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October 12th, 2006, 16:02
| #1 |
| Old Skool  Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,077
|  Approach Question ATIS reports: 1/8 mile vis, 100OVC, FOG, RVR24-60 Can you shoot the approach if the mins are 250 and 1/2? |
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October 12th, 2006, 16:17
| #2 |
| Old Skool  Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 6,515
| Re: Approach Question If the published mins don't include RVR, then I don't see how you could use it. You'd need 1/2 a mile and you only have 1/8th. |
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October 12th, 2006, 16:26
| #3 | |
| Old Skool Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: _
Posts: 5,316
| Re: Approach Question Quote:
__________________ "It takes just as much time to be nice to someone as it does to be a jerk." | |
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October 12th, 2006, 16:40
| #4 |
| Old Skool  Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Utopia
Posts: 12,477
| Re: Approach Question I agree with Wheelsup. Convert the RVR to miles, and shoot the approach.
__________________  ------- One person says "stop gloating - life sucks!" while another says "be happy - at least you have a job!" . . . people are just stupid. |
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October 12th, 2006, 16:44
| #5 | |
| Old Skool Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: _
Posts: 5,316
| Re: Approach Question Quote:
 (with all our exchanges it was bound to happen once) 
__________________ "It takes just as much time to be nice to someone as it does to be a jerk." | |
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October 12th, 2006, 16:50
| #6 | |
| Old Skool  Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: OH or is it MX??
Posts: 4,549
 | Re: Approach Question Quote:
__________________ Get Busy Living, or Get Busy Dying.... | |
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October 12th, 2006, 18:02
| #7 |
| Old Skool  Join Date: May 2002 Location: LCK
Posts: 1,646
| Re: Approach Question Probably not, reason being any runway that's equiped with an RVR will have the mins stated in RVR. Since the airport is showing 1/8 mile vis, use that for everything but the specific runway.
__________________ <-- That guy with Belushi as his avitar |
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October 12th, 2006, 18:42
| #8 |
| Newbie Join Date: May 2006 Location: Down South
Posts: 12
| Re: Approach Question part 91 or 135? |
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October 12th, 2006, 18:54
| #9 | |
| Old Skool Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: _
Posts: 5,316
| Re: Approach Question Quote:
__________________ "It takes just as much time to be nice to someone as it does to be a jerk." | |
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October 12th, 2006, 20:38
| #10 |
| Junior Member  Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: somwhere over the rainbow
Posts: 99
| Re: Approach Question Possible that I missed something but if it is reporting 100 OVC and mins are 250 then I do not see how you begin the approach, unless you have received this wx report after passing your fap. |
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October 12th, 2006, 20:42
| #11 | |
| Old Skool Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: _
Posts: 5,316
| Re: Approach Question Quote:
EDIT: Just to be sure, I think we're all also assuming texaspilot is asking the question in a 121/135 environment, not 91. Obviously all bets are off if it's 91.
__________________ "It takes just as much time to be nice to someone as it does to be a jerk." | |
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October 12th, 2006, 20:44
| #12 | |
| Moderator  | Re: Approach Question Quote:
__________________ NJC or Bust.....CountDown Timer | |
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October 12th, 2006, 21:31
| #13 |
| Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: somwhere over the rainbow
Posts: 99
| Re: Approach Question Looking at it in the 135 regs under 135.225 (2) "the latest weather report issued by that weather reporting facility indicates that weather conditions are at or above the authorzed IFR landing minimums for that airport." Not disagreeing, I just do not see where it says that only visibility is controlling and not your lowest ceiling. I'd appreciate it if you could point me in the right direction. Thinking that you are referencing 91.175 Takeoff and landing under IFR. Thanks for the help. |
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October 12th, 2006, 22:26
| #14 | |
| Old Skool Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: _
Posts: 5,316
| Re: Approach Question Quote:
__________________ "It takes just as much time to be nice to someone as it does to be a jerk." | |
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October 12th, 2006, 22:51
| #15 |
| Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: somwhere over the rainbow
Posts: 99
| Re: Approach Question After I posted the last one I turned on the brain and started thinking. You are correct 135.225 mentions airport minimums, not approach minimums. Thanks for clarifying. |
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October 12th, 2006, 23:17
| #16 |
| Old Skool Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,077
| Re: Approach Question Well....I shot the approach. The runway I ended up shooting the approach to had RVR and the reg's for that runway were 200/24. But I had to do it with a 14 knot tailwind. Just wondering what would have been "legal" if i wanted to shoot an approach to a runway with a headwind but no rvr and visibility of 1/2 req'd. Nice kick in the but after not having to shoot more than prolly 4 approaches in the last 2 months. |
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October 13th, 2006, 00:14
| #17 |
| Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Southern California
Posts: 41
| Re: Approach Question RVR is controlling but the ceiling still has to be reported above mins. |
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October 13th, 2006, 00:40
| #18 | |
| Senior Member  Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 916
| Re: Approach Question Quote:
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October 13th, 2006, 00:59
| #19 |
| Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 6,515
| Re: Approach Question RVR is runway specific. The 2400 at the runway you landed on doesn't count for the opposite end. That one you had to use prevailing vis of 1/8 of a mile and was below mins, so you were right to not use it. The 14 knot tailwind would be illegal in the transport catagory jets I've flown. You'd have to check the limitations for your aircraft. I guess your ops specs could be different, I'm just going off the top of my head. Where's Seagull or Midlife when you need them. Also, I believe part 91 still has to observe landing minimums to land, though you can shoot the aproach regardless of the weather, unlike 135/121. There are no takeoff mins, though, under 91. You can go zero/zero. Ceiling isn't an issue except in forcasts or very rare cases where it's mentioned on the approach chart. |
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October 13th, 2006, 01:18
| #20 | |
| Old Skool Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: ??
Posts: 4,600
| Re: Approach Question Quote:
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October 13th, 2006, 02:22
| #21 | |
| Senior Member  Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Zona
Posts: 1,172
| Re: Approach Question Quote:
Exactly! We know Bob would agree
__________________ Whatever happened to catching a good old fashioned passionate ass whooping? | |
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October 13th, 2006, 02:53
| #22 | |
| Old Skool  Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Park City, UT
Posts: 12,321
 | Re: Approach Question Quote:
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October 13th, 2006, 06:20
| #23 | |
| Old Skool Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Utopia
Posts: 12,477
| Re: Approach Question Quote:
__________________ ------- One person says "stop gloating - life sucks!" while another says "be happy - at least you have a job!" . . . people are just stupid. | |
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October 13th, 2006, 10:18
| #24 |
| Old Skool  Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Left Seat
Posts: 5,521
| Re: Approach Question Don, just to clarify what you said for my own sake... You are saying that if the prevailing vis is less then mins but the RVR on a runway is good, the only runway you can land on is the one with the RVR? And RVR only goes one direction so you couldn't land on 27 if the only RVR given was for 9? I just had a "discussion" with a captain about this. It ended up clearing up before we got there so it wasn't an issue but he was deadset on applying an RVR from one runway to a different one. |
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October 13th, 2006, 10:45
| #25 | |
| Old Skool Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: _
Posts: 5,316
| Re: Approach Question Quote:
I once "knew" someone that had a CA completely disregard an out of date FOM and complete a type of approach for which the aircraft wasn't authorized for (ignoring the fact that the FOM was referring to a different aircraft to begin with...). Meanwhile the FO was reading straight out of a CURRENT FOM that that type of approach wasn't authorized.... We can't make them listen to us. We can do our best to keep them out of trouble and get it on tape but they make the ultimate decisions - it's their prerogative.
__________________ "It takes just as much time to be nice to someone as it does to be a jerk." | |
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