down and demand a higher wage - but the INSTANT we do - some single, and/or early-20-something, and/or still-living-at-home, and/or no car-payment, and/or no-insurance, and/or no-mortgage, and/or no-dependant, recent college grad will GLADLY step up and say "I'll take that #####ty wage and be happy!!" So.... we're screwed.... UNTIL we - collectively - as a group of guys who want to one day fly for a living - ALL say "NO THANKS! I'll go work at MacDonald's until you (the regionals) get real with your salary." But, we all know that's never going to happen because there will always, always, always be those aforementioned pilots who can and will take that job for crappy wages... just to be able to say they've "made it." [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img] [/rant} R2F

August 16th, 2004, 13:42	#9
Cachon Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Boston MA Posts: 200	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals... [ QUOTE ] cachon, did you copy and paste the same post? [/ QUOTE ] yeap I wanted to posted here, but I made a mistake. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

August 16th, 2004, 13:52	#11
jonnyb Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: So. California Posts: 1,304	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? R2F, although I totally understand what you're saying, there are other options for the "(lower time pilots looking for that first gig after instructing)". [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] There are plenty of 135 cargo and charter jobs out there. You just have to look and be willing to move. I got my first job as a King Air F/O with 880 hours and 5 multi. My starting salary was $30K. Then after about six months, I was trained in the Bravo and received a raise. I'd be lying if I said I never thought about going to a regional, cause I have. But I'm sure glad I never did. I knew I was worth more than 19K/year and I wasn't going to settle. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img] Just remember, there are options other than regionals. Lot's more! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

August 16th, 2004, 13:56	#12
mtsu_av8er Old Skool Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Utopia Posts: 12,590	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? [ QUOTE ] I'd be lying if I said I never thought about going to a regional, cause I have. But I'm sure glad I never did. I knew I was worth more than 19K/year and I wasn't going to settle. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] Just a curious question from a guy who hasn't ever seen the real world or had a job or lived away from home or suffered through real misery.... What if a guy WANTS to follow the regional airline track, he WANTS to build experience that way, and he is willing to accept the really low pay for a year or two.... Does that just make him a total d%^k?? If so, why?

August 16th, 2004, 14:08	#13
kellwolf Old Skool Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 14,230	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? Stan, that is why I'm moving back in with my parents. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] [ QUOTE ] There are plenty of 135 cargo and charter jobs out there. You just have to look and be willing to move. [/ QUOTE ] True, but it takes a certain type to fly cargo, and those charter jobs are tough to get unless you know someone who knows someone who knows someone. Hence the reason I'm on this board. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Trust me, I'm totally willing to move (and so is my wife) to get the job I need. I'm just not gonna move somewhere for a wage that I can't afford to feed and clothe myself.

August 16th, 2004, 14:11	#14
ready2fly Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: DFW Posts: 7,373	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? [ QUOTE ] R2F, although I totally understand what you're saying, there are other options for the "(lower time pilots looking for that first gig after instructing)". There are plenty of 135 cargo and charter jobs out there. You just have to look and be willing to move. [/ QUOTE ] Oh, I know, Johnnyb - and to be honest, that's pretty much going to be the way I go. I've been leaning towards the charter/corporate side of things for quite some time. My point was kind of rhetorical = meaning that the industry will probably always be the way it is now with regional airlines paying diddly simply because they know they can as there will never be a concerted effort on the part of "wannabe's" to do something about it. Sure, we'll bitch and moan and cry and whine and say we'll "never drag down the industry like that", but the INSTANT we get that call saying "we have a class date for you", our song changes. That's where I was comin' from.

August 16th, 2004, 14:16	#15
ready2fly Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: DFW Posts: 7,373	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? [ QUOTE ] What if a guy WANTS to follow the regional airline track, he WANTS to build experience that way, and he is willing to accept the really low pay for a year or two.... Does that just make him a total d%^k?? If so, why? [/ QUOTE ] Lloyd, I don't think THAT would make you a d%^k.... you learned that in the Marines. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] I kid... I'm a kidder. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] I just don't think that - financially - I can do that for very long and still have my life, wife and home. For those who can - then, by all means - go for it, but I really do wish that those who did want to go the regional route would demand a higher wage. But, if wishes were dollars.... I'd be a millionaire. If wishes-come-true were dollars... I'd have a couple of bucks. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

August 16th, 2004, 14:20	#16
MarineNav Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Santa Clara, CA Posts: 301	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? Hmm, a prime reason why there should be only one union! JR

August 16th, 2004, 14:26	#17
jonnyb Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: So. California Posts: 1,304	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? [ QUOTE ] Just a curious question from a guy who hasn't ever seen the real world or had a job or lived away from home or suffered through real misery.... What if a guy WANTS to follow the regional airline track, he WANTS to build experience that way, and he is willing to accept the really low pay for a year or two.... Does that just make him a total d%^k?? If so, why? [/ QUOTE ] Lloyd, to answer your question regarding my opinion: If that's what someone want's to do, and they can afford it, then I say go for it and enjoy! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] The problem is, so many choose this route and then bitch to no end after about six months about pay and QOL issues. I just get tired of hearing it and to some of my buddies I've said, "sorry dude, but I told you so." There's a difference between those with a family to support and single guys and gals. The salary is almost liveable for singles and impossible for married, single income households like mine. So........... [ QUOTE ] Does that just make him a total d%^k?? [/ QUOTE ] Of course not!! I'm just saying there are other options if you don't want to settle for FBO fueler pay. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

August 16th, 2004, 14:26	#18
tonyw Old Skool Join Date: May 2002 Location: Maryland Posts: 15,922	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? [ QUOTE ] My point was kind of rhetorical = meaning that the industry will probably always be the way it is now with regional airlines paying diddly simply because they know they can as there will never be a concerted effort on the part of "wannabe's" to do something about it. [/ QUOTE ] I don't know, my friend. I think that as there are less and less spots paying the "big bucks" at the mainline carriers, people at the regionals may start to demand more since they won't be looking at the regionals as just a springboard. I don't know if it will happen, but it is a possibility.

August 16th, 2004, 14:27	#19
mtsu_av8er Old Skool Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Utopia Posts: 12,590	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] What if a guy WANTS to follow the regional airline track, he WANTS to build experience that way, and he is willing to accept the really low pay for a year or two.... Does that just make him a total d%^k?? If so, why? [/ QUOTE ] Lloyd, I don't think THAT would make you a d%^k.... you learned that in the Marines. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] I hear you, Stan! My only issue is that, like you, I don't think that everyone would pull together like that. We could all organize and demand better pay and benefits for CFI and regional jobs, and as soon as we picked up a picket, our jobs would be taken. So, we're stuck between a rock and a big-a$$ rock. I'm at a flight school that pays $20/hour to the lowest paid CFI, and that's as good as it gets around here. We also strive to give a great product so that the customer walks away happy and not upset that he just paid an arm and a leg for instruction. We actually have a guy moving here from Florida this month to work with us. It feels kinda weird. I'm waiting for my boss to come tell me he way joking and that I'll only be getting $8.00.... [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img] For me, it'll be hard to ever leave here and go make less at a regional....

August 16th, 2004, 14:29	#20
mtsu_av8er Old Skool Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Utopia Posts: 12,590	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Just a curious question from a guy who hasn't ever seen the real world or had a job or lived away from home or suffered through real misery.... What if a guy WANTS to follow the regional airline track, he WANTS to build experience that way, and he is willing to accept the really low pay for a year or two.... Does that just make him a total d%^k?? If so, why? [/ QUOTE ] Lloyd, to answer your question regarding my opinion: If that's what someone want's to do, and they can afford it, then I say go for it and enjoy! [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] The problem is, so many choose this route and then bitch to no end after about six months about pay and QOL issues. I just get tired of hearing it and to some of my buddies I've said, "sorry dude, but I told you so." There's a difference between those with a family to support and single guys and gals. The salary is almost liveable for singles and impossible for married, single income households like mine. So........... [/ QUOTE ] Point well taken. Personally, I wouldn't mind going the regional route because that's what I've set out to do. However, I agree that you can't moan and whine about it when you knew it was coming!!!

August 16th, 2004, 14:38	#21
jonnyb Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: So. California Posts: 1,304	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? [ QUOTE ] Personally, I wouldn't mind going the regional route because that's what I've set out to do. However, I agree that you can't moan and whine about it when you knew it was coming!!! [/ QUOTE ] Then you should definitely go for it. You will have a great time and I have a pretty good feeling we won't be hearing much moaning and whining from you, Lloyd. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

August 16th, 2004, 15:31	#22
FalconCapt Banned Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: USA Posts: 489	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? [ QUOTE ] There are plenty of 135 cargo and charter jobs out there. You just have to look and be willing to move. I got my first job as a King Air F/O with 880 hours and 5 multi. My starting salary was $30K. Then after about six months, I was trained in the Bravo and received a raise. [/ QUOTE ] I agree, my next job after instructing was as a King Air/Lear F/O for a 135 Charter Company... My starting pay (day 1) was $28,000/year (in 1994 dollars, roughly $37,600 in 2004 dollars)... After 4 months I upgraded to King Air Captain and my pay went to $33,000/year (in 1994 dollars, roughly $44,300 in 2004 dollars)... I didn't know anyone at the company, just was persistent... At the time my other option was to go to a Regional paying $18,000/year (in 1994 dollars, or about $18,000/year in 2004 dollars... Hhhmmm... same starting pay 10 years later??? That is equivalent to getting about a 33% pay cut during the last 10 years!) [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

August 16th, 2004, 15:52	#23
eeg Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Fo\' Laudydaudy, FL. Posts: 235	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] There are plenty of 135 cargo and charter jobs out there. You just have to look and be willing to move. I got my first job as a King Air F/O with 880 hours and 5 multi. My starting salary was $30K. Then after about six months, I was trained in the Bravo and received a raise. [/ QUOTE ] I agree, my next job after instructing was as a King Air/Lear F/O for a 135 Charter Company... My starting pay (day 1) was $28,000/year (in 1994 dollars, roughly $37,600 in 2004 dollars)... After 4 months I upgraded to King Air Captain and my pay went to $33,000/year (in 1994 dollars, roughly $44,300 in 2004 dollars)... I didn't know anyone at the company, just was persistent... At the time my other option was to go to a Regional paying $18,000/year (in 1994 dollars, or about $18,000/year in 2004 dollars... Hhhmmm... same starting pay 10 years later??? That is equivalent to getting about a 33% pay cut during the last 10 years!) [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] So what can be done about this? What can "WE" the future professional pilots do? Should we unite and demand better pay? I'm pretty sure it's posible, hard but possible... [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

August 16th, 2004, 15:58	#24
Stone Cold Old Skool Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: SE US & Kiev Posts: 3,084	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? I hate to be the negative guy on this one, but CFI's stab each other in the back enough (in general), i.e., charging lower rates for BFR, free multi instruction, etc. to get the numbers in the logbooks. How can you get a bunch on newbies directly out of CFI'ing to not kill eachother for the time in multi-engine airplanes, especially an airliner, to stand together and demand pay much less better pay. As you can tell, I am hoping to avoid that route. I did not work all these hours and years to get squat while somebody slave drives me and then pays peanuts. I'll go charter, cargo, whatever before I do that to myself. Unless I get an interview, then all bets are off...I am still a CFI after all. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/argue.gif[/img] [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bandit.gif[/img]

August 16th, 2004, 16:01	#25
Betabry Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Orlando, Fl Posts: 55	Re: Can\'t wait to get to the regionals??? I'm personally developing a super secret formula to be distributed in the coffee at all airport restaurants which casues you to forget any and all aviation training thus totally eliminating my competition and making me the most sought after pilot in the industry!!! MUA HA.. oh wait I wasn't supposed tell you that... curses foiled again! Seriously though .. unless people just stop wanting to become pilots, I think pilot pay is going to continue to decrease until it gets to a level that safety becomes an issue.

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