why 135 freight?

[mikecweb]

Yeah we're not gay....not that there is anything wrong with that.

[Stone Cold]

Originally Posted by mnixon

We're not gay, we're just 21st century guys who are "open" about our feelings. That's bullshat, but it's nice to at least think I'm open to it.

Originally Posted by mikecweb

Yeah we're not gay....not that there is anything wrong with that.

[Hernandezcfi]

Let me tell you why I love my current 135 Freight job... Monday - Friday and sometimes Saturday, Holidays off, Daytime schedule only, Very few overnights and when we do overnight, it's a cushy tropical getaway (I only fly to the Bahamas), very low duty time per flight (I pretty much come in, check the weather and weight, file, pre-flight and haul butt and get a quick turnaround at the drop. I usually clear customs and walk out to an empty aircraft), mostly VFR so the radio goes off and the I-Pod goes on as soon as I leave the Terminal Area and the biggest perk of all is I get a real mans paycheck; not the kind of paycheck I used to get when I was 16.

The only down side is the aircraft are not turboprops and are old, loud and slow (Twin Islanders), but I still love the job!

[Propilot]

I currently fly passenger charter in a king air and my FO thinks he lucked out when he started in aviation. He started flying right seat in a premier at 250 hours. He now has around 700 hours....

....and no clue about whats going on.

A few days ago the auto pilot decided to quit while this guy was flying. Its solid IMC. The only time this guy has flown in IMC is with a fancy FMS and auto pilot. Guess what happens. The guy cant hold straight and level without busting alt.


At 250 hours I could t/o and land, but flying freight taught me how to fly. I fear this guy didn't luck out at all.


I'm NOT implying that going regional with low time will make you a bad pilot. I'm just saying what I posted above is something to think about.

[Hernandezcfi]

I have no autopilot. That forces me to fly the plane even when I'm trying to read the paper.

By the time I fly something a little heavy and alot of fast I will be able to fly with my knees, hold a chart with my left hand, tune with my right while memorizing a clearance being given to me over the radio in IMC AND chew gum!

[Boris Badenov]

Why? I wanted to be a dishwasher but they said my test scores were too low.

[100LLguy]

I had 1200 hours with 135 mins last February and was trying to decide between the regionals and 135....After doing single pilot part 91 work, I unfortunately decided I would like to try 121 at the regionals.....Now, I am trying to find a way out!

The current plan for me is get 500 SIC in the jet and bail for a 135 cargo outfit to build PIC turbine and re-engerize my love for flying and small planes.

There is sooooo much BS at the Regional level from the tool bag's, to the delays, to the horrible pay. It is also the easiest flying I have ever done and actually miss "flying" a plane again. The RJ sucks compared to a Cessna or Twin Commander....you actually need skill to fly one of those. The only skill needed for an RJ is a strong index finger to mash buttons. So, I guess if you don't have great flying skills, the regionals should be for you.

[Ian J]

Reasons I decided to fly 135 freight:

- You start off as a PIC. You operate autonomously. You make the decisions. You are given a mission, and it is up to you to accomplish it safely.

- Piston twins at night in weather by yourself. Need I say more?

- Home every day.

- It's an experience builder. There is so much more I could add to that one simple sentence, but I'll let it stand. It's an experience builder.

AirNet specific reasons:

- Pay: Currently $13.47 an hour for prop PICs. That's a duty rig pay, not a block time pay, so if you look at APC and notice a company like XJET is paying FOs $23/ hour it ain't quite the same.

I get paid a minimum of 10 hours a night, no matter what. They take my duty time and divide it by two, and add it to my flight time.

As an example, if I am on duty 12 hours and fly 8, I get paid for 14 hours.

The max you could get is a 14 hour duty day with 8 hours of flying - that would equal 15 hours of pay.

If I fly .3 hours and am on duty for 2 hours, I get paid for 10 hours. (This actually happened to me the other day).

Bottom line, our min annual first year prop pay is around 28k a year. I make 38k first year pay, and I am only on duty 40 hours a week, with about 23 hours of flight time.

To compare it to a regional, here are my stats:

Off 8-10 days a month.

Home EVERY night.

On duty (actual duty - meaning time actually spent at work) 40 hours a week.

Block time 23 hours a week.

- Work rules:
If you are scheduled to fly and don't because of weather/ maintenance, you get paid for 10 hours.

Anything over 40 hours of duty time per week earns you time and a half. (Why I make 38k as opposed to 28k)

Holidays earns you double time. I just worked Thanksgiving, and besides getting double time, they also sent me a pre-paid $50 gift card for working a holiday. How cool is that?

- Extra trips - I hear regional guys complaining about extra trips all the time. Here, you NEVER have to work on a scheduled day off. Once in a while crew scheduling will call asking of you can cover a run, or do a charter run. (Charter runs = even more $) There is no pressure to accept the trip. In fact, I got a call on my b-day weekend and I accepted the trip. I then thought about it, called them back, and said I'm sorry, I couldn't take it. It was no big deal.

- Moves: Airnet pay for you to move to your base. After training, they'll pay for your move to your initial base. If you upgrade to Jet SIC and PIC, they'll pay for your move also. If your base gets closed (it happens) they'll move you to a new base or release you from your contract.

- The general benefits - health/ dental (effective immediately - not after 60 days), vacation, sick days, etc.are excellent. Discount gym benefits - class 1 medicals paid for - free chiropractic (something the Army even couldn't do) - and many, many other benefits. My only issue is with their 401k - the company match is only vested if you stay for 5 years. I know why they do it, but for those who don't stay 5 years the 401k is a worthless benefit.

So about career progression? Where can you go from 135 freight? I'll let the many, many former 135 freight dawgs answer that one.

[gomntwins]

I'm very glad I made this post... it's very interesting. Some people's reasons I understand better than others... but for the most part, I agree. I'm glad I'm a freight pilot... it's been a good experience. I don't miss flying piston's in the least and I do wish I had an autopilot- not for safety reasons, just so it'd be easier to do sudoku's and fly. But I do understand where everybody's coming from. Good stuff.

[mnixon]

Originally Posted by Ian J

Reasons I decided to fly 135 freight:

- You start off as a PIC. You operate autonomously. You make the decisions. You are given a mission, and it is up to you to accomplish it safely.

- Piston twins at night in weather by yourself. Need I say more?

- Home every day.

- It's an experience builder. There is so much more I could add to that one simple sentence, but I'll let it stand. It's an experience builder.

AirNet specific reasons:

- Pay: Currently $13.47 an hour for prop PICs. That's a duty rig pay, not a block time pay, so if you look at APC and notice a company like XJET is paying FOs $23/ hour it ain't quite the same.

I get paid a minimum of 10 hours a night, no matter what. They take my duty time and divide it by two, and add it to my flight time.

As an example, if I am on duty 12 hours and fly 8, I get paid for 14 hours.

The max you could get is a 14 hour duty day with 8 hours of flying - that would equal 15 hours of pay.

If I fly .3 hours and am on duty for 2 hours, I get paid for 10 hours. (This actually happened to me the other day).

Bottom line, our min annual first year prop pay is around 28k a year. I make 38k first year pay, and I am only on duty 40 hours a week, with about 23 hours of flight time.

To compare it to a regional, here are my stats:

Off 8-10 days a month.

Home EVERY night.

On duty (actual duty - meaning time actually spent at work) 40 hours a week.

Block time 23 hours a week.

- Work rules:
If you are scheduled to fly and don't because of weather/ maintenance, you get paid for 10 hours.

Anything over 40 hours of duty time per week earns you time and a half. (Why I make 38k as opposed to 28k)

Holidays earns you double time. I just worked Thanksgiving, and besides getting double time, they also sent me a pre-paid $50 gift card for working a holiday. How cool is that?

- Extra trips - I hear regional guys complaining about extra trips all the time. Here, you NEVER have to work on a scheduled day off. Once in a while crew scheduling will call asking of you can cover a run, or do a charter run. (Charter runs = even more $) There is no pressure to accept the trip. In fact, I got a call on my b-day weekend and I accepted the trip. I then thought about it, called them back, and said I'm sorry, I couldn't take it. It was no big deal.

- Moves: Airnet pay for you to move to your base. After training, they'll pay for your move to your initial base. If you upgrade to Jet SIC and PIC, they'll pay for your move also. If your base gets closed (it happens) they'll move you to a new base or release you from your contract.

- The general benefits - health/ dental (effective immediately - not after 60 days), vacation, sick days, etc.are excellent. Discount gym benefits - class 1 medicals paid for - free chiropractic (something the Army even couldn't do) - and many, many other benefits. My only issue is with their 401k - the company match is only vested if you stay for 5 years. I know why they do it, but for those who don't stay 5 years the 401k is a worthless benefit.

So about career progression? Where can you go from 135 freight? I'll let the many, many former 135 freight dawgs answer that one.

Flew with a guy the other day at my current company who left my old run at the net to come to my current company. 4 years here, he's a IP/CA and going to Southwest early next year.

[DE727UPS]

"I'll let the many, many former 135 freight dawgs answer that one."

I went from 135 freight, to 121 turboprop freight, to UPS.

Obviously, times have changed, but a guy could work his way up to 747's doing nothing but 135 freight.

[Trybysky]

135 freight has been the best experience I could have ever asked for. And yes, I finally have an autopilot, no gps, but at least an autopilot...2.5 years ago I had 1200 hours, with no turbine. Now I sit, with 3200 tt and 1300 turbine pic...waiting for an oportunity with a larger company. My instrument skills, in my opinion are at their best and I am (now) home every night having an awesome QOL. If I could just get an in with de767ups, id be set! Haha

[Queboat]

where else will they make you the captain of a jet at 2000 hours and 23 years old?

[WalterSobchak]

Originally Posted by gomntwins

I've been curious about this for awhile... why are people wanting to fly 135 freight now? I'm a current 135 freight pilot... single pilot... been doing it for years. When I got into it this job the opportunities were nill. I wanted a regional, but freight was the first thing beyond instructing that I got... and I was burned out with instructing. I love my job, but if I was put into the current hiring position (everybody's hiring with very few hours), I doubt I would've stuck out 1200 hours of instructing. I like 135 freight now, but years ago it wasn't what I wanted to do. I keep 135 it to get to the 1000 turbine mark... the pay is good... and I do like it. That's why I'm here. But why are low time pilots still waiting until 1200 hours to fly single pilot in old pistons when they can get a job flying an RJ with 500 or less. This is meant as no disrespect for anyone with low time who wants a job with a regional nor as disrespect for a higher time CFI trying to build 1200 hours to get their dream freight job. I'm just curious. Is it the pay? The possibility of quick Turbine time? Or is it the experience you build? Or do you just not want to fly for airlines? why do you all still want to fly 135 freight?

Do you work for the company formerly known as Business? What is you route?

[mnixon]

So you can see the world baby!

Luxurious First Class Accomodations!


and Four Star Accomodations with a view!









and eat at the finest restauraunts with the finest cuisine!

[Queboat]

mnixon why so many straps? seems like a bit of overkill.

[mnixon]

Originally Posted by Queboat

mnixon why so many straps? seems like a bit of overkill.

Because we didn't want 500 springs coming lose.

[Queboat]

two straps would have been sufficient for all of it. just noticed the pallet jack, thats a nice touch.

[averyrm]

Probly better to overkill than underkill, eh?

[Queboat]

Originally Posted by averyrm

Probly better to overkill than underkill, eh?

when one strap is good for up to 5000 lbs two straps is over kill in a falcon 20. not to mention easier and safer if loaded properly.

[averyrm]

Easier I'll give you, but safer how?

[mikecweb]

Originally Posted by Queboat

mnixon why so many straps? seems like a bit of overkill.

His wife asks him the same question.

[srleslie]

One thing I learned when I was truck driving pulling flatbed trailers.....you can NEVER have too many straps to secure a load. There isn't such a thing. The more the better. Better to be on the safe side than sorry.

[mnixon]

Originally Posted by Queboat

two straps would have been sufficient for all of it. just noticed the pallet jack, thats a nice touch.

It's a dc9, just jumpseating on that one. That's why the jack is there.

Originally Posted by Queboat

when one strap is good for up to 5000 lbs two straps is over kill in a falcon 20. not to mention easier and safer if loaded properly.

Easier yes, but isn't banging a tranny in brazil with no protection easier also? I don't know how you figure less straps is safer but, I'd be delighted to hear your reason.

[BajtheJino]

[quote=mnixon;


Easier yes, but isn't banging a tranny in brazil with no protection easier also? [/quote]
Holy Crap, now thats funny!