In quite a dilemma...

[autiger10]

Here I am again... I don't know what I should do now. I've been talking to my fiance about the whole pilot career ambition and it has not gone well at all. She and I have been arguing a lot about me going to flight school. I guess it's come down to being either her or flight. She can't/won't accept the fact that I'd be gone 3-4 days a week. Then she brings in the "what about when we have kids and What am I suppose to do while you are gone? Have you thought about how this will affect me." You know, those types of complaints. I try to tell her that there have been thousands before us that have lived a successful, happy life. She has envisioned that I'm going to be that teacher/coach that is home every night, living the dream, "white-picket" fence type lifestyle. She's all whacked out/pissed off that I'm wanting to do this. It's almost as though she is a bit selfish. I mean I can understand where she is coming from and yes, it would suck to not be there everyday, but you know, she is in school doing what she wants to do. Granted, it's not a career that would have her gone half of each week, but it's seem to come down to the "give me what I want" mentality from her and anything else just ain't gonna cut it. I know the easy answer is to let her go and do what I want to do, but it's not always that easy. I guess I'll eventually be put into submission and end up staying in the teaching/coaching career til the day I die. I guess I could always just get a private rating and fly for fun. Oh well, any suggestions out there?

[TheWife]

Have her post her side on jetgirls. There are a lot of women there that have already been through it and live it, and have been for a long time. They can validate her concerns and also show her the positive side of a pilot husband. We can help her talk about your relationship and how no relationship is ever the perfect package. She may find someone else that isn't a pilot, but he may have a bunch of other traits that she despises and then realize a pilot wouldn't have been so bad. You may quit flying and then resent her and ruin your relationship. It's definitely something that needs to be talked about and worked out before you take the next step. Too many people say "well, let's just get through the wedding and then I'll be able to make him/her change their mind."

[BajtheJino]

I was faced with a very, very similar situation. In the end I followed my dream...

[darrenf]

Originally Posted by TheWife

Have her post her side on jetgirls. There are a lot of women there that have already been through it and live it, and have been for a long time. They can validate her concerns and also show her the positive side of a pilot husband. We can help her talk about your relationship and how no relationship is ever the perfect package. She may find someone else that isn't a pilot, but he may have a bunch of other traits that she despises and then realize a pilot wouldn't have been so bad. You may quit flying and then resent her and ruin your relationship. It's definitely something that needs to be talked about and worked out before you take the next step. Too many people say "well, let's just get through the wedding and then I'll be able to make him/her change their mind."

[autiger10]

Originally Posted by BajtheJino

I was faced with a very, very similar situation. In the end I followed my dream...

If you don't mind me asking, how did everything turn out for you?

[TaterSalad]

That's a tough one man. Perhaps look into a flying career outside of the airlines? I don't know how common it is, but with my job I'm home virtually every night. I'm sure you can find some sort of flying job that will allow you to still be home more often than the airlines.

[JEP]

Originally Posted by BajtheJino

I was faced with a very, very similar situation. In the end I followed my dream...

Originally Posted by autiger10

If you don't mind me asking, how did everything turn out for you?

I am guessing his dream was to fly. If so that should answer the question.

Good luck with everything in your situation as well.

[kellwolf]

I got Nessa registered over on Jetgirls....now I just need to get her actively going over there.

[Kristie]

Originally Posted by TheWife

Have her post her side on jetgirls. There are a lot of women there that have already been through it and live it, and have been for a long time. They can validate her concerns and also show her the positive side of a pilot husband. We can help her talk about your relationship and how no relationship is ever the perfect package. She may find someone else that isn't a pilot, but he may have a bunch of other traits that she despises and then realize a pilot wouldn't have been so bad. You may quit flying and then resent her and ruin your relationship. It's definitely something that needs to be talked about and worked out before you take the next step. Too many people say "well, let's just get through the wedding and then I'll be able to make him/her change their mind."

we talk about this stuff on a daily basis...if your having that much trouble and really want to follow this career path, then she should be accepting of at least going out and talking to the ladies that do it on a daily basis.. that would be us...if she's not even willing to "try" then that's a decision you have to make between girl and/or career. No "person" is worth your happiness...you should always find a mate that will always support you in anything you want to do in life. sometimes it just takes a bit more massaging and compromise, but in the end, that's just how it works.

I know this is the 2nd time we've mentioned bringing her over to jetgirls to talk to us ladies that live the other side on a daily basis... if your not going to listen to us and aren't willing to do your part in helping her get informed, it's not going to work. it takes 2 (at all times), to make this type of relationship work.

[eastbayk]

Originally Posted by Kristie

No "person" is worth your happiness...you should always find a mate that will always support you in anything you want to do in life. sometimes it just takes a bit more massaging and compromise, but in the end, that's just how it works.

Agreed! She's asking you to make a huge compromise in your dreams and goals. Is she willing to make the same kind of compromise for you as she's asking you to make for her? If not, then I'd rethink the relationship. If she's already made a huge sacrifice for you, then I'd consider it evening the balance. I don't consider it fair to ask someone to do something for you that you wouldn't do for them. I would never accept a relationship that demanded that, but that's just me.

Every relationship is built on give and take, and it's not fair for one person to always be the giver. Eventually you will tally up all that you gave up and find that it's not worth it. I left a relationship after 13 years because I was tired of always being the one who had to compromise. I made huge life changes to support my pilot though a career change, but I also have no doubt that if i wanted to move to Mongolia to study yak breeding that he would make it happen.

The important point is to work it out before you get married. Keep talking about it and don't sweep it under the rug. Do more research into what the lifestyle (schedule, demands, options) is like until you really have enough information to make a decision. If she's unwilling to talk about it or talk to us at jetgirls about what it's like then you need to decide if that's someone you want to spend the rest of your life with.

K

[stuckingfk]

Give her the walking papers.

A woman that can't accept it now will be even less accepting down the road.



p.s. Make sure to get the ring back so you can pay for some training.

[TheWife]

I don't think he needs to do that quite yet. She may just be freaking out over the situation and trying to grasp some level of control over her future as well. It's a lot to ask of a person to be a pilot's spouse. If he loves her enough to have proposed to her, then I'm sure he loves her enough to give a few things a try before just sending her out the door. Heaven knows I've freaked out my fair share of times over this industry. Luckily for my dh, when we got married, I was young and 100% misinformed and naive about airlines and training. I didn't know the truth till it was too late, I've learned to deal with it, and she may be able to as well, with a little help and communication.

[fly22]

I hate to sound selfish but she wont be happy if youre not happy. If you hate your job it will directly affect her. YOu have to enjoy your life to be able to enjoy your life with her.

[JEP]

Originally Posted by fly22

I hate to sound selfish but she wont be happy if youre not happy. If you hate your job it will directly affect her. YOu have to enjoy your life to be able to enjoy your life with her.

Truer words have never been spoken. Maybe that explains part of my problem....

[TheWife]

Originally Posted by fly22

I hate to sound selfish but she wont be happy if youre not happy. If you hate your job it will directly affect her. YOu have to enjoy your life to be able to enjoy your life with her.

It goes both ways too, though, if she is completely miserable being married to a pilot, she will make his life miserable, it really won't work if either one of them says they'll give in, when they don't mean it, end up resentful, etc. She can't decide she is ok with him being a pilot if she doesn't mean it with conviction. He can't say he's willing to give up being a pilot, unless it's not a big deal to him. They have to meet in the middle and mean it if they compromise on their current stand. Make sure that if it really comes down to "you choose me or flying", she needs to understand (if you say flying) that you aren't choosing her or flying, you are choosing to find someone that will be supportive in all your goals and dreams and that person isn't her. It sounds the same, but it's still different, if that makes sense.

[calcapt]

A few thoughts:

Like others have said here, if you can't be happy independently, you will never be happy together. She, basing her happiness on you, is already raising red flags in my book. You can get into all the mushy let's explore each others feelings stuff, or look at it in a non emotional and objective way. Realize that there are many wonderful women out there that would support you 100 percent in your dream to fly. You don't have to try to make it work with someone who is already expressing reservations about your dreams and goals. I can also tell you that going to work as a teacher or coach and looking skyward every day, watching the contrails overhead and thinking "what if" would be hell if flying is what you really wanted to be doing.

A smart man once said "Making the correct decision usually requires choosing the most difficult option."

At the very least, don't get married until you have this issue completely settled.

[Doug Taylor]

Ditto what Calcapt said.

There's a LOT of divorce in the airline business for a variety of reasons.

If she's looking for the home with the white picket fence, in a small town where Mr. Pilot is going to be home to carve the brisket every evening, this profession is going to eat the marriage alive.

It was a challenge getting into and reaching success WITH the support of Kristie, but if she wasn't behind me it would have been impossible.

I'd suggest getting together to sit down and have a serious chat about goals and expectations.

As selfish as it sounds, you need someone that's 100% behind you. Not one that simply says, "I'm behind you", but the one that says, "Idiot, they're offering you a job in Kenai, Alaska. You're GOING. Don't be a wuss, get it done dingleberry!" instead of "OMG! We live in Buffalo, NY, that job is out in Great Falls, MT! What about me and the children? I'm NOT leaving Buffalo! Wait until BuffaloAirways calls!" (BuffaloAirways may never call)

Besides, if you sacrifice your dreams before you even get married and have children, what do you think your kids are going to say? "Dad, I'm glad you didn't follow your dreams!" and what's he going to tell you when you scream at him about not going away to med school on a full-ride scholarship because he wants to stay in town with his high school sweetheart and work at JiffyLube to be closer to her?

"Dad, you gave it all up for love, why can't I?"

Aviation's a weird business bro. Good luck and let us know what questions you need answered.

[killbilly]

Originally Posted by Doug Taylor

Ditto what Calcapt said.

There's a LOT of divorce in the airline business for a variety of reasons.

If she's looking for the home with the white picket fence, in a small town where Mr. Pilot is going to be home to carve the brisket every evening, this profession is going to eat the marriage alive.

It was a challenge getting into and reaching success WITH the support of Kristie, but if she wasn't behind me it would have been impossible.

I'd suggest getting together to sit down and have a serious chat about goals and expectations.

As selfish as it sounds, you need someone that's 100% behind you. Not one that simply says, "I'm behind you", but the one that says, "Idiot, they're offering you a job in Kenai, Alaska. You're GOING. Don't be a wuss, get it done dingleberry!" instead of "OMG! We live in Buffalo, NY, that job is out in Great Falls, MT! What about me and the children? I'm NOT leaving Buffalo! Wait until BuffaloAirways calls!" (BuffaloAirways may never call)

Besides, if you sacrifice your dreams before you even get married and have children, what do you think your kids are going to say? "Dad, I'm glad you didn't follow your dreams!" and what's he going to tell you when you scream at him about not going away to med school on a full-ride scholarship because he wants to stay in town with his high school sweetheart and work at JiffyLube to be closer to her?

"Dad, you gave it all up for love, why can't I?"

Aviation's a weird business bro. Good luck and let us know what questions you need answered.

You can pretty much end the thread on what Doug and Calcapt said here.

I gave a lot of things up for 'love' - so did my ex-wife. That sweet taste of love, when you do that, often turns into a bitter taste of contempt that never really leaves you.

[Maximillian_Jenius]

Originally Posted by autiger10

Here I am again... I don't know what I should do now. I've been talking to my fiance about the whole pilot career ambition and it has not gone well at all. She and I have been arguing a lot about me going to flight school. I guess it's come down to being either her or flight. She can't/won't accept the fact that I'd be gone 3-4 days a week. Then she brings in the "what about when we have kids and What am I suppose to do while you are gone? Have you thought about how this will affect me." You know, those types of complaints. I try to tell her that there have been thousands before us that have lived a successful, happy life. She has envisioned that I'm going to be that teacher/coach that is home every night, living the dream, "white-picket" fence type lifestyle. She's all whacked out/pissed off that I'm wanting to do this. It's almost as though she is a bit selfish. I mean I can understand where she is coming from and yes, it would suck to not be there everyday, but you know, she is in school doing what she wants to do. Granted, it's not a career that would have her gone half of each week, but it's seem to come down to the "give me what I want" mentality from her and anything else just ain't gonna cut it. I know the easy answer is to let her go and do what I want to do, but it's not always that easy. I guess I'll eventually be put into submission and end up staying in the teaching/coaching career til the day I die. I guess I could always just get a private rating and fly for fun. Oh well, any suggestions out there?

If you give up your dream, be prepared to "roll over" for her for the rest of the relationship.

[cezzna]

You never know where this dilemma will take you. There are no guarantees in life. My ex went loco and I had to litigate her into supervised visitation. Now I have a nanny and stay home every minute of the day that I'm not flying. To top it off I have a special needs child. I manage all of this and still manage to stay happy! If I can handle all of this certainly someone can manage to be a pilot's wife. I don't want to be negative about aviation, but there are alot of starry eyed peole who get into this and then can't hack it. There are good jobs out there but are you willing to live in a crashpad or be borderline homeless on the road for 20K? You have some hard, broke years to be sure coming down the pipe. There are good jobs still but you can't count on them.

My 2 cents.

[bunghole]

Your girlfriend isnt being selfish whatsoever! She is straightforward, and for that you really owe her enough respect and dignity to leave the relationship so she can find that person that can fulfill her expectations which by the way are perfectly normal in every way. If anything give her a big hug for being HONEST! Her honesty will save you years of anguish/grief/broken home....etc

P.S. Perhaps in the future you would bring your career goals up on the first date.

Have a nice day

[SeatClutcher]

Originally Posted by bunghole

Your girlfriend isnt being selfish whatsoever! She is straightforward, and for that you really owe her enough respect and dignity to leave the relationship so she can find that person that can fulfill her expectations which by the way are perfectly normal in every way. If anything give her a big hug for being HONEST! Her honesty will save you years of anguish/grief/broken home....etc

P.S. Perhaps in the future you would bring your career goals up on the first date.

Have a nice day

It seems the girlfriend has legitimate concerns. Not everyone WANTS to raise children almost alone, and if she was thinking she would be with someone with a normal schedule, maybe this flying thing has caught her off guard.

There are two people in a relationship, and sometimes, both have a dream. The original post was pretty critical of the girlfriend's:

Then she brings in the "what about when we have kids and What am I suppose to do while you are gone? Have you thought about how this will affect me." You know, those types of complaints.

"Those types"? Those "types of complaints" sounds like perfectly respectable issues.

I try to tell her that there have been thousands before us that have lived a successful, happy life.

There are thousands of people who have made happy, successful lives working 9-5 and living behind a white picket fence, too.

She's all whacked out/pissed off that I'm wanting to do this. It's almost as though she is a bit selfish.

Who would be the one most likely to end up spending a lot of time at home taking care of the kids?

How is she being selfish? And how would you describe your post explaining what she wants out of life, and your reaction to what she wants?

I mean I can understand where she is coming from and yes, it would suck to not be there everyday, but you know, she is in school doing what she wants to do. Granted, it's not a career that would have her gone half of each week...

Well, no...not "granted"....that's the thing of it, isn't it? The two are very different. I understand why you feel like she's asking you to give up your dreams while living hers, but right now, you don't have kids (do you?). She's going to school before a career. That's different from having the kids and being home alone with them a lot of the time.

Imagine your roles reversed. Imagine you and she have a talk about the future and she tells you, "I've always wanted to be a doctor. I won't be home much - hardly at all, actually, for a few years, and after that I'll always be on call, so if you want kids, I hope you're prepared to be the primary caregiver."

What if you had previously thought you two would be sharing the child-rearing work pretty evenly?

it's seem to come down to the "give me what I want" mentality from her and anything else just ain't gonna cut it.

Maybe she just knows what kind of life she wants.

If that's her mentality, how would you describe yours? What if she doesn't give you what YOU want? Will anything else cut it, or do you have expectations about your life that simply aren't easily negotiable?

I guess I'll eventually be put into submission and end up staying in the teaching/coaching career til the day I die.

Better to have her be put into submission and end up going along with the kind of life you want until the day she dies, eh?

Rather than either of you "submitting" (or, losing something of yourself and becoming resentful, if both of your feelings about your lifestyle expectations are that strong), you might end up having to accept a break up could make both of you happier than you might be if you stay together. Love don't always mean it's right, if you know what I'm sayin'.

Good luck.

[bunghole]

Originally Posted by SeatClutcher

It seems the girlfriend has legitimate concerns. Not everyone WANTS to raise children almost alone, and if she was thinking she would be with someone with a normal schedule, maybe this flying thing has caught her off guard.

There are two people in a relationship, and sometimes, both have a dream. The original post was pretty critical of the girlfriend's:

"Those types"? Those "types of complaints" sounds like perfectly respectable issues.

There are thousands of people who have made happy, successful lives working 9-5 and living behind a white picket fence, too.

Who would be the one most likely to end up spending a lot of time at home taking care of the kids?

How is she being selfish? And how would you describe your post explaining what she wants out of life, and your reaction to what she wants?

Well, no...not "granted"....that's the thing of it, isn't it? The two are very different. I understand why you feel like she's asking you to give up your dreams while living hers, but right now, you don't have kids (do you?). She's going to school before a career. That's different from having the kids and being home alone with them a lot of the time.

Imagine your roles reversed. Imagine you and she have a talk about the future and she tells you, "I've always wanted to be a doctor. I won't be home much - hardly at all, actually, for a few years, and after that I'll always be on call, so if you want kids, I hope you're prepared to be the primary caregiver."

What if you had previously thought you two would be sharing the child-rearing work pretty evenly?

Maybe she just knows what kind of life she wants.

If that's her mentality, how would you describe yours? What if she doesn't give you what YOU want? Will anything else cut it, or do you have expectations about your life that simply aren't easily negotiable?



Better to have her be put into submission and end up going along with the kind of life you want until the day she dies, eh?

Rather than either of you "submitting" (or, losing something of yourself and becoming resentful, if both of your feelings about your lifestyle expectations are that strong), you might end up having to accept a break up could make both of you happier than you might be if you stay together. Love don't always mean it's right, if you know what I'm sayin'.

Good luck.

Wow Seatclutcher! You really make it worth it to come back to JC and read some good advice. If this type of advice isnt your day job then perhaps you should consider a new career. Great insight! I hope he can really pull things together to do the 'right thing'

Ciao

[skidz]

Follow your heart, and remember airplanes are lot easier to control

[SeatClutcher]

Originally Posted by bunghole

Wow Seatclutcher! You really make it worth it to come back to JC and read some good advice. If this type of advice isnt your day job then perhaps you should consider a new career. Great insight! I hope he can really pull things together to do the 'right thing'

Ciao

Being an advice columnist would be the most kick-ass job EVER!


(anyone hiring? anyone?)