Which way to go fellow freight dawgs...

ppragman · January 27th, 2008, 19:56

I've been offered a job here in alaska, now I have a few options, but at the end of the day, the only real differences in this company and airnet are time off, and equipment types.

So, the job up here, I'll be flying a saratoga in the bush 2 weeks on 2 weeks off, or I can come to Airnet and get some multi PIC but have less time off. I'm leaning toward the airnet side of things, but it would be nice to have two weeks off and cass to jet set arround, any input?

-Pat

ljg · January 27th, 2008, 21:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by ppragman

I've been offered a job here in alaska, now I have a few options, but at the end of the day, the only real differences in this company and airnet are time off, and equipment types.

So, the job up here, I'll be flying a saratoga in the bush 2 weeks on 2 weeks off, or I can come to Airnet and get some multi PIC but have less time off. I'm leaning toward the airnet side of things, but it would be nice to have two weeks off and cass to jet set arround, any input?

-Pat

1000MTPIC buddy. However and how soon you acquire it is entirely up to you. You could float an 8/6 with us and have some decent time off...but maybe the other guys are better suited to chime in on that.

ppragman · January 27th, 2008, 21:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by ljg

1000MTPIC buddy. However and how soon you acquire it is entirely up to you. You could float an 8/6 with us and have some decent time off...but maybe the other guys are better suited to chime in on that.

no real chance of getting the MTPIC within 3 years at the local company, one more notch for airnet...

Boris Badenov · January 28th, 2008, 02:10

If I remember correctly, you have a fair amount of SIC time in a 1900. That's multi time if you need to check off some boxes. As far as PIC time goes, there's no difference between a Baron and a Saratoga for box-checkin on an application...both piston PIC. As for getting MTPIC, there are ways that don't involve going to airnet, like the 99 or mu-2 jobs mentioned on the other thread, or a 135 passenger operation.

I've rarely heard anyone say anything bad about airnet, but there are other options. I'd say take whichever job at which you think you'd have more fun. You're young, single, free. If I were you I'd want to jumpseat.

ackeight · January 28th, 2008, 02:33

JFYI there have been people at Airnet from date of hire to captain in a lear taking 2 years....... of course you have some SIC'ing to do, but just to give you an idea what you might be in store for...

mikecweb · January 28th, 2008, 09:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by ackeight

JFYI there have been people at Airnet from date of hire to captain in a lear taking 2 years....... of course you have some SIC'ing to do, but just to give you an idea what you might be in store for...

Pshhh 2 years?!?! Who takes THAT long???

ppragman · January 28th, 2008, 14:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by ackeight

JFYI there have been people at Airnet from date of hire to captain in a lear taking 2 years....... of course you have some SIC'ing to do, but just to give you an idea what you might be in store for...

I've gotta wait anyway, cuz I can't get my ATP for 3 years or so, so no worries on the wait...

jsb172 · January 28th, 2008, 14:41

Actually you don't need your ATP to be captain here at airnet. There is a loophole somewhere that if it's freight you don't need ant ATP. The captain I flew with the last year was only 22! He did not have his ATP. FYI i just upgraded to captain. It took me just over two years to go from prop SIC to jet PIC.

ppragman · January 28th, 2008, 15:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsb172

Actually you don't need your ATP to be captain here at airnet. There is a loophole somewhere that if it's freight you don't need ant ATP. The captain I flew with the last year was only 22! He did not have his ATP. FYI i just upgraded to captain. It took me just over two years to go from prop SIC to jet PIC.

Realllyyyyyyyy.... that is more than a seller for me. Yet one more reason why i'm going to come on board. This is way better than the saratoga schedule and everything. I know that you need 2000TT and 500 at airnet to bid a lear as SIC, how much do you need to bid a lear as captain?

Ian J · January 28th, 2008, 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by ppragman

Realllyyyyyyyy.... that is more than a seller for me. Yet one more reason why i'm going to come on board. This is way better than the saratoga schedule and everything. I know that you need 2000TT and 500 at airnet to bid a lear as SIC, how much do you need to bid a lear as captain?

2500 as long as you have 500 in Airnet jets, otherwise 3000. And of course you need the seniority to win the run you are bidding on.

ppragman · January 28th, 2008, 15:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian J

2500 as long as you have 500 in Airnet jets, otherwise 3000. And of course you need the seniority to win the run you are bidding on.

That's great, I was kinda interested in whether or not I'd end up stagnant as an FO on the lear...this is outstanding news. 250Hrs more to go...

Ian J · January 28th, 2008, 15:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by ppragman

That's great, I was kinda interested in whether or not I'd end up stagnant as an FO on the lear...this is outstanding news. 250Hrs more to go...

Well, it could be stagnant...

1. If attrition stops, you go no where.

2. If you don't bid on open runs, or you only bid on runs where people senior to you are bidding, (i.e. you hold out for a specific base) you go no where. (Mikecweb as a new Lear PIC has people ABOVE him in seniority who are Prop PICs, if that makes sense.)

mikecweb · January 28th, 2008, 16:02

But I'm also commonly referred to as "Da ####".

No I just got really lucky throughout my whole time at Airnet. Hopefully it continues.

JSB where are you going now that DSM is closed?

ppragman · January 28th, 2008, 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian J

Well, it could be stagnant...

1. If attrition stops, you go no where.

2. If you don't bid on open runs, or you only bid on runs where people senior to you are bidding, (i.e. you hold out for a specific base) you go no where. (Mikecweb as a new Lear PIC has people ABOVE him in seniority who are Prop PICs, if that makes sense.)

Still, multi time beats single time anyday.

I was called by the recruiter yesterday, now I'm just holding out for my 1200TT (which I'll probably build faster here than anyplace else) then I'm off to Airnet. It is really cool to be offered another job, but I'll stick it out for another couple of months for an even better one.

ljg · January 28th, 2008, 17:27

They called you on a Sunday?

ppragman · January 28th, 2008, 19:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by ljg

They called you on a Sunday?

You sir, are correct....

Day before yesterday

Its all blurring together

minitour · January 29th, 2008, 02:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikecweb

Pshhh 2 years?!?! Who takes THAT long???

Hey, with any luck it'll be twice as long. The props rock! It might just be the schedule...continued below

Quote:

Originally Posted by ljg

1000MTPIC buddy. However and how soon you acquire it is entirely up to you. You could float an 8/6 with us and have some decent time off...but maybe the other guys are better suited to chime in on that.

Whoever thought up the "floater" idea needs a raise. ...seriously.

I just downloaded the rotation planner and I'm going to have so much time to golf this summer it's going to be sick. I can't wait.

OTOH, right now I'm extending every trip and racking in the extra money every trip. The run I am covering this week blocked me 7.6 hours tonight. I don't imagine it being over 6.5 on a regular basis, but that's still a lot of multi-engine flight time (Baron) on a pretty easy run.

There are great opportunities here. I'm sold.

-mini

bhh1128 · January 29th, 2008, 04:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by minitour

Whoever thought up the "floater" idea needs a raise. ...seriously.
OTOH, right now I'm extending every trip and racking in the extra money every trip. The run I am covering this week blocked me 7.6 hours tonight. I don't imagine it being over 6.5 on a regular basis, but that's still a lot of multi-engine flight time (Baron) on a pretty easy run.

So what exactly is the downside to floating? This seems like a pretty nice setup.

mninstructor · January 29th, 2008, 05:24

Covering a run you are not familiar with is more challenging, which means you work harder, but can also be a nice change. Not home every night which most airnet runs are. Normally lower pay, right now guys are extending and flying extra days to make more cash. But if and when staffing returns to normal there will be less extra time available which means floating will put you toward the bottom of the pay list.

Lots of good stuff as well, just a few things to consider.

ljg · January 29th, 2008, 07:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by ppragman

You sir, are correct....

Day before yesterday

Its all blurring together

Wow, I'm a little suprised by that.

New Airnet Core Value: Remember the Staffing and keep it Wholly.

minitour · January 29th, 2008, 09:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhh1128

So what exactly is the downside to floating? This seems like a pretty nice setup.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mninstructor

Covering a run you are not familiar with is more challenging, which means you work harder, but can also be a nice change. Not home every night which most airnet runs are. Normally lower pay, right now guys are extending and flying extra days to make more cash. But if and when staffing returns to normal there will be less extra time available which means floating will put you toward the bottom of the pay list.

Lots of good stuff as well, just a few things to consider.

Really mn nailed it.

To me, the 8/6 offsets not being home those 8 days. Then again, I'm looking towards the future (this summer) when I'll have 6 straight days every other week to play some golf.

It seems like ops does cut you some slack you first 2-3 days on a run because, let's face it...most of the time you have a piece of paper that is telling you what to do and it's 85% wrong

. You do tend to work a bit harder, especially those first 2-3 days trying to figure out where you can cut corners with center and which runways to ask for so your taxi times are shorter...things like that. Also, knowing how much gas you can tanker around is a challenge at first.

As for pay and being low, yeah...you're relatively low compared to the guys with 5 day 6 hour runs, but you aren't going to make base pay either.

Oh...and the charts. You need to lug a ton of charts around with you *coughefbcough*

which can get heavy when you throw in your GOM and Enroute binder and DG book. I suppose once you're comfortable that you're just going to be where they assigned you, you could get away with just taking charts for that trip but I'm still worried they're going to change it up on me (ie. you're assigned MEM-JAX so you only take charts to cover that area...I'm worried one night they'd ask me to go MEM-STL so I lug all the charts around).

And airline flights. It's not the airlines that I don't like...it's going through G-D TSA. It's really like a box of chocolates. You don't know if you're going to get something nice and sweet where you don't even take your shoes off and you go through the crew line (PHX) or you're going to get something filled with nasty rotten and spoiled mayo (ICT

).

Don't forget keeping 3 airplanes straight. I almost forgot to bring the wheels up last night after flying the caravan for a week. Oops...

To me, the positives are the 8/6 (huuuuuuuge positive for me) and not going to the same places every day of your life. That just sounds like it would be boring as all hell. If I did LCK-MBS-DTW-CLE-MBS-DTW-CLE-LCK every night for the next year, I'd want to shoot myself. The nice thing is, I'm here until Thursday. When I go back to work on the 13th, chances are I'll be somewhere new.

Plus, you should see all of the hotel, airline and rental car points I'm racking up

.

In my opinion this is probably the best job in the company...but I like variety. YMMV

OTOH...if the company comes up with a run that checks in say 1 o'clock and checks out by say 4:30 on......I don't know...Monday and Thursday I'll put up with going to the same places every night

-mini

bhh1128 · January 29th, 2008, 10:11

Very informative answers guys. I appreciate it. The last time the topic came up around here I seem to remember people discussing the downsides more. It sounds like it is really an issue of personal preference.

minitour · January 29th, 2008, 10:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhh1128

Very informative answers guys. I appreciate it. The last time the topic came up around here I seem to remember people discussing the downsides more. It sounds like it is really an issue of personal preference.

There are downsides...but for me, I think the positives outweigh the negatives. Your mileage may vary.

-mini

Zephyr · January 29th, 2008, 12:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by minitour

Really mn nailed it.

To me, the 8/6 offsets not being home those 8 days. Then again, I'm looking towards the future (this summer) when I'll have 6 straight days every other week to play some golf.

Real good summary of what floatin' is like. I love the variety. I've been in the Caravan for the last four months straight, and was flying Barons and Navajos this week, little bit of a change there.

The floater idea is pretty neat, however I sort of feel that the airline reserve concept of having reserves in every base makes a little more sense. At Airnet right now we're using the 'reserves' to fly runs that don't have pilots, so as a result there are no true reserves. That way when a cog slips there's nothing to fall back on. And heaven forbid a floater gets sick... eh, my $0.02. Makes sense to somebody.

Oh, and if you want a cake run, look at 486 :-) Awfully tempting...

minitour · January 29th, 2008, 14:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zephyr

Real good summary of what floatin' is like. I love the variety. I've been in the Caravan for the last four months straight, and was flying Barons and Navajos this week, little bit of a change there.

The floater idea is pretty neat, however I sort of feel that the airline reserve concept of having reserves in every base makes a little more sense. At Airnet right now we're using the 'reserves' to fly runs that don't have pilots, so as a result there are no true reserves. That way when a cog slips there's nothing to fall back on. And heaven forbid a floater gets sick... eh, my $0.02. Makes sense to somebody.

Oh, and if you want a cake run, look at 486 :-) Awfully tempting...

That the MEM Van run? I was supposed to be there this week. MEM-CPS-MEM-*yaaaaaawn*

-mini
PS
It's no longer open.

January 27th, 2008, 19:56	#1
ppragman Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Somewhere between Beluga and Tyonek Posts: 1,074	Which way to go fellow freight dawgs... I've been offered a job here in alaska, now I have a few options, but at the end of the day, the only real differences in this company and airnet are time off, and equipment types. So, the job up here, I'll be flying a saratoga in the bush 2 weeks on 2 weeks off, or I can come to Airnet and get some multi PIC but have less time off. I'm leaning toward the airnet side of things, but it would be nice to have two weeks off and cass to jet set arround, any input? -Pat

January 28th, 2008, 02:10	#4
Boris Badenov Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Saint Loser, Misery Posts: 1,162	Re: Which way to go fellow freight dawgs... If I remember correctly, you have a fair amount of SIC time in a 1900. That's multi time if you need to check off some boxes. As far as PIC time goes, there's no difference between a Baron and a Saratoga for box-checkin on an application...both piston PIC. As for getting MTPIC, there are ways that don't involve going to airnet, like the 99 or mu-2 jobs mentioned on the other thread, or a 135 passenger operation. I've rarely heard anyone say anything bad about airnet, but there are other options. I'd say take whichever job at which you think you'd have more fun. You're young, single, free. If I were you I'd want to jumpseat.

January 28th, 2008, 02:33	#5
ackeight Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Dallas Posts: 360	Re: Which way to go fellow freight dawgs... JFYI there have been people at Airnet from date of hire to captain in a lear taking 2 years....... of course you have some SIC'ing to do, but just to give you an idea what you might be in store for...

January 28th, 2008, 14:41	#8
jsb172 Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 62	Re: Which way to go fellow freight dawgs... Actually you don't need your ATP to be captain here at airnet. There is a loophole somewhere that if it's freight you don't need ant ATP. The captain I flew with the last year was only 22! He did not have his ATP. FYI i just upgraded to captain. It took me just over two years to go from prop SIC to jet PIC.

January 28th, 2008, 16:02	#13
mikecweb Old Skool Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Plano, TX Posts: 2,952	Re: Which way to go fellow freight dawgs... But I'm also commonly referred to as "Da ####". No I just got really lucky throughout my whole time at Airnet. Hopefully it continues. JSB where are you going now that DSM is closed? __________________

January 28th, 2008, 17:27	#15
ljg Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Grand Rapids, MI Posts: 561	Re: Which way to go fellow freight dawgs... They called you on a Sunday?

January 29th, 2008, 05:24	#19
mninstructor Newbie Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 29	Re: Which way to go fellow freight dawgs... Covering a run you are not familiar with is more challenging, which means you work harder, but can also be a nice change. Not home every night which most airnet runs are. Normally lower pay, right now guys are extending and flying extra days to make more cash. But if and when staffing returns to normal there will be less extra time available which means floating will put you toward the bottom of the pay list. Lots of good stuff as well, just a few things to consider.

January 29th, 2008, 10:11	#22
bhh1128 Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Eden Prairie, MN Posts: 64	Re: Which way to go fellow freight dawgs... Very informative answers guys. I appreciate it. The last time the topic came up around here I seem to remember people discussing the downsides more. It sounds like it is really an issue of personal preference.

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