Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops?

swimbody · January 11th, 2007, 11:17

I'm a right seater over at Simuflite. I have 1100tt and 100MEL. I won't sell my soul for $20000 a year at some regional. I live in the Dallas area, right next to Addison. Anyone you know of that I could talk to would be much appreciated.

Keebler · January 11th, 2007, 14:18

Hey Swimbody,

I don't have any leads for you, but welcome to JC and let me ask you this.

I'm over here in Ft. Worth wrapping up my commercial certificate. I've still got a couple of months left to go at my current rate and I'd like to CFI for a while, but a buddy of mine mentioned this program to me as a great way to get some experience while CFIing elsewhere. At least I think it was Simuflite.

Can you elaborate on how it works and your opinion of the program.

Cheers

Keebler

swimbody · January 11th, 2007, 16:32

Thanks for the welcome. Simuflite is an elite level corporate recurrency and initial training facility. Its super busy round the clock. The DFW facility has approx. 40 full motion simulators plus a handful of FTDs. Because there are crews that may only have one pilot for one pilot aircraft, like the King Air, the Slowtation, etc... they need to have a backup pilot to get through the hellish checkrides they must pass to be legal for an ATP or an initial checkout. The rides are frought with emergencies that would kill someone by himself. Its doable, but lots of work and just not safe. That's where I come in. I'm trained in the systems and the plane and I become his wingman so to speak.

Most guys don't head over to Simuflite until they're into their 700s or so. I didn't come over here until I was over 1000tt and 100ME.

I'm flying with someone who has 550 hours or so and he's a great kid, but he's having problems sometimes with getting behind the airplane and that's the real problem with low hour pilots. He's also never instructed and it shows. I recommend to become an instructor and learn by teaching. There is no other classroom like it and when you're done with instructing...move on over to airplanes you'll be ready for. I instruct a man who has 350 hours and he just slapped a PT6A-35 on the nose of his Piper Malibu. I think he's high, ok. So far behind the airplane and he's convinced its just for VFR travel. He thinks that money buys experience. If he lives to see 500 hours I'll be blown away.

Everyone wants to go faster...Cirrus suffered 10 losses in October due to this obsession with speed and inexperience.

Anyways, I recommend building more time so that you can handle any hold, any weather and any approach we throw at you at Simuflite. Back in the good old days you usually were flying a powerful plane after 20 hours in a crop duster, then it was off to heavy bomber training. Sounds like fun, but if you look at the losses suffered as a result of inexperience, its appalling at the unnecessary loss of life. Things changed in the 70s and 80s for the better and now things are safer for a reason.

The thing I tell every person that I instructed who came into the school where I taught is to be patient. Take your time and instruct and get over a thousand hours or so and you'll look back and be so glad you did. I was. And this is just my story so I know there are lots of guys out there who lucked out with flying their Dad's GIV with his pilot when he got his multi at 160 hours. I'm doing this the honest way and I'm learning boat loads in the process. My instructor in the King Air had something like 20,000 hours plus 5000 in the King Air. Man he was thorough.

Good luck to you.

dieselman1220 · January 11th, 2007, 16:42

My company is sending me up to Simuflite at DFW in a few days for some sim sessions in the Westwind, maybe ill see you there.

n57flyguy · January 11th, 2007, 18:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by dieselman1220

My company is sending me up to Simuflite at DFW in a few days for some sim sessions in the Westwind, maybe ill see you there.

So you decided to get the Westwind?!!!!

swimbody · January 12th, 2007, 00:06

Dieselman, you'll probably be with L. Metzger for some of the sim. He's a very knowledgeable instructor and he has a lot of time in the Westwind. You'll have a blast. If you haven't been here before there is a full service cafeteria onsite for breakfast and lunch so you don't need to hustle out for lunch. Its a busy place. Have fun.

Texasspilot · January 12th, 2007, 00:28

all the king air places I saw in ADS and around dallas wanted 1500 to sit right seat, I believe theres a few over at meacham and I've heard of a bunch at redbird. Might be worth walking around with some resumes.

I just had a couple of friends get hired on at seven bar out of DAL but they were all higher time with previous 135.

How do most of the instructors like teachin there? I fly a BE90 now and thought that instructing there might be a pretty ok gig and a good way to get back to Dallas.

PositionAndHold · January 12th, 2007, 00:56

Network...network.....network. I know it sounds old but it's they way to go. If you were out in SoCal and knew some people you'd be able to find a right seat job no problem. (Seems like King airs are every where, in VNY atleast) You already have over a 1000 hours. So if the mins where higher, and you knew some one, I bet with your training back ground it would be a simple call to the insurance company. They will lower the mins for all types of reasons. They just keep the mins where they want them. Most of the time the policy holder has some room to change stuff. Think about the people with lower times that you're training, they got insurance right. The insurance companies still want the business. And I'm sure you are making great connections where your at. Suprised you would have to look very far at all.

Hope this helps a little.

P N H

swimbody · January 12th, 2007, 08:59

Haven't been there for very long so I'm chompin' at the bit. I did send out four resumes yesterday, one to Seven Bar. I didn't know that insurance companies would bend for 135 operations. I'm assuming that some of those charter operations are Part 91 and that's true, you can make a simple call and voila, you're approved. It depends on the risk. Everyone I've spoken with has been real positive. Now for you guys who fly King Airs, how often are you flying? I'd love to stay busy and fly as often as possible. Sort of like putting on the blinders and going for a year or so straight. As an instructor, it was how I got through those hellish summers here in Texas. For the last few months my flight time has plummeted only because I have not been in a salaried postition.

Next week, I'm going to some of these places in person and once they see I don't have mustard stains on my shirt and that I'm not 300 lbs may help things out.

NJA_Capt · January 12th, 2007, 11:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by swimbody

...like the King Air, the Slowtation, etc

That's funny!!! You're flying a King Air (sim) and calling a Citation Slow.

JDE · January 12th, 2007, 11:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by swimbody

Next week, I'm going to some of these places in person and once they see I don't have mustard stains on my shirt and that I'm not 300 lbs may help things out.

Welcome to the board! Former right seater here, from the Falcon program. There are other current and former right seaters on the board. The few contacts I had back in Dallas/Ft. Worth are pretty much gone now (since I've moved), but I'd like to get back to the area one of these days. Let me know if you come across any Falcon ops when you check out some of those places. Thanks!

Texasspilot · January 12th, 2007, 13:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by NJA_Capt

That's funny!!! You're flying a King Air (sim) and calling a Citation Slow.

NJA any insight on how long interviews are takin to get there at NJA?

I'll be applying in 40 hours!

swimbody · January 12th, 2007, 14:37

I was referring to the Citation I and II. A buddy of mine just crowed all around the barnyard about his precious jet and how high they could climb. I'm not referring to anything over those models of course, the Citation X cruises around at .92 max. I didn't mean disrespect. Just funning, pa.

It is funny though that two planes, a King Air B200 and a Citation II left at the same time for South Carolina from Dallas. The Citation left first and arrived :10 minutes ahead of the King Air. One spent all that time climbing, the other was cooking along at FL200. I digress.

I've flown now out of the sim too. I love the King Air for short hauls. Just one contact so far. Thanks for the support from everyone.

And Falcon guy, I'll look around. Where are you now?

NJA_Capt · January 12th, 2007, 14:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texasspilot

NJA any insight on how long interviews are takin to get there at NJA?

From what I am hearing/reading; several months at best.

dieselman1220 · January 12th, 2007, 18:38

I second the networking post thats is how i got where I am friend of a friend type deal. And dont worry about the hours Im only at about 1100/300 and flying alot bigger equipment than King Airs. It really is all about who you know dont give up on it. Hell if you are willing to drive to Houston we sometimes need contract co pilots for our 200 all you need is a commercial multi instrument.

dieselman1220 · January 12th, 2007, 22:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by n57flyguy

So you decided to get the Westwind?!!!!

Im sorry I dont understand your question/comment ???

p.s. Thanks for the tip on the food situation swimbody

tinman · January 12th, 2007, 23:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by swimbody

I'm a right seater over at Simuflite. I have 1100tt and 100MEL. I won't sell my soul for $20000 a year at some regional. I live in the Dallas area, right next to Addison. Anyone you know of that I could talk to would be much appreciated.

I'm not much help with the job search, but I should be down next month for the Beechjet initial. How long for that? Maybe I'll see you there.

swimbody · January 13th, 2007, 00:20

Man, that sim is fantastic. Brand new machine. You'll love it so much you'll never want to stop doing all those V1 cuts. I'm going to stay around Simuflite for a while. They have a scholarship fund for right seaters that kicks in after 500 hours of volunteer time. I get to choose a type rating in one of these planes: a Citation 5 series, a Beechjet 400 or a Lear 35. I'm picking the Beech because the electrical systems are so close to the King Air. Once a Beech, well you know. I'm pooped. I was in the sim for 6 hours today. Wiped out. Got yet another 4000 hour cargo jockey his initial checkout ride completed.

MFT1Air · January 13th, 2007, 10:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by dieselman1220

I second the networking post thats is how i got where I am friend of a friend type deal. And dont worry about the hours Im only at about 1100/300 and flying alot bigger equipment than King Airs. It really is all about who you know dont give up on it. Hell if you are willing to drive to Houston we sometimes need contract co pilots for our 200 all you need is a commercial multi instrument.

. . .and a couple of friends are waiting for your call.

n57flyguy · January 14th, 2007, 09:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by dieselman1220

Im sorry I dont understand your question/comment ???

p.s. Thanks for the tip on the food situation swimbody

I screwed up, I cross refrenced another forum who had a similar username. My bad

PoeMan · January 14th, 2007, 13:30

Fellow right seater here...
Falcon 20 and Falcon 50.

Quote:

Originally Posted by swimbody

I'm going to stay around Simuflite for a while.

They have a scholarship fund for right seaters that kicks in after 500 hours of volunteer time.

>> Do stay around awhile, add some more aircraft (1 or 2) and sit in on some special classes if you get the time...

>> Do not let them blow smoke up your butt. They have a scholarship program for those enrolled with Univ (I think UAA members). They don't have a scholarship for right-seaters... You simply have to put your time in and hope that when you do get a lot of time (I've put in nearly 400 hours in almost a year and a half) you talk to the right people on the right day...

You are correct in a few of your thoughts and I think you're on the right track, I'll talk to you more a little later...

gotta go sim right now...

PositionAndHold · January 14th, 2007, 16:56

Quote:

I get to choose a type rating in one of these planes: a Citation 5 series, a Beechjet 400 or a Lear 35. I'm picking the Beech because the electrical systems are so close to the King Air. Once a Beech, well you know

Dude get the 35 type. I f I remeber right it's good for the 24, 25, 31, 35, and maybe the 55. Your learning advacned systems now any way. Another electrical system is no big deal. Plus there are probably way more a/c in the lear catagory then there are beechjets. Just a thought any way.

P N H

Texasspilot · January 14th, 2007, 18:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by PositionAndHold

Dude get the 35 type. I f I remeber right it's good for the 24, 25, 31, 35, and maybe the 55. Your learning advacned systems now any way. Another electrical system is no big deal. Plus there are probably way more a/c in the lear catagory then there are beechjets. Just a thought any way.

P N H

...plus...do you really wanna have to fly a beechjet?

swimbody · January 14th, 2007, 18:52

Come to think of it, I agree, the lear is a better plane to get because of the wide array of planes. But that may be a year away. Oh well. I agree, the Beechjet is just one aircraft. Go Chargers!!!!

NJA_Capt · January 15th, 2007, 16:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by swimbody

Come to think of it, I agree, the lear is a better plane to get because of the wide array of planes.

Although the LRJet type may have more "cool points," the Ce500 type covers more usable aircraft. More Ce500 series are flying than Lears, and half of those Lears (23, 24, 25) aren't being widely used because of RVSM and high operating cost. You are more likely to be hired with 0 time in type in a Citation than you would with 0 time in a Lear.

January 11th, 2007, 11:17	#1
swimbody Newbie Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 21	Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? I'm a right seater over at Simuflite. I have 1100tt and 100MEL. I won't sell my soul for $20000 a year at some regional. I live in the Dallas area, right next to Addison. Anyone you know of that I could talk to would be much appreciated.

January 11th, 2007, 14:18	#2
Keebler Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 145	Re: Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? Hey Swimbody, I don't have any leads for you, but welcome to JC and let me ask you this. I'm over here in Ft. Worth wrapping up my commercial certificate. I've still got a couple of months left to go at my current rate and I'd like to CFI for a while, but a buddy of mine mentioned this program to me as a great way to get some experience while CFIing elsewhere. At least I think it was Simuflite. Can you elaborate on how it works and your opinion of the program. Cheers Keebler

January 11th, 2007, 16:32	#3
swimbody Newbie Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 21	Re: Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? Thanks for the welcome. Simuflite is an elite level corporate recurrency and initial training facility. Its super busy round the clock. The DFW facility has approx. 40 full motion simulators plus a handful of FTDs. Because there are crews that may only have one pilot for one pilot aircraft, like the King Air, the Slowtation, etc... they need to have a backup pilot to get through the hellish checkrides they must pass to be legal for an ATP or an initial checkout. The rides are frought with emergencies that would kill someone by himself. Its doable, but lots of work and just not safe. That's where I come in. I'm trained in the systems and the plane and I become his wingman so to speak. Most guys don't head over to Simuflite until they're into their 700s or so. I didn't come over here until I was over 1000tt and 100ME. I'm flying with someone who has 550 hours or so and he's a great kid, but he's having problems sometimes with getting behind the airplane and that's the real problem with low hour pilots. He's also never instructed and it shows. I recommend to become an instructor and learn by teaching. There is no other classroom like it and when you're done with instructing...move on over to airplanes you'll be ready for. I instruct a man who has 350 hours and he just slapped a PT6A-35 on the nose of his Piper Malibu. I think he's high, ok. So far behind the airplane and he's convinced its just for VFR travel. He thinks that money buys experience. If he lives to see 500 hours I'll be blown away. Everyone wants to go faster...Cirrus suffered 10 losses in October due to this obsession with speed and inexperience. Anyways, I recommend building more time so that you can handle any hold, any weather and any approach we throw at you at Simuflite. Back in the good old days you usually were flying a powerful plane after 20 hours in a crop duster, then it was off to heavy bomber training. Sounds like fun, but if you look at the losses suffered as a result of inexperience, its appalling at the unnecessary loss of life. Things changed in the 70s and 80s for the better and now things are safer for a reason. The thing I tell every person that I instructed who came into the school where I taught is to be patient. Take your time and instruct and get over a thousand hours or so and you'll look back and be so glad you did. I was. And this is just my story so I know there are lots of guys out there who lucked out with flying their Dad's GIV with his pilot when he got his multi at 160 hours. I'm doing this the honest way and I'm learning boat loads in the process. My instructor in the King Air had something like 20,000 hours plus 5000 in the King Air. Man he was thorough. Good luck to you.

January 11th, 2007, 16:42	#4
dieselman1220 Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 56	Re: Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? My company is sending me up to Simuflite at DFW in a few days for some sim sessions in the Westwind, maybe ill see you there.

January 12th, 2007, 00:06	#6
swimbody Newbie Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 21	Re: Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? Dieselman, you'll probably be with L. Metzger for some of the sim. He's a very knowledgeable instructor and he has a lot of time in the Westwind. You'll have a blast. If you haven't been here before there is a full service cafeteria onsite for breakfast and lunch so you don't need to hustle out for lunch. Its a busy place. Have fun.

January 12th, 2007, 00:28	#7
Texasspilot Old Skool Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 2,080	Re: Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? all the king air places I saw in ADS and around dallas wanted 1500 to sit right seat, I believe theres a few over at meacham and I've heard of a bunch at redbird. Might be worth walking around with some resumes. I just had a couple of friends get hired on at seven bar out of DAL but they were all higher time with previous 135. How do most of the instructors like teachin there? I fly a BE90 now and thought that instructing there might be a pretty ok gig and a good way to get back to Dallas.

January 12th, 2007, 00:56	#8
PositionAndHold Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 208	Re: Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? Network...network.....network. I know it sounds old but it's they way to go. If you were out in SoCal and knew some people you'd be able to find a right seat job no problem. (Seems like King airs are every where, in VNY atleast) You already have over a 1000 hours. So if the mins where higher, and you knew some one, I bet with your training back ground it would be a simple call to the insurance company. They will lower the mins for all types of reasons. They just keep the mins where they want them. Most of the time the policy holder has some room to change stuff. Think about the people with lower times that you're training, they got insurance right. The insurance companies still want the business. And I'm sure you are making great connections where your at. Suprised you would have to look very far at all. Hope this helps a little. P N H

January 12th, 2007, 08:59	#9
swimbody Newbie Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 21	Re: Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? Haven't been there for very long so I'm chompin' at the bit. I did send out four resumes yesterday, one to Seven Bar. I didn't know that insurance companies would bend for 135 operations. I'm assuming that some of those charter operations are Part 91 and that's true, you can make a simple call and voila, you're approved. It depends on the risk. Everyone I've spoken with has been real positive. Now for you guys who fly King Airs, how often are you flying? I'd love to stay busy and fly as often as possible. Sort of like putting on the blinders and going for a year or so straight. As an instructor, it was how I got through those hellish summers here in Texas. For the last few months my flight time has plummeted only because I have not been in a salaried postition. Next week, I'm going to some of these places in person and once they see I don't have mustard stains on my shirt and that I'm not 300 lbs may help things out.

January 12th, 2007, 14:37	#13
swimbody Newbie Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 21	Re: Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? I was referring to the Citation I and II. A buddy of mine just crowed all around the barnyard about his precious jet and how high they could climb. I'm not referring to anything over those models of course, the Citation X cruises around at .92 max. I didn't mean disrespect. Just funning, pa. It is funny though that two planes, a King Air B200 and a Citation II left at the same time for South Carolina from Dallas. The Citation left first and arrived :10 minutes ahead of the King Air. One spent all that time climbing, the other was cooking along at FL200. I digress. I've flown now out of the sim too. I love the King Air for short hauls. Just one contact so far. Thanks for the support from everyone. And Falcon guy, I'll look around. Where are you now?

January 12th, 2007, 18:38	#15
dieselman1220 Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 56	Re: Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? I second the networking post thats is how i got where I am friend of a friend type deal. And dont worry about the hours Im only at about 1100/300 and flying alot bigger equipment than King Airs. It really is all about who you know dont give up on it. Hell if you are willing to drive to Houston we sometimes need contract co pilots for our 200 all you need is a commercial multi instrument.

January 13th, 2007, 00:20	#18
swimbody Newbie Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 21	Re: Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? Man, that sim is fantastic. Brand new machine. You'll love it so much you'll never want to stop doing all those V1 cuts. I'm going to stay around Simuflite for a while. They have a scholarship fund for right seaters that kicks in after 500 hours of volunteer time. I get to choose a type rating in one of these planes: a Citation 5 series, a Beechjet 400 or a Lear 35. I'm picking the Beech because the electrical systems are so close to the King Air. Once a Beech, well you know. I'm pooped. I was in the sim for 6 hours today. Wiped out. Got yet another 4000 hour cargo jockey his initial checkout ride completed.

January 14th, 2007, 18:52	#24
swimbody Newbie Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 21	Re: Know of any King Airs that need co-pilots for 135 ops? Come to think of it, I agree, the lear is a better plane to get because of the wide array of planes. But that may be a year away. Oh well. I agree, the Beechjet is just one aircraft. Go Chargers!!!!

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