When to Start a family

[Bandit_Driver]

How do you know when it is the right time to start a family?

My wife and I want children and we have put them off until now. I feel that I / we are ready in every area expect financially.

I work for small regional airline flying a SF-34 as an FO. The company is somewhat stable but keeps threating furlough one week and then saying they are going to hire and get jets the next. I am only making about 22K a year. My wife works full time too and makes a bit more than I do. We have no debt except our student loans which are very low but still there..

my question I guess is: Am I being overly cautious about money and affording a child?

[mtsu_av8er]

Different folks will say different things, and it's easy to find yourself saying "After I make enough money...".

It's a decision that you have to make for yourself, and a decision which lasts for 18 years at the minimum!!!!

[MQAAord]

Very few people are ever really ready to start a family.

We knew we wanted 2 kids, so that's where we are! Even when you're trying for kids, and you find out it's actually going to happen, it's still terrifying! Kids are a lot of work, but such a joy too. There's nothing like seeing a small innocent little face staring up at you from a crib, smiling and babbling. Of course when this is happening at 2am, and you'd rather be sleeping than staring at that precious little face it makes you wonder what the heck you were thinking! Nah, kids are so sweet. It sounds like you're ready, maybe you should try the 'not doing anything' approach. Not do anything to prevent it from happening, but not necessarily going all out with the charting, fertility predicting & such that some people do. Of course, we did that and it happened instantly......

[SteveC]

"If you wait until you think you can afford 'em, you'll never have 'em."

Lots of people right out of college (or even high school) have kids on minimum income. It all depends on the level of spending someone is trying to uphold. I've known families with total income well under $50K that do just fine, and I know of couples with no kids that are pushing $150K income or more and are so far in debt they'll never see themselves clear (without a liftstyle change).

It's always going to be a matter of priorities. Right now it might mean doing your own car repairs in order to pay for braces. If you wait a few years it might mean not going to Cancun to do the same thing.

My opinion is that if you've got your finances straight enough that you're basically out of debt (except a mortgage), you can afford to put some kids in the picture. They can be relatively cheap to keep, at least until they turn into teenagers. Then you just go rob a bank (and that's just for the groceries, never mind thinking about paying for college!).

Now keep in mind that this little bit of advice is coming from someone that bought into a ready-made family, so take it with a grain of salt...

[TheWife]

For me, as a woman, this is how I know....

Every so often women get "baby fever", where you see a baby or a tiny outfit or a stroller and you goo goo and ga ga over it and think "oh that would be sweet", and then you snap out of it and think, "um, nevermind, I'm crazy, it's not time." THEN you get to a point where you become completely obsessed. You don't just want a "baby" and "tiny stuff", you want to continue your family, you want to create a new life, you think about it non stop, dream about it at night, etc. That is how I knew both times for me. When it went from being a random thought, to a nagging persistant obsession. (I don't mean obsession in a bad creepy way!)

As far as financially, it is 100% true that you will NEVER have neough money, you just have to make due on what you have! But you do need to at least be some what prepared. My opinion is that you can't worry about "Well I could lose my job tomorrow, our house payment could go up, we could have an accident or emergency that takes our savings", if you worry about THAT stuff, you will never have kids. BUT, you DO need to be prepared to pay the hosiptal bill (it's about $2k for us, depends on what your insurance covers), have some savings, and plan for about $2K worth of nursery items and maternity and baby clothes. If you can handle that, go for it, if not, save a little more first.

Also, keep in mind that not all women know how they will "be" when pregnant. Some are so sick they have to quite work. So what would happen if you lose your wife's income? She'll also get to the point at the end that she will want the last month off, and probably 6-12 weeks after, and what if she doesn't want to go back to work at all? If she isn't making a LOT of money, you might be spending more on daycare than what she would make. You just have to sit down and figure some of that stuff out. There are always things you can cut back if you want it bad enough and need the money so she doesn't have to work. Like I sold my car, so that saved car payments, gas, and insurance, and we cut back cell phone minutes, tv channels, and stopped getting like things like magazine subscriptions and expensive haircuts, etc. Hope any of this was helpful. I got a mouthful of rambling if you want any more adivce on anything! Good luck!

[mtsu_av8er]

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Now keep in mind that this little bit of advice is coming from someone that bought into a ready-made family, so take it with a grain of salt...


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Don't feel bad, it happens to the best of us...

[TheWife]

P.S if you get an AFLAC policy like 2 months before she gets pg, you can make quite a bit on it! I got one, it will end up costing us about $860 by the time the baby is born, but if it is a normal birth w/ a standard 2 days in the hospital, I will get about $1700 from AFLAC.

[SteveC]

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Now keep in mind that this little bit of advice is coming from someone that bought into a ready-made family, so take it with a grain of salt...


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Don't feel bad, it happens to the best of us...

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Wasn't feeling bad about it.

Was actually kind of proud that I figured out how to skip the poopy-diaper stage without missing the shoot-the-hoops stage and the stage where they believe their parents know everything and can do anything.

Now if I could just figure out how to skip this next stage we're getting into where parents are really stupid and don't understand anything.....

[mtsu_av8er]

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Now if I could just figure out how to skip this next stage we're getting into where parents are really stupid and don't understand anything.....


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I'm in that stage right now, as a matter of fact. Quite frankly, it sucks...

[mtsu_av8er]

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I'm in that stage right now, as a matter of fact. Quite frankly, it sucks...

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Correction. Dominique just brought me 4 hot White Chocolate/Macadamia nut cookies, steaming from the oven with a cold glass of milk.

This is pretty cool....

[jtrain609]

Don't worry too much guys, it goes both ways. I'm having one heck of a time trying to convince my parents I really AM 22 and not 8.

I know I know, I'll get mine in a few years...

[naunga]

First off I don't have kids, but I have a family: it started when I got married.

I hate when married people say things like, "when should I start a family" kinda devalues your spouse. As if you're saying, "well just because I'm married to you doesn't mean you're part of my family."

Okay, off soap box.

I think a lot of people assume that there isn't a "right time" to have children, perhaps not, but I believe that they certainly can be and should be planned for.

Children represent a major investment in terms of time and money, and like any major investment it should be planned for.

Think about it you wouldn't just go out and guy a house on whim without planning for it financially.

The line I hear when I trot out this opinion is something to the effect that I'm horrible, insensitive person who probably shouldn't have children because children are priceless.

Well in a lot of ways yes they are priceless. You can't say my kids are worth this much money, but you can say children will cost this much to care for properly.

I mean diapers, food, extra insurance, trips to the doctor, toys, clothes, aren't free. Later you're paying for school supplies, more clothes, birthday parties, family vacations etc. etc.

I say if you can't at least come up with a way to fit them into your budget you shouldn't have them.

Apart from the money you should consider the time. Do you have time to care for the child? Does your wife assume that you'll be doing most of the child care? Do you assume that your wife will do most of the child care? Have you discussed it with her? Will you have time for the child and for your wife? Just because you have a baby you should not forget about the adult relationship that you're in. Will you have time to spend with just her? Will you have the money?

And then there is the change in your lifestyle. Are you prepared to put in the seemingly endless hours of caring for your child? Is your wife ready to do that while your out on a flight? I have a friend who wasn't ready, and he for a long time greatly resented his child and his wife.

Like I said I'm childfree, so I'm no expert. All I can offer you is my reasons of why we don't have kids. 5 years of my wife in med school, a ton of debt, low paying jobs, now my wife is in residency for 3 years which is paid, but not a lot. I see her for about an hour a day. Which is right before she collapses into bed. If we had kids the kids would be in daycare from about 7:00 AM until 7:00 PM or later. Which means they would see my wife for about an hour at 6:00 AM when we would wake them up and get them dressed. She'd hit the shower, then me, then she'd leave by 6:45 depending on the day, I'd finish dressing grab the kid, and drop them at the daycare who would feed them breakfast, lunch, and dinner, until they're 3 years old. Weekends wouldn't be much better, since we tend to sleep until 10 AM or later to catch up on the sleep we missed during the week. It would be a sad existence for the child. We wouldn't get to experience the fun and exciting side of things. We'd probably miss the first words, the first steps, etc. A child should have parents who have time for them. Sooo, we don't have kids.

Anyhow, obviously you and your wife need to talk seriously about this. My advice would be this: don't give into impulse. Think about it, start planning for it, and then have a blast.

I mean look at it this way: spend two or three years (or whatever) planning and saving. After which you can have the kid and have fun with it because most everything is taken care of or...have the kid now and then stress about everything.

I choose option 1.

Naunga

I have no experience with kids whatsoever as I was one just a few years back. I think you should ask yourself how much do you need to afford your child. The kid really doesn't have to be spoiled. It does cost a lot to buy diapers, milk, and all the baby needs. Why don't you see what your budget is and try to see about how much stuff you would need for your baby. Then see if you have how much you need. Like I said, I have no experience with this. But it might be a good idea to see an average cost of your child. Everything else outdoes the money though. It is rewarding to have a kid.

[TheWife]

The average cost for our area (incase this is helpful, and this is once you already have the inital crib etc.)

Diapers will run about $60-70 a month for the first 6 months or so, then it tapers off gradually until they are about 18 months, then it's about $30-40.

If the mom breast feeds, food is free for 6 months. However even if she plans to, it doesn't always work, (that happened to me) so formula is about $60 a month for 4 months, then about $20 a month until they are one. When they start cereal around 6 months, that's only like $10 a month, then you start working on baby food. If you make your own, it will cost you about $10 a month. If you buy in to Gerber, you will spend about $50 a month. Once they hit about 9-12 months and start on the solid food, they really are just eating your left overs mostly, so it's really not much more than $10 a month or so.

The 0-3 months and 3-6 months clothes will likely be grown out of fast, so I'd spend maybe $50 max, but when they get to 6-12 and up I'd plan on about $150 for clothes and shoes. You can always dress them a little baggy to start with and leave them in those till they get just right, they last longer that way (roll the legs up an inch, etc.)

Plan on maybe $10-15 a month for random stuff like bum cream, baby shampoo, wipes, etc.

Depending on your insurance, you will likely have co-pays every visit. Ours is $15, and you go in at 2 weeks, 2 months, 4 months, 6 months, 9 months, and a year with most Dr's. So that's about $90 in co-pays the first year. Round it up to about $125 cause you will probably need an rx or two for something at some point.

Other than that, and daycare if you are using daycare, every thing else is just a want, not a need, so what ever is left in your budget after that is what you can spend on toys and games and books and things.

You can save a TON of money shopping on ebay and watching for diaper and formula coupons. And depending on your family/friend situation you will likely get a LOT of stuff for free at your shower(s) and from Grandmas along the way.

So by my estimates, I think it would be safe to plan on needing about $1500 for the first year at the most, if you breast feed, about $1000 would be pretty safe. (not facotring in the loss of income from time off and the hospital bill)

As for the inital stuff---most people probably spend about:

Maternity/Nursing clothes-$500 (way less if you ebay! Way more if you are a "trendy/upscale" shopper)

Crib-$150-500
Car Seat/Stroller Combo-$150
Pack n Play-$100
Dresser/Changing Table-$100-500
Blankets/Linens (including crib set)-$150-500
Rocking Chair-$100-500
Safety Stuff like drawer locks, gates-$50
Booster seat $15

That's the pretty necessary stuff, other stuff you could waste/spend money on:

High chair-$100
Bassinette-$100
Swing-$75
Bouncy Seat-$30
Floor Gyms $30
Monitor-$50
Plus nursery deco and toys.

[MQAAord]

Remember too, use your friends/family as a resource.

We got so many hand-me-downs, everything from our crib & almost all his clothes, to his first car seat (we got it from Bill's sister, so we know its history, and that it was never in a wreck). Our highchair & stroller were gifts.


Peruse garage sales & thrift stores (especially in high-income neighborhoods) for many other great deals.

[Kristie]

from what i've heard via friends with kids... average cost is about $10,000 per year based on necessities such as housing, food, transportation, clothing, health care, child care and education, and miscellaneous goods and services

but of course, it can vary on a yearly basis and it depends on just how much you tend to spend and how much you tend to save!

[TheWife]

I know we have been over this before, but there is NO way we are even spending $500 a month. I don't know what it will cost when they are older obviously. But at least until they are 5, it seems like about $1000 a year is pretty average around here.

[JEP]

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I know we have been over this before, but there is NO way we are even spending $500 a month.

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I think part of the numbers these surveys include the housing costs as part of the average. For example, if you do have two kids maybe you have a 2 or 3 bedroom home and part of the costs of the home are averaged into the larger figure. If you did not have any kids, you may not have that 2 or 3 bed home/apt.

[mtsu_av8er]

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from what i've heard via friends with kids... average cost is about $10,000 per year based on necessities such as housing, food, transportation, clothing, health care, child care and education, and miscellaneous goods and services

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No where near that amount. Now, believe me, you CAN spend that much per eyar, but if that were the case, there's no way someone that made $40,000 per year could afford 3 of 4 children.

In all reality, if you live someplace when you don't have children, you can't claim that it costs money to house the child. I mean, you could but it's not an added expense.

Transportation? Hmmm..I don't know...I don't spend that much money transporting myself each year. With two of them (and one of them constantly on a plane between here and Alabama), we don't spend that much transporting them

Food? Yeah, for some reason they can't seem to ever get full.... Really, it's not so bad.

Clothing? That can get expensive if you let it. Dominique is at the stage of wanting to buy expensive crap. So, she pays for it. Period.

Child care? that's only for a limited time. It also varies depending on your geographical location. It's also not a permanent need. As they get older, they need less childcare, and it gets cheaper.

Healthcare - that's one of the larger expenses, thoguh not as large as the child care. healthcare is going to cost you some change.

Education? Well, if they go to private school, maybe....

Realistically, I'd say that the $10,000 price tag could be a variable figure, a function of where you decide to splurge and where you decide to skimp. It would be very easy to drop that number down to $3000 and you could raise it to $30,000.

[Doug Taylor]

"Daddy, I want to study art history at Harvard..."

[mtsu_av8er]

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"Daddy, I want to study art history at Harvard..."

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"Well, here's the phone number for the bank..."

[ready2fly]

Our original intent was to wait until I was in my first flying job outside of instructing.

I'm just about to finish my CFI rating - haven't even begun to instruct yet - and our first baby is due on December 17th.

We made the decision to go ahead and add to our family (which currently consist of me, my wife, two dogs and three cats) a little early and I have no regrets whatsoever.

It will probably delay my CFI-ing full time for a few months until my wife can go back to work, but it's all good. I'll get there when I get there.

Best of luck to you and your wife!

R2F

[Tim]

If you wait until you can afford it then it will never happen...Kids more expensive by the day..

[Cosmo1999]

I say wait til you actually have enough senority to be able to enjoy your family

[Bandit_Driver]

ready2fly, amber, and everyone else.
Thanks for all your input. You all have given me a lot of info to consider and I think I was just being a little overcautious.