my training so far at dca - Page 3

hobo · September 30th, 2005, 21:47

well the simple answer is no. as DCA is right now i cannot recommend them.

thats the short answer now the long winded stuff
this past week there(hopefully one of my last) i again didnt get much done. ive been trying to finish up my csel for a month. ive flown less than 10 days this past month b/c of dca scheduling crap and instructor issues. that sounds really bad but its been a normal month here. i fly about every 1/3 day even tho im full time.

there are a couple of serious reasons i would not recommend them. the first is the cost. there are many excellent schools and fbos with better planes that cost less.

second most of the advertising you see is crap. the 62k advertised price is if you complete the program in about 170 hours total time. im passed 150 and have been told by group leaders that im doing extremely well. most people tend to finish the program between 200 and 250 hours. now you say well 30 hours isnt that much over but realize that 30 hours in a 172 here is done in 20 flights and would cost $5268. you can read above about my spending here. the concensus i have from the students and instructors i have talked with is that $75000 is about average with most people between 72 and 80 from 0 time to mei.

now a month or so ago i did say i thought the training was better. hmmm. i dont want to offend any cfis at dca, there are plenty of good instructors. i have met some that are less stellar. overall i would say that you could go to almost any fbo and find an instructor that is just as good as any at DCA.

i will be leaving DCA upon my completion of csel in order to go to most likely sunstate aviation. after touring some more schools like atp and regional sunstate beat them hands down.

does DCA work for some people? yup i just bought some books from a guy whos leaving for Mesa airlines.

does being airline owned make a difference? yes. it makes the school a lot more expensive for absolutely no return. the planes i have flown at dca suck and should be replaced or at least refurbed. most fbos charge less for a 172 sp with a garmin 1000 than dca charges for a 172 p from 1982 that when you fly in the rain it leaks on your head.

i think ive ranted enough. oh and yeah i was on track to spend more at DCA than i did at cornell university. ridiculous that dca costs more than an ivy league college.

DE727UPS · September 30th, 2005, 22:20

"yup i just bought some books from a guy whos leaving for Mesa airlines"

Dude...anyone with a pulse can get hired at Mesa.

"does being airline owned make a difference? yes. it makes the school a lot more expensive for absolutely no return"

HAHA....that's a good one. I like that.

Hey. Did anyone go to that DCA marketing meeting up at Comair on the 22nd. The one where real Comair pilots were going to say how great going to DCA is and how great the industry is, so get in NOW. I've been hearing rumors about furloughs at Comair as a result of the DL bankruptcy.

hobo · September 30th, 2005, 23:04

"anyone with a pulse" sigh this guy was a good pilot from what i understand he was supposed to go to comair til they put on the hiring freeze. comair is trying to not furlough and they have a hiring freeze til december.

abcd · September 30th, 2005, 23:05

727 here you go again. "anyone with a pulse can get hired at Mesa" you are a nice guy. You seem to have a talent at putting people and achievments down. I bet that would make that guy who got hired by them feel great about himself. You say you are here to help people out but you do alot of bashing of others in your quest to save the uninformed. You fly for UPS....that's great but no reason to act better than others. As far as Hobo goes thanks for the honesty in your posts. I am sorry things haven't worked out for you although flying every third day doesn't make much sence...they are supposed to have two events a day...that could go unnoticed for a day or two but not a month without anyone in management doing something. That stinks for you though. It's amazing how quicky opinions change....last month you had nine out of ten instructors at dca you liked...and said that if you had an issue you could change the next day...what happened? Why didn't you get an instructor change or talk to the leaders? Getting no return? Read some of you previous posts about how safe you feel and how good groundschool is and the busy airports you fly in and out of...I'd say you got something out of your experience. Good luck in the future where ever you end up.

hobo · September 30th, 2005, 23:42

i mostly just realized that i wasnt respecting the ability of an fbo to be a good school. not that the training at dca is bad just that its not magically better than everywhere else. ive had a really good instructor this month just met a few instructors while back seating flights that really made me wonder. i had a lot of down time b/c my instructor had trouble getting standzed in the arrow. ive also met instructors outside of the school that were excellent and kind of cut down the ego i had going with dca.

DE727UPS · October 1st, 2005, 00:48

"I bet that would make that guy who got hired by them feel great about himself."

The guy went to Mesa for a reason. They are not going to furlough and they offered him a job. I'm sure he feels fine about his new job and he could care less about what I say. Actually, it could be a great move for him if the others aren't hiring. Perhaps I should have used one of those sarcasm tag thingys ref my pulse statement. But I do feel like Mesa is towards the bottom of the pack when it comes to how they operate. Why should their hiring practices be any different and how they treat their pilots be any different? I just helped a buddy of mine from Mesa get on at UPS...I could tell you some of his stories if you'd like. Maybe that would make the guy "feel great about himself".

"You say you are here to help people out but you do alot of bashing of others in your quest to save the uninformed. You fly for UPS....that's great but no reason to act better than others."

I'm acting better than others how? I'm trying to make sure people look past the marketing and take a second look at their decision to go to a big academy when entering this career field. If said second look is good enough for them, then more power to 'em. I applaud guys like hobo who have the balls to come around here and say what they think when it could result in problems for them if someone knew who they were....if you know what I mean.

abcd. you seem to think that because I'm a successful major airline pilot, I should just encourage everyone no matter what. While I'd love to be the person you want me to be, I have a real problem with certain things in this industry. Big academy marketing is one of them and until that changes, I'm not gonna be the happy "nice guy" you seek.

abcd · October 1st, 2005, 01:36

727...when have I ever said you should encourage everyone no matter what. I think you should keep your personal opinions to yourself about things like someone getting hired...that's something to be proud of not walked on. If my memory serves me correctly it wasn't all that long ago that UPS wasn't looked at as such a great flying job to have compared to the rest of the industry..obviously things changed. Talking about the academy and flight schools are one thing but you do nothing but loose credibility and respect I have for you when you make comments like that.... I think the industry is awful right now and there is no way I ever want a child of mine to become a professional pilot....things seem out of control these days and it's just not what it once was.

DE727UPS · October 1st, 2005, 02:00

"but you do nothing but loose credibility and respect I have for you when you make comments like that...."

I don't base my comments on what anybody thinks of me. That goes from Doug down to abcd. Whether you respect me, or think I'm credible, makes no difference to me. I guess that's why it's called an opinon. I got one, you got one. It's up to the reader to decide who to listen too.

"I think the industry is awful right now and there is no way I ever want a child of mine to become a professional pilot"

That said, don't you think DCA should tone down it's marketing a bit?

SteveC · October 1st, 2005, 09:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by abcd

...but you do nothing but loose credibility and respect...

[GGSI*]

"lose" not "loose"

[/GGSI*]

*GGSI = Grammar Goon Squad Irregulars

September 30th, 2005, 21:47	#51
hobo Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 66	well the simple answer is no. as DCA is right now i cannot recommend them. thats the short answer now the long winded stuff this past week there(hopefully one of my last) i again didnt get much done. ive been trying to finish up my csel for a month. ive flown less than 10 days this past month b/c of dca scheduling crap and instructor issues. that sounds really bad but its been a normal month here. i fly about every 1/3 day even tho im full time. there are a couple of serious reasons i would not recommend them. the first is the cost. there are many excellent schools and fbos with better planes that cost less. second most of the advertising you see is crap. the 62k advertised price is if you complete the program in about 170 hours total time. im passed 150 and have been told by group leaders that im doing extremely well. most people tend to finish the program between 200 and 250 hours. now you say well 30 hours isnt that much over but realize that 30 hours in a 172 here is done in 20 flights and would cost $5268. you can read above about my spending here. the concensus i have from the students and instructors i have talked with is that $75000 is about average with most people between 72 and 80 from 0 time to mei. now a month or so ago i did say i thought the training was better. hmmm. i dont want to offend any cfis at dca, there are plenty of good instructors. i have met some that are less stellar. overall i would say that you could go to almost any fbo and find an instructor that is just as good as any at DCA. i will be leaving DCA upon my completion of csel in order to go to most likely sunstate aviation. after touring some more schools like atp and regional sunstate beat them hands down. does DCA work for some people? yup i just bought some books from a guy whos leaving for Mesa airlines. does being airline owned make a difference? yes. it makes the school a lot more expensive for absolutely no return. the planes i have flown at dca suck and should be replaced or at least refurbed. most fbos charge less for a 172 sp with a garmin 1000 than dca charges for a 172 p from 1982 that when you fly in the rain it leaks on your head. i think ive ranted enough. oh and yeah i was on track to spend more at DCA than i did at cornell university. ridiculous that dca costs more than an ivy league college. __________________ for anyone out there looking to go to college go to a state school like ohio state big enough name to be recognized but financial aid to help you. big named private schools only cost more if youre unsure of what you want to do.

September 30th, 2005, 23:04	#53
hobo Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 66	"anyone with a pulse" sigh this guy was a good pilot from what i understand he was supposed to go to comair til they put on the hiring freeze. comair is trying to not furlough and they have a hiring freeze til december. __________________ for anyone out there looking to go to college go to a state school like ohio state big enough name to be recognized but financial aid to help you. big named private schools only cost more if youre unsure of what you want to do.

September 30th, 2005, 23:42	#55
hobo Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 66	i mostly just realized that i wasnt respecting the ability of an fbo to be a good school. not that the training at dca is bad just that its not magically better than everywhere else. ive had a really good instructor this month just met a few instructors while back seating flights that really made me wonder. i had a lot of down time b/c my instructor had trouble getting standzed in the arrow. ive also met instructors outside of the school that were excellent and kind of cut down the ego i had going with dca. __________________ for anyone out there looking to go to college go to a state school like ohio state big enough name to be recognized but financial aid to help you. big named private schools only cost more if youre unsure of what you want to do.

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September 30th, 2005, 22:20	#52
DE727UPS Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 6,522	"yup i just bought some books from a guy whos leaving for Mesa airlines" Dude...anyone with a pulse can get hired at Mesa. "does being airline owned make a difference? yes. it makes the school a lot more expensive for absolutely no return" HAHA....that's a good one. I like that. Hey. Did anyone go to that DCA marketing meeting up at Comair on the 22nd. The one where real Comair pilots were going to say how great going to DCA is and how great the industry is, so get in NOW. I've been hearing rumors about furloughs at Comair as a result of the DL bankruptcy.

September 30th, 2005, 23:05	#54
abcd Newbie Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 13	727 here you go again. "anyone with a pulse can get hired at Mesa" you are a nice guy. You seem to have a talent at putting people and achievments down. I bet that would make that guy who got hired by them feel great about himself. You say you are here to help people out but you do alot of bashing of others in your quest to save the uninformed. You fly for UPS....that's great but no reason to act better than others. As far as Hobo goes thanks for the honesty in your posts. I am sorry things haven't worked out for you although flying every third day doesn't make much sence...they are supposed to have two events a day...that could go unnoticed for a day or two but not a month without anyone in management doing something. That stinks for you though. It's amazing how quicky opinions change....last month you had nine out of ten instructors at dca you liked...and said that if you had an issue you could change the next day...what happened? Why didn't you get an instructor change or talk to the leaders? Getting no return? Read some of you previous posts about how safe you feel and how good groundschool is and the busy airports you fly in and out of...I'd say you got something out of your experience. Good luck in the future where ever you end up.

October 1st, 2005, 00:48	#56
DE727UPS Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 6,522	"I bet that would make that guy who got hired by them feel great about himself." The guy went to Mesa for a reason. They are not going to furlough and they offered him a job. I'm sure he feels fine about his new job and he could care less about what I say. Actually, it could be a great move for him if the others aren't hiring. Perhaps I should have used one of those sarcasm tag thingys ref my pulse statement. But I do feel like Mesa is towards the bottom of the pack when it comes to how they operate. Why should their hiring practices be any different and how they treat their pilots be any different? I just helped a buddy of mine from Mesa get on at UPS...I could tell you some of his stories if you'd like. Maybe that would make the guy "feel great about himself". "You say you are here to help people out but you do alot of bashing of others in your quest to save the uninformed. You fly for UPS....that's great but no reason to act better than others." I'm acting better than others how? I'm trying to make sure people look past the marketing and take a second look at their decision to go to a big academy when entering this career field. If said second look is good enough for them, then more power to 'em. I applaud guys like hobo who have the balls to come around here and say what they think when it could result in problems for them if someone knew who they were....if you know what I mean. abcd. you seem to think that because I'm a successful major airline pilot, I should just encourage everyone no matter what. While I'd love to be the person you want me to be, I have a real problem with certain things in this industry. Big academy marketing is one of them and until that changes, I'm not gonna be the happy "nice guy" you seek.

October 1st, 2005, 01:36	#57
abcd Newbie Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 13	727...when have I ever said you should encourage everyone no matter what. I think you should keep your personal opinions to yourself about things like someone getting hired...that's something to be proud of not walked on. If my memory serves me correctly it wasn't all that long ago that UPS wasn't looked at as such a great flying job to have compared to the rest of the industry..obviously things changed. Talking about the academy and flight schools are one thing but you do nothing but loose credibility and respect I have for you when you make comments like that.... I think the industry is awful right now and there is no way I ever want a child of mine to become a professional pilot....things seem out of control these days and it's just not what it once was.

October 1st, 2005, 02:00	#58
DE727UPS Old Skool Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 6,522	"but you do nothing but loose credibility and respect I have for you when you make comments like that...." I don't base my comments on what anybody thinks of me. That goes from Doug down to abcd. Whether you respect me, or think I'm credible, makes no difference to me. I guess that's why it's called an opinon. I got one, you got one. It's up to the reader to decide who to listen too. "I think the industry is awful right now and there is no way I ever want a child of mine to become a professional pilot" That said, don't you think DCA should tone down it's marketing a bit?